Hand/block plane storage


This may be a stupid question, although I hope not: what's the best way to store hand/block planes?
I've a few asstd. ones I've always kept stored on their sides on a shelf. Many years ago, at school, they were stored upright which always seemed wrong to me. Wouldn't that be more likely to result in dulled/damaged blades? The reason I ask is 'cos I friend of mine (a fellow woodworker with quite a few more years experience than I) borrowed my "workshop" and put them back upright.
When I asked him about it, he said it made no difference, that on a properly adjusted plane the heel protects the blade.
I don't know, I'm not a plane afficiando and rarely use them. I prefer spokeshaves, even for scribing in, because they're so much more versatile! And I have more problems controlling the "roll" planes, but Ssssh! Don't spread that around. ;]
Still, it seems to me that on a properly adjusted blade the heel should be /flush/ with the blade and if it should be carelessly put down on a vagrant nail or whatever it could easily be damaged. Am I wrong? What's the consensus?
Not that it makes any difference to me... I'll probably persevere with my way anyway; it's become force of habit. [shrug]
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I lay my planes (all 3, soon to be more--yeah!) right side up on a piece of rust preventative paper that came with one of the planes. The sit in a cabinet, on a shelf that's head high. I find it awkward to grab them if they are laying on their sides. I carefully place them, and have found zero issues with dullness. If they were to sit in a drawer, I'd not place them right side up--things slide around.
Dave
Andy McArdle wrote:

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Andy McArdle wrote:

I lay them on the side on the bench.
My storage shelf near the bench has a wooden strip that allows planes to be stored upright, with the blade not touching anything. My planes that are in a drawer are stored in plane socks, right side up, with the blades retracted.
Barry
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On Thu, 16 Jun 2005 00:42:13 +1000, "Andy McArdle"

You're never going to get agreement on that one...

I never store block planes on their side. They're too narrow, they fall over. Instead I store them sole down, racking in rows on shelves along with my wooden moulders. To avoid resting the plane on its iron, simply fasten a thin strip of wood down across the shelf as a sole-rest.

When I use the plane, I put the iron on the timber and press downwards. I'm unconvinced by this "never rest a plane on its iron" dogma - especially for resting it on soft timber. Random benches with possible hardware on them are obviously different.
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to
Oh, I know that. I was wondering what other peoples views and the rationales behind them were, though.

Strewth, I can't believe I hadn't thought of that! Two replies out of three so far have mentioned it! It's too obvious. [sigh]
Methinks I'll fasten some strips for just that purpose tomorrow, although I doubt I'll start storing 'em upright. Ingrained habit and all that. Still, it'll make me feel happier for cases when others put 'em back upright.

The only time I use a plane is when the surface is too wide for a spokeshave and I want a level surface which, fortunately for me, is rarely. I don't mind resting the plane "on the job" as it were; if that damages the blade then I'm doing something a damned sight worse than just mishandling the plane.
Unfortunately, shelf-space is at a premium here (drawers aren't feasible) and just above eye-level so it's hard to be sure that there's not small pieces of hardware where they shouldn't be. Hence my concern.
- Andy
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I leave mine right side up. I figure that
1) The planes are going to be fine on the bench, it's the bench that may get cut up 2) If I knock the plane with something (like a clamp, or my hand), I'd rather have it hit the side of the plane than the blade. 3) If I can free up enough space right on the surface of the bench (i.e. no screws, metal, or wood I'd like to protect), it's probably time to clean my bench. This is the case more often than I'd like. :)
For storing them (as opposed to putting it down while I move something around), I intend to build a bit of a case that will hang on my slot-board wall, and will allow the planes to remain in a mostly vertical position. Leaving a little unsupported area in the middle, so the blades won't actually be resting on anything. Right now, my planes are stored on my workbench, which bugs me, but not enough to do something about it.
BTW, as far as your buddy's explanation that the heel of a properly adjusted plane protects the blade, I'd disagree. I may be wrong on this, but the sole of my plane is as flat as I can make it. This means that the only point on the underside of the plane that sticks out is the blade itself. It's not like a powered jointer, where there are two co-planar surfaces, with the infeed table lower than the outfeed.
Clint

way
shelf.
three
I
Still,
spokeshave
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As an alternate view, some that use Japanese planes suggest planing some of the wood on the sole, so the sole touches the wood in 4 places:
Front Right before the iron (I think) Right after the iron Heel
This is done to reduce friction. I think some do this for joiner planes. I think they even sell a plane to use on the sole of wooden planes.
But in that case, the blade is still not protected. I retract the blade during storage.
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On 15 Jun 2005 19:55:45 GMT, Bruce Barnett

Possibly. Mainly though it's done to allow the plane to be controlled. A Japanese plane is pulled, and the way you weight the two ends of the plane is _crucial_ to its correct operation. By shifting your weight between the two ends of the plane, in conjunction with this slightly hollowed sole, you can control the cut. You can't do this on a Western plane that you're pushing - you don't have your body positioned right to allow enough control.
You can tell if you're doing it right by _listening_ to how a Japanese plane sounds when it cuts.
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wrote:

I'll look into these... it sounds as though they'll be more "intuitive" in use for me. It's for similar reasons I prefer spokeshaves; by pulling I have better control over all 3 axis of rotation and listening to the cut provides feedback. It almost becomes an extension of my arm, whereas a plane is just another inanimate lump in my hands. [sigh]
The same applies to saws. Two of my most treasured items are an old japanese flush-saw and their version of a tenon saw. Both are pulled rather pushed and I use them for all my fine & accurate cuts. My western saws (more antiques... inherited from my gramps) tend to be used for the rougher work (eg. framing, ripping) where accuracy is not an issue.
'Tis a pity that the japanese tools cost so much more than their western equivalents, here in Australia anyway, else they'd be way up on my wish list.
- Andy.
It's for the same re
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On Thu, 16 Jun 2005 17:05:59 +1000, "Andy McArdle"

I'm not sure they do - the Japanese tools I buy here in the UK are comparably priced to Western tools _of_similar_quality_. Japanese chisels cost more, saws cost less, planes cost less.

How about Chinese pull planes (even more spokeshave like) ? You have HNT Gordon making good Chinese-style planes at reasonable UK prices, and they're based in Australia so they shoudl be even cheaper for you.
If you're interested in Japanese tools, I thoroughly recommed reading Toshio Odate's book.
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wrote:

I've just done a bit of research into local suppliers and have to admit that the prices have dropped way down compared to what they were the last time I seriously went shopping a few years ago. The chisels are still some 200%+ more expensive, but the pull saws are now marketing at roughly the same price.
It's more difficult to compare the prices for planes as they're too different, having completely different blade angles, etc.
But comparing by sizes, a 14" Hira-Kanna (roughly a #5 jack) is still roughly double the cost of a HNT, Irwin or Veritas #5, although only half the price of a Lie-Nielson or Clifton. I'm not sure which "level of quality" to compare it to, not having one to take for a test scrape.

I hadn't realised there was such a beast, it's something I hadn't thought about. Just had a look at the site and a nice Ironwood smoothing plane w/TS blade is priced at AUS$187. That's about... 80 pound UK isn't it?

Methinks I'll do just that; I'm fairly sure that one of my dovetailing chisels is a Toshio Odate. I wonder if it's the same bloke?
I can't say that I'm interested in Japanese tools per se, but if I come across a new (to me) hand-tool that's easier to use for a particular job than one I've been using for years, well... that's what budgets are for. <G>
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On Fri, 17 Jun 2005 00:34:04 +1000, "Andy McArdle"

Probably. He's not a toolmaker, but he's well enough known that he might have put his name to a "signature range". He also has a book on shoji making (his original apprenticed trade) and that needs all manner of fine joinery, with specialist chisels to match.

Pull saws - I wouldn't be without. From the azerbiki (curved belly, good for stopped cuts) to my huge anahiki rip saw (half the thickness of my Western rip saws, so less effort)
I also like weird chisels, particularly the wedge-shaped dovetail corner cleaners, and the sideways cutting mortice-bottom cleaners.
As to planes, then a lot depends on what timber I'm working. I work ash and beech with Stanleys, mahogany and figured oak with my Norris. For the lighter timbers though; lime, cypress and cedar, I find the Japanese planes more approppriate.
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wrote:

He is. I googled for the book and ended up on a page linking the two. Now I have to buy the book just to complete the set. <G>

Agreed wholeheartedly. I've a dozuki(?) I use for dovetailing/fine trim and a kugihiki for flush cuts. I'd be lost without 'em. Hopefully a nice curved kataba for plunge cutting will find its' way into my toolbox. I /think/ I've got the names right?

That's what my Toshio Odate chisel is like. Perfect for 6mm dovetails.

I rarely need to use any timber apart from redgums, here in Oz "heritage" furniture is becoming popular again and fortunately for me it's my favourite wood. The grain tends to be rather irregular though, which is partly why I have trouble with planes. After hitting the HNT Gordon site I'm seriously considering placing an order... with the 60deg blade angles it seems to me that Terry Gordon has designed his planes around Aussie hardwoods and that's why they're so popular elsewhere for highly figured grains, etc.
Thanks for pointing me at him! :)
- Andy
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On Thu, 16 Jun 2005 00:42:13 +1000, "Andy McArdle"

I store mine on a shelf upright. However, the shelf is lined with that fairly heavy rubbery shelf lining pad material.
Dave Hall
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