Moving Dirt

[maradcliff]

[Charlie S.]

Would like to clear out some dirt from under the porch and pour in some cement. I am going to call some contractors tomorrow to find out if they could use it for fill. If I don't have any luck, I may call for a small dumpster container. (I don't know if they will take dirt???

My plan is to shovel the dirt onto a wheelbarrow. Then, wheel it to the dump truck or dumpster. Seems like I'd have to shovel the dirt again... from the wheelbarrow to the truck or dumpster. Is there an easy way to move the dirt without hiring a truck with some sort of scoop. Ideally, there would be some sort of ramp I could use. Any suggestions?

[Edwin Pawlowski]

I sometimes see signs in fron of houses "clean fill wanted" by people th at want to fill in their yard. You can post on the craiglist web site that you have fill available. If you really get lucky, maybe you can get some help digging.

None offhand, but I'd consider building a ramp of some sort. At least a 2 x

10 that would get you up to tailgate height of a pickup. Any chance of backing that pickup right to the dig site?

[Evodawg]

How much dirt are you talking about? Why not move it to another part of the yard. Spread it around. If you're talkin about 5 or more yrds. pile it and use a bobcat to load it in a dump but that can get exspensive. I'd try to spread it, even in the grass evenly.

Rich

[Charlie S.]

I like your "Free Fill" idea. However, I want to get this stuff out of here as quick as possible. Who knows how long it would take for someone to take it away. (I will check the newspaper to find out if anyone is advertising for some.) I'll be using this area for storage.

A huge mound of it is in the way of some columns I'm putting in to stabilize the porch. I also have a feeling the dirt may have pushed against the granite footing causing some of the structural problems. Although, that is only a very small part of the overall problem. One concern, I do have is that living on a hill is, will the cement migrate some over the course of the next 100 years. I wouldn't imagine it would as the incline is very slight. But, I may need to pitch it a little away from the house.

I've never cemented before. I was thinking of making sections using 2x4. I may need to break up the space a bit as cold winters may make for some cracking. Although, there isn't any water problem below. I'll be asking more procedural questions on this group if and when I get to that stage.

[Bob G.]

================================== Do a Google search under FREECYCLE .. I know that in Maryland Yahoo has about a dozen FreeCycle groups... the purpose is to GIVE away JUNK .... Sort of one persons junk is another treasure...

Heck some guy was giving away 200 or so 8 inch block the other day locally....which I missed out on... LOL always a ton of baby cloths but I bet someone locally has a need for a little dirt...

Bob G

[wkearney99]

Most dumps charge by weight, it doesn't matter what's in there. Barring restrictions on materials, of course. I took about 12 tons of clay soil outta my backyard last summer. Sunbelt rents backhoes. They also rent trailers. Do NOT get one without the hydraulic dump bed. No sense in shoveling it into the trailer only to have to shovel it back out again.

Look for new home construction nearby. If you've got clean dirt that's just the soil, not leaves, sticks or other waste, then they might let you dump a bit of it. I got rid of several trailer loads this way (after paying the dump a few times...)

The backhoe cost me around $200 to rent for a couple of days. It was a Terra-mite; a small backhoe. Really pretty easy to operate once you get the hang of it. One side's a regular scoop and the other's a backhoe. But whether or not you could use one depends on just what it'll take to get that dirt out. Otherwise, get a trailer intended for landscaping use. They usually have a swing gate/ramp on the back. Then you can just drop the ramp and wheel in the wheelbarrow. But these don't always have a hydraulic dump lift and those that do don't always have a ramp gate. Mine didn't, BIG mistake. I had to shovel the damned stuff back out of there after having loaded it up sooooo easily with the TerraMite.

Also, some dumpster services will bring a half-container that has a swing gate. You just roll into it and pile it up.

Dirt is heavy, make sure whatever you tow it with can handle the weight. A landscape trailer that's entirely filled weighed in at around 8000 pounds. So don't go filling a trailer unless you're certain the truck can move it. That and the trailer might not be rated for that much weight. When it blows a tire you will be *ASTOUNDED* at how easily it just whips you and your truck around in a 360 across 3 lanes of traffic... Bring spare shorts.

Also consider that dirt will expand when you dig it up. What looks like only a few cubic yards turns into quite a bit more when dug up. It's all nice and compacted in the ground but fill of extra space and air when broken up into shovelfuls.

Spreading it around is good advice but only if the soil's suitable, mine wasn't due to being almost entirely clay. No sense smearing all that orange crap on top of already good topsoil.

[wkearney99]

Why does the porch need stabilizing? And if you're in an area with freeze issues there may be more to the work than you think. Frost heave can affect porch posts if they're not set deep enough into the soil. The depth varies depending on where you're located.

Granite footing? Some natural rock already there or something put down just for the porch? Again, if you've got freezing winters that's not usually enough for porch supports. If they're just buried on the top only a few inches deep that's a problem. Sometimes that can be solved just by installing some temporary steel support columns, removing the current post, digging and pouring a new footing and replacing the post.

Dirt generally doesn't 'migrate' unless it's on a loose substrate or has a lot of water running onto it. As in, a pile of soil put on top of a bunch of construction debris alongside the botton of a hill.

You generally can't just pour a slab and use that as a base for posts. Well, you COULD but it's certainly not up to building code in many areas. Better to sink a post hole (to the proper depth) and put down a footing or two in the needed locations than pour a slab that's going to heave and crack. Most counties have guidelines on porch/deck installations. Search the web for the one in your area. Whether or not you follow the code (or get a permit) is entirely up to you but you'd do well to find out what they require. Better safe than sorry.

-Bill Kearney

[Charlie S.]

I'm finding that out the hard way. There a number of issues. Water and weight distribution are keys.

Frost heave can affect

Yes, water is a key culprit. One granite column and a couple 4X4 columns are supporting the front corner of the porch. The granite situation is not the best. The blocks are thin and rest vertically on top of each other. On the other edge of this corner, the mortar has come apart and water damaged the supporting wooden columns. Thus, no support whatsover here.

You described this porch. It's a fairly large porch. L-shaped.... 19x10 and 16x6 following the L.

Sometimes that can be solved just by

This is a bit of problem. There isn't much room abehind the corners where the columns now rest.

I was thinking of digging a hole and catching the corner the best I could with a temporary lally column as best I could. Doesn't appeal to me all that well. Instead, I was thinking of sinking a number of sona tubes beneath the porch. Spaced 6 ft apart. (Someone told me that is in the city's code.) Then, running three 2x8 boards (nailed together) beneath the rafters while supporting them with wooden posts (or rented lally columns, if there is such a thing) that would rest upon the sona tubed cement. I was thinking of running the boards a foot beyond the sill. And, place lally columns behind the granite base with the new boards resting on them. The pressure would now be on the boards/lally columns and not on the granite. That way I could dig out the granite base and dig down 4 feet or so to build a better footing to rest the base granite on. Afterward, build the sill up with granite and/or steel posts, then I could cut the extended boards.

Makes sense.

This seems like it might be a bit of headache. May try and get someone to help me here.

[Charlie S.]

I took a few photos of the porch and put some of them on the web. Unfortunately, I couldn't use the software very well and couldn't put them in any particular order.

[Stormin Mormon]

How about scatter the dirt out onto the lawn? It would settle among the grass, and you'd hardly know it was there.

Hire the neighborhood kids to stomp down all the dirtclods, and it would hardly raise the lawn any.