Shingles without felt?

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I was amazed to discover only wood under the shingles of my house, which was redone about fifteen years ago.
A neighbor said several roofers have told him that's the best way to do it, and he intends to nail his shingles directly to his planks in the future. Roofers have told him roofing felt shortens the life of shingles by causing them to get hotter in the day.
I don't believe the felt makes shingles hotter, but I wonder about moisture. Is it possible that in some circumstances, the layer of felt can make shingles more hospital to fungi?
Has anyone else heard the theory that it's better to skip the felt?
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Choreboy wrote:

BS. Use the felt.
Maybe I'm wrong, but I believe some manufacturers require felt or the warrantee is void.
--
Joseph Meehan

Dia duit
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===> ALL mfgs that I've looked at, plus ice rubber around here. He's either gettng BS or is testing out a BS idea. I can't beleive many people have said that! Asphalt et al shingles WILL NOT be guanranteed to keep water out without felt.

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The original roof on my house (Central Ohio, 1973) had no felt; after 32 years, four plywood panels had to be replaced with the new roof. I don't know if that's a lot or a little. The roof itself held up pretty well. The new roof has 15# felt.
--
Ron Hardin
snipped-for-privacy@mindspring.com
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Choreboy wrote:

Bottom line is to go with what the manufacturers say. I have never seen a bundle of shingles that didn't say right on it to use felt along with specific instructions on how the felt is to be applied.
Harry K
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Choreboy wrote:

I've also heard the theory that the world is flat.
The NY State Residential Code, based on the IRC with some minor revisions, requires underlayment. The manufacturers of every roofing shingle I've ever run across require underlayment.
Who exactly are these roofers that know more than the manufacturers and feel they can ignore code?
R
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RicodJour wrote:

I inherited the house my parents had inherited from my grandparents. Fifteen years ago they hired the roofer my grandfather had once hired. I think the roofer once had a good reputation, and his family still does.
The first time it snowed, my parents had leaking and found that he had violated the building code. He would not make repairs until they hired a lawyer.
Ever since, there have been occasional leaks in several rooms. They're hard to trace because they happen only under certain conditions (presumably wind direction and speed).
A week ago I discovered a hole in my roof. That's when I discovered the roofer had not used felt. Near the peak, between the chimney and the eave, the roofer had put in short planks without nailing them. They had fallen against the soffit, leaving enough of a dip for the shingles to leak. Down at the valley, the water from that leak had for fifteen years been rotting planks, rafters, and shingles.
I can't complain to the roofer. He ended up driving a taxi. He was murdered one night. The killer was assumed to be a robber. Maybe he was a homeowner.
When I mentioned the lack of felt to my never-wrong neighbor, he told me many roofers have told him that's the best way to do it. Should I ask his wife to tape a shingle over his mouth?
My roof has a 6-in-12 pitch. I plan to reroof myself. Does roofing felt provide decent footing? (Shingles with loose grit underfoot can make a guy a little uneasy.)
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Choreboy wrote:

No, of course not. Staple hammer.

6/12 is a walker, no big deal. Don't get nervous and don't make the mistake beginning rock climbers make. If you lean into the roof, you're putting outward force on your feet. Stay upright, wear the right footing, tie yourself off if your feel better or use a chicken ladder (not really necessary). Or you can use roof jacks. http://www.hometime.com/Howto/projects/roofing/roof_5.htm
If it's hot out the building paper rips more easily, so you want to make sure it's well stapled. Try to work in the shade or cooler parts of the day if possible.
R
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RicodJour wrote:

My BIL has exprience with shingles and will help me. He's busy, so I want to do as much as possible alone. If a staple hammer is a stapler swung like a hammer, he has one. He used nails to patch my roof with felt, so maybe he doesn't know about stapling felt as mentioned below.
Stapling sounds faster than nailing. What size staples should be used? How should they be positioned? If his staple hammer isn't available, would a stapler work?

My BIL's roof is probably 6/12. Years ago I helped him put metal on the north slope. Then I painted it with three coats. Then I installed and maintained an antenna mast, including lowering the mast to work on the amplifier. At that pitch, traction on the metal was unreliable, but I didn't mind because the roof broke to a lower pitch below. Traction on the shingled south slope began to worry me as the shingles deteriorated.

Don't you have to kneel, sit, or lie to work? A neighbor redid his 12/12 roof fifteen years ago. He used a piece of foam rubber for comfort and traction. It's rolled up on the joists of his garage. Is foam that old reliable for roof work?
In stepping off the eave onto a ladder a slip could be disastrous. Having the ladder long enough so I can stay upright and grab it near shoulder height seems to make the stepoff more foolproof. Where else is it important to stay upright?

I suppose soles shouldn't be stiff or slippery. Are there other requirements?

What's a chicken ladder? I have used a rope when working near eaves.

I like the idea. It would also provide a place for tools and bundles of shingles. Afterward, are the nail holes sealed with roofing cement?

In summer I try to stay out of the sun from 9 AM to 6 PM, or at least 10 to 5. That still leaves time for lots of shingles. Is nailing still the best way? Using asphalt to stick a nail to the face of the hammer sounds like a time saver. (My BIL told me that trick.)
The whole roof is about 20 squares. For now we're thinking of doing a section of five squares, separated by peaks from the rest of the roof. Does that sound good?
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On Tue, 12 Jul 2005 02:19:46 -0400, Choreboy

bigger and shot with a pnumatic gun. If you live in a place where the wind blows don't use staples! They are not even legal in Florida these days.
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snipped-for-privacy@aol.com wrote:

You are correct if referring to staples used to fasten the -shingles-. A standard t-50 tacker or swing tacker with standard staples is sufficient for the tarpaper. I haven't seen any roofer using a pneumatic gun for fastening the paper.
Harry K
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"Choreboy" < wrote

It's not a theory, it's a short cut commonly used by hacks.
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The roofer was formerly an ex-con and a used car salesman. Some people will say anything to save a buck They save the cost of a few rolls of felt, a few nails, and an hour of labor. Of course the homeowner still pays full price for the job. Felt has been used since men moved out of caves. I'd tell that lying son of a bitch roofer where to go, and also call City Hall, ask for the building inspections dept., and report these crooks for fraud. Then tell your neighbor he's been a victim of a scam.
On Sat, 09 Jul 2005 18:08:07 -0400, Choreboy

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snipped-for-privacy@notdivulged.com wrote:

Not fair. The roofing industry is not that bad. Ex-con maybe, but used car salesman is going too far. Besides, new car salesmen are just as bad.
--
Joseph Meehan

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wrote:

hair, a plaid coat and smiles while he talks? ...Ross
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On Sat, 09 Jul 2005 18:08:07 -0400, Choreboy

FWIW, I put an addition on my home about 16 years ago. At the time, I used some fiberglass shingles - I'm not going to mention the brand because I am not certain I remember it correctly. The manufacturer said to NOT use felt. It was a big mistake. They began to leak at 10 years (they were 25 year shingles) and I ended up stripping the thing. I re-roofed with IKO 30 year architectural asphalt shingles and put Grace Ice and Water Shield under the entire thing.
On the main part of the building, I had Bird asphalt shingles which were supposed to be 20 year shingles. They had been applied over felt. It's interesting to note that at 25 years, they still didn't leak at all.
As far as I'm concerned, any roofer who tells you not to use felt is simply wrong (a more polite way of saying what others have already told you). It doesn't raise the surface temperature - how could it, as it's buried under two layers of shingle? It offers limited protection, though. If you're in the North and have the money, you can use Grace or Bithuthene under all of it. If not, you ought to use it at least on the edges, as it provides a water seal even without a covering.
--
Larry
Email to rapp at lmr dot com
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If he is going against product recommendations you should report him to your city and DA
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This is Turtle.
Elk brand shingles says no felt -- no warranty. now you could warrant the shingles yourself but i think I would want the Manufactor to warrant them.
TURTLE
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On Sun, 10 Jul 2005 19:29:58 -0500, "TURTLE"

No it's not !!!!

And who sells that junk?

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Were they cedar shingles? The Cedar Shake and Shingle Bureau says felt isn't usually used for shingles.
"Although not commonly used, a breather-type underlayment, such as roofing felt, may be applied over either solid or spaced sheathing."
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