Correlation causation. There are *thousands* of differences between the Chinese and Americans. To blame mercury from vaccines without cause is silly. There are far more plausable reasons for the rise in autism, including self-selection of mates with autistic traits (geeks on geeks)and our economy making this possible.
As I stated, there is not scientific proof and studies have not been done. It may or may not be, but you don't offer a solution either. As the thiomerisol is eliminated, it may show causation. We'll see.
The problem with lead is solder joints is that the EPA changed disinfectant chemicals for city utilities a few years ago and the new chemical is more corrosive and now people are drinking plenty of lead in their old pipes.
So why bring it up? No proof is no proof.
I offered one alternative explanation (unfortunately, solutions are not always possible). The "solution" is *not* to stop vaccination. The "solution" may be the "media" getting a clue about science, but that won't happen because scares sell ink. They've obviously scared you since you bought the line right down to the hook.
Likely the claimed "causation" will be the rates of autism to increase in China. ;-/
Because a previous post was in error. I corrected the perception about anti-biotics.
The possible solution is to stop using a mercury based preservative if there are other methods that work as well. Unless you try something, you just don't know. I didn't buy anything, but I'm open minded and think it is sensible to try alternatives to mercury since they do exist. Injecting mercury into a baby just does not make sense to me. That does not mean eliminating vaccination at all.
I wouldn't call it superstitious. There is a valid basis for it.
And your disagreement doesn't seem well based either.
Even if the city pipes contain lead, the water in them is rushing by because of the other people using water, even when we are sleeping. Someone is up earlier than we are, or going to bed much later than we do, and is showering or washing something.
of running out 2 qt. of water in the morning
It's only the water to our own house and in our own house that gets no use at all when we are asleep. That's what sits there, in some cases picking up lead.
I figured the toilet thing was dependant on how the house is built.
Many people go to the toilet first thing in the morning and flush anyhow. Sometimes 2, 3, 4 people get up at the same time.
My bathroom sink is fed from the same pipe and only has 6 feet that are different.
My kitchen sink is fed from teh same pipe as the two upstairs toilets, and only has about 3 feet that are diffferent.
So if the toilet flushing is enough to put new water in the house pipes, I'd only have to run the kitchen sink for 3 feet worth to have fresh water there.
Hah. I've removed the lead from my car.
The biggest problem with lead in the water from lead pipes. I must admit I don't know what has been said about solder with lead, but it's a lot less than lead pipes.
I guess we had lead paint when I grew up, but the house was new enough that nothing was chipping. I gather some babies chew on the window sills, even when the paint isn't chipping, but if I tried, I think my mother woudl have stopped me whether anything was known about lead or not. I guess I can't remember back that far.
They were just talking about this on NR or CSpan. Thiomerisol is now out of all the antibiotics except one. I missed which one.
But though they took it out, I think your right that it was never proven to be the cause of autism.
I dopn't have a strong opionion either way, and I haven't heard about China When did they start using the vaccines (there have been a lot of changes in China.)
>
This week or something is the 50th anniversary of the Saulk polio vaccine.
Another story (or the same one?) someone reminisced about how a some pulbic school no one objected to thier kid getting the polico vaccine, compared to today.
I don't rememver if my mother objected at the time or not**, but 30 years later she expressed qualms, and 10 years after that I found out why. There had been a bad batch of polio vaccine, out of 10's of thousands of batches needed for the whole country) and a several, quite a few, or somenumber ofof kids out of that batch got polio from the vaccination.
**I know I got the shots pretty early.Not parralel but little known and sort of relevant.
Perhaps the real guestion is why anyone would choose to put a mercury compound in any injectable substance?
Lots of people objected to the polio vaccine. And that bad batch was from a single lab and ended up in Idaho (where I live) where a lot of kids got polio from the shots.
More important was the controversy between the Saulk vaccine (based on dead virus) and the Sabin vaccine which was an attenuated but live vaccine. The latter was effective with kids and spreading immunization but it killed a lot of the older relatives of the kids vaccinated.
Because it works and has no demonstrable side effects? Geez!
Tehre is nothing about China (other than they _report_ fewer cases of autism than the US). It was thrown in as a red herring.
To say "There have not been scientific test..." about anything related to mercury and autisim is about the biggest understatement I have seen this week. The supposed connection betweeen mercury and autism has been studied extensively, both in the US and around the world.
It is telling when someone tosses out one of these anecdotal tidbits as if it means something, when there has been a debate that going on for years, decades of research, and millions of dollars sunk into both small and large studies. Oh, but your little anecdote hasn't been studied you say, so I guess that just wipes the whole slate clean and we can just forget all the studies and start the discussion fresh again.
-Kevin
Statements like yours would only be helpful if we figure out how many posts there are saying:
I would be almost eighty if I weren't dead; we grew up with lead paint on our cribs, Had asbestos covering strapped on all the steam pipes in the basement, played with mercury on pennies in chemistry class and didn't survive all these perils.
Geez yourself, it is not clear that there are no adverse effects. In fact, there seems to be considerable concern that there may be side effects, why else has it been removed, other than it was a stupid act in the first place.
Mercury has demonstrable effects, even in minute quantities, but also effect from low doses that manifest only after a long period and those effects are most likely to occur in children. So what kind of idiot would use it; mercury plus children is stupid, far worse than lead plus children.
According to kevin :
Well... I was just listening the other day to a discussion about the major increases in autism that supposedly everybody is seeing worldwide and is prompting such studies.
Some facts:
- The rise in autism in the US appears to be roughly balanced by a _decrease_ in attention deficit disorders.
- The rest of the world is in fact _not_ seeing a big jump in autism rates, for the most part they're relying on US numbers, because few countries have that level of monitoring. Those that do, aren't seeing anywhere near as big a jump, if at all.
- It's to a school (or school system's) financial advantage to have a child declared autistic rather than ADD/ADHD because of US state/federal school funding programmes.
While autism has a very exacting definition, it appears that many of these children are being declared autistic by people who do not have the credentials/experience to evaluate it properly.
Thus there is now doubt about the whole statistical basis of the phenomena, and it's rippling all over the place.
The comment was that if a child was declared autistic by school sponsored evaluation that they should get a second opinion from a professional who specializes in autism.
While misdiagnosing a child with autism instead of an attention deficit disorder benefits the school financially, it means that it's not in the best interests of the child, because they get the wrong treatment.
According to George E. Cawthon :
Desperate times call for desperate measures.
The very first smallpox vaccine killed 1 out of 6. Those were better odds than not being vaccinated in those days. [This predated the famous cowpox vaccine]
Another vaccine that has had bad press is the diptheria (whooping cough) vaccine. Which was reported to have a bad outcome in 1 out of 10,000 vaccinations. Yet... as I recall, the odds of catching diptheria without being vaccinated are something like 1 in 6, and "bad outcomes" from catching it is also something like 1 in 4 or 6. Or, in other words, bad outcomes one in 24 to 36 for not being vaccinated.
Certainly, we need to be aware of the failure rates and strive to drive them downwards. But expecting zero is unrealistic, and we should not overexaggerate the dangers based on off-handed remarks about "lots".
Not sure what you mean by the first small pox vaccine and predating the famous cowpox vaccine. It still isn't clear, unless they cleared it up very recently, exactly which organism was contained in some of the vaccines. I don't know what time frame you mean or where, but 1 in 6 deaths from smallpox doesn't sound right.
1 in 6 getting diptheria is also very high.Whoa, what comments are you reading. I said "lots of people objected." Some how you translated that into something about the disease occurence or the efficacy of the vaccine?
I know damn well that lots of people objected to just about any thing new.
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