Lubricating PVC fittings to pre-fit

[Jay-T]

I am pre-fitting some PVC fitting for a 3-inch sewer drain line coming down from a first-floor toilet. Where the drain comes through the basement ceiling from the toilet, there are two 45-degree 3-inch fittings -- one is the toilet flange itself which is a 45-degree fitting and the other is a

45-degree elbow. The place where they come through the ceiling is hard to access.

What I would like to be able to do is put the two PVC fittings together and then be able to easily rotate both so I can get the correct angle I need to continue the run. The problem is that when I put the two fittings together, they are next to impossible to rotate while in place. I need the fittings to be able to rotate one inside the other to get the correct line-up.

Has anyone ever tried lubricating PVC fittings first just to get the fittings lined up correctly, then marking them for the correct line-up, and then remove the lubricant and glue the fittings together? Does anyone know what kind of lubricant might work for this? So far, I have just tried dish soap, but that doesn't work -- the parts just stick together as usual and do not turn easily. Any suggestions on what to use?

[Existential Angst]

By dish soap, you mean dishwashing liquid? I would have suggested that, surprised it doesn't work. Dilute it out a little? Could be bum fittings as well. Do *any* of your fittings fit together so that you can rotate them?

The problem is, as I suspect you've already anticipated, that any oil-type lubricant that ;might work better will jeopardize the pvc glue integrity.

If worse comes to worse, pvc fittings are not that expensive, so maybe you can just remove some material from them so they can rotate, and sacrifice them for this particular app, and have spares on hand. Keep them around for future fit-ups, but mark them so you don't inadvertantly use them.

[Hustlin' Hank]

I like your idea EA.

Another thing you might try is hair spray. It will make things very slippery. I use hair spray to install handlebar grips on motorcycles. Altho I am not sure what would happen if you let it sit long enough to dry, it may glue them together. Usually takes awhile to dry if you use a lot. If you try this, let us know if it works. :-)

Hank

[The Daring Dufas]

We spilled some Armor All on the kitchen floor last night and it darned near turned the place into a skating rink! I don't know if it would work or how to get it off afterwards but the PVC cleaner/primer always seem to fix things up fairly well.

TDD

[RicodJour]

Buy or jury-rig a couple of strap wrenches.

R

[Jay-T]

Yes, I did mean dishwashing liquid. I didn't try diluting it (yet).

I think the fittings are fine.

That's a good idea that I didn't think of.

[Jay-T]

I don't have any hair spray, but I guess I could get some and try it. My hunch is that it would get sticky before I could make the adjustment I need to make in the fittings.

[Jay-T]

I'm still experimenting. Maybe that will work. Who knows?

This morning I tried baby powder -- didn't work. I got the idea when doing an Internet search and found something about powdered lubricants.

I also tried Surgi-Lube which is a water-based lubricant that is used in some medical and EMS applications. That didn't work either.

[Jay-T]

There is no room or access to be able to get any type of wrenches or tools in there to make any adjustments. It is hard to describe where the fittings are exactly.

If I can't figure out a lubricant that works, I'll just have to reach up there and do the best I can to make the adjustment by hand.

But, I did wonder if there is any kind of lubricant out there that would work for this of application. If so, I think it would be useful when pre-fitting a lot of PVC drain lines that require a number of turns, L's,

45's, etc. It would be an easier way to pre-fit and adjust everything, then mark them with a line-up mark, and later go back and clean and glue the connections.

[EXT]

I don't think anything will work. I am not familiar with PVC plumbing fittings because ABS plumbing fittings are mandated in my area, however, I understand that they are made very similar. ABS fittings will never fit together cold because they are tapered and the female hubs are designed to be undersize at about the halfway point of insertion. The idea is that the solvent/glue will disolve both the surface of the fitting and the pipe and only then will they bottom out when you press them together tightly. This way you get a solid solvent welded joint that will not leak. Dry, they just jamb together and not rotate nor bottom out.

[mkirsch1]

I've never seen a plumber do anything but dry-fit the fittings.

[RicodJour]

True, but then again the guy probably broke out the Sawzall with the Axe demolition blade and made an opening he could climb right into. Sometimes I swear it would be easier to build the house around the plumbing than to repair what the Hackmaster General did to the framing.

R

[Red Green]

"Jay-T" wrote in news:hft0rf$4mu$ [e-mail]:

What type of store did you buy them in?

Try running sandpaper/Abrasive Cloth around the outside of the male end and very slightly knock the outer edge off/bevel it. Dry fit befoe install as well.

If that's ng, try another supplier. Dry fit at the store.

I'm not even a good wanna-be plumber but my understanding is those fittings HAVE to be clean before priming and gluing if you don't want it leaking. All the lubricants you mention are contaminates.

[JIMMIE]

Waterless hand cleaner makes a good temporary lubricant and it cleans off easy.

Jimmie

[Jay-T]

Interesting. I didn't know that the fittings were tapered. That explains why no amount of lubricant would work.

I just did a Google search for " are PVC fittings tapered " (without the quotes) and found more info. Here are two links that I found:

(on that page, click on the first link at the top of the list on the right)

[Jay-T]

Thanks all for your ideas and suggestions. I was able to finish the job this afternoon. I ended up just using brute force to twist the two

45-degree angled fittings to where they made the complex angle turn I needed etc. What helped was that I put a piece of 3-inch PVC in the bottom 45-degree coupl> I am pre-fitting some PVC fitting for a 3-inch sewer drain line

[HeyBub]

1. Lube it up with whatever you've got.
2. Place in position.
3. Mark pieces.
4. Remove and get as much chicken-fat, or whatever you used, off the parts.
5. Cement the parts together and install.

I believe since this is a DRAIN, and under no pressure, the chances of it leaking are remote.

[Steve Barker]

The glue make a good lube. Rotate as needed as you glue them up. It's not rocket science.

s

[Jay-T]

Actually, it is rocket science -- or at least 3-dimensional geometry involving complex angles.

Sure, the glue makes a good lubricant -- for about 15 seconds. Then it makes a good glue, and whatever you have in place at the time the glue sets you are stuck with, whether it works or not. For this application, it was a matter of having to dry fit the pieces together first to see if they would even be capable of making the complex turn that was involved and end up with a pipe coming down at the correct angle to be able to make the next connection.

[Bob Villa]

What if you taper (reduce the diameter) of the male fitting and use it to mark another male fitting. If it has a stamp or mold marking on the male...mark it from there to the female. Then use a new one that will fit tightly! HTH

bob_v