Expensive Water Services Searches ?

[Andrew Mawson]

I have a field that rumour has it has several major water mains running under it. (Some are SE Water and some are Southern Water)

As I need to improve the drainage by re-instating field drains that have failed from decades of neglect, I contacted both companies to ask if they had accurate location plans so that I could ensure that I avoided them.

SE Water haven't deigned to respond yet, but Southern Water are telling me they will only vouchsafe the information if I pay them a fat fee. Surely this is wrong - certainly immoral. When I needed to know where UK Power Networks had buried cables on the farm they cheerfully sent out a man to mark out the cable runs, then presented me with a map f.o.c.

After all, all I'm trying to do is NOT disrupt their services :(

Andrew

[charles]

I hope they pay you for a wayleave to use your land.

[newshound]

And they know you have a big digger?

Well they have been warned!

[Adam Aglionby]

From a man who used to do that, and the billing for people who didn`t ask, for BT

Been advised that really want the full set of utilities to come out with their spray cans and mark what they know of.

Sure he told me there is some statuory obligation to do so, within limits of what their records indicate, actual position may be adrift and depth is never accurate.

[Adam Aglionby]

Asked said gent, statuory obligation to show where they enter your land bit more complex where they might run under for distance.

Did say should be able to find all major utilities maps online but take locations with a margin for error.

[Brian Gaff]

Metal detector, deviner perhaps? I've actually seen, many years ago a person from a utility company using a water deviner to help locate services and marking them in different colours according to what they were. I was fascinated at the time but probably never see them doing this nowadays, probably throw technology at it costing megabucks. Brian

[Mark Allread]

Not a particularly accurate way of doing it but... have you had a look at the wayleave/easements that would have been entered into and for which plans should have been attached? If you don't have copies with your deeds then just ask them for copies of the agreements - there may be a nominal charge for copying but it shouldn't be much. FoI request perhaps?

[Davey]

We had to replace a sewer line once, and the local gas company sent out a fella with one of those detector thingies, and he carefully marked where the pipe crossed our land. It all looked very professional. When the digger came along, he found that the marked line was six feet off where the pipe actually was. A good thing he was slow and careful.

[Andrew Mawson]

Yes I have wayleave plans dating back in some cases to pipes installed

1930's when the farm was owned by Hasting Water Board, albeit only A4 covering 10 acres, but I know that there are pipes that don't even feature on the way leaves as some cross a stream and are visible. I have a CAT underground services scanner but it looses the pipe only a few meters into the field as it is confused by 11kV 3 phase lines that run over head :( Also there is at least one 200 mm plastic pipe that obviously wouldn't show up with a cable avoidance scanner.

Because of it's previous ownership and history the place is riddled with pipes many of which are I'm sure now dormant. No doubt when owned by Hastings Water they just put them where ever they wanted without reference to anyone else. The farm was sold to the then tenant farmer under the leasehold reform act back in the late 1960's but they retained the adjacent site where there is still a SE Water pumping station.

Andrew

[Adam Aglionby]

"Arrange a viewing of a map

Alternatively, in accordance with the Water Industry Act (1991), members of the public may view the public sewer and water map.

Viewing is available at our Chatham office by appointment only from 9am until 4.30pm, Monday to Friday."

"Water mains maps are available for inspection free of charge at South East Water's..." cant find address on PDF

and phone cam.

[Mark Allread]

I'd be tempted to go in with a deep mole, avoid the 'plan' wayleaves and rip through the rest ;). That way you and they would know where they are and which are still in use ;)

Give them fair warning of course - say 48 hours to respond with accurate information - that's what they usually give when they are dishing it out :)

[Adam Aglionby]

Local Council archive might be useful

[Tim Watts]

Just realised, if you bust a pipe, it's possibly me you're going to cut off :)

[Andrew Mawson]

Well Tim I'll do my very best not to :) I suspect if I do I'll drain Darwell reservoir if not Powder Mill and Bewel as well - there are some big pipes around!

A little bit of progress, I rang Southern Water and whined a bit, and after a bit of tooing and frooing they've just come back and said that they'll release plans FOC. Still not heard a jot from SE Water, and frankly they are the biggest worry as their pipes are far more numerous here as their pumping station is our next door neighbour.

So SE Water are in my sights for Monday for a concentrated telephone assault taking no prisoners :)

Andrew

[Andrew Mawson]

Thanks for the Adam, I'll take a while to study it

Andrew

[Tim Watts]

On the plus side, I would expect big-arsed mains water pipes to be iron and thus detectable.

It's those gas pipe detectors that amaze me - no idea how they work!

[Robin]

IIRC the big boys use ground penetrating radar if the pipe has no tracer wire.

Come to think of it, surely that's something Andrew can now justify adding to his collection of mighty tools?

[Fredxxx]

And perhaps deeper than land drains?

[Andrew Mawson]

Well the local history states that the Romans had a harbour at the end of this very field, when the River Brede was navigable up to this point. Perhaps I can get Tony Robinson and the Time Team to to a geophys survey :)

Andrew