Is it worth upgrading to High Efficiency furnace?

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One place to look for energy leak is under the bottom row of siding. I often see huge gaps there. Check with an inspection mirror. If you see a gap it needs to be filled with backer rod and silicone. Will keep air in and bugs out.
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That leak should be outside the vapour barrier. Better to fix the vapour barrier and let the insulation breath.
Mike
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I disagree. Latex paint on the siding will let the vapor breath. The cold air leaking in could cause condensation to form.
wrote:

siding.
vapour
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Not if the siding is aluminum, steel, vinyl etc.

Cold air is usually relatively dry and enters the cold side of the insulation - not much condensation. If there is condensation, having open air flow on that side allows it to dry. I know of designs where architects have specified an air gap at the top and bottom of the cladding to ensure the insulation can breathe on the outside. Both openings covered with fine mesh to keep out the mousies.
Mike
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I know for a fact that vinyl had weep holes built in. Don't have any experience with metal siding but my guess is that it is designed the same way.
Synthetic stucco is designed now to have a drainage system (in areas of the country that still allow its use). And I'm sure that some other construction designed by architects for a particular project might indeed have drainage at the bottom.
But the instances of regular siding with a big gap at the bottom I've seen have been defects which allowed cold air and bugs to enter. In some cases you could see with an inspection mirror the gaps between sill plates. In my parents townhome, residents have had problems with frozen and burst pipes. I have no doubts that backer rod and caulking the gap would permanently fix the problem. It seems to me that in my area at least, foundations are being made slightly small and the sill plate and framing and sheathing overhang it slightly so the siding can overlap the foundation wall.
wrote:

having
where
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kevins_news wrote:

Sure, calculate the annual therms and cost of your gas now. Find out the efficiency of your current furnace and the efficiency of what you would replace it. As a ratio of the efficiency ratings, calculate the annual therms. You will probably find that your payout on a $3000 furnace would take forever. If you like your present furnace, forget it. The more efficient furnace will likely be more noisy.
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And gas projected costs in a year, 2, 3, 5 years out.

Either a 80%, or a 90%..and its easy to find out if someone would post a model number...

Not forever, but longer than the unit will last.

Doubt that. Installed correctly, sealed combustion units are all but silent upon fire. The blower makes more noise than the burners.
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The payback is negative if the (fuel savings - high maintenance costs) are less than the investment return on the $3000.
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Actually...lets get one thing clear. There is never a payback period. None. Ever.
You buy the unit....its saving you $XX a month. Big deal. You still have to pay to run it, and you still have to buy fuel for it. Unless you are using an old 1950 Chrysler Airtemp with a gas valve pressure thats so damn off its blowing black soot, and running the unit so hot its TR is about 100F above factory spec, and have been doing that for years, even a 94% wont really do much but lower the expense per month to use the unit.
Payoff periods are a sales technique that the public actually enjoys. I dont use them. Someone asks me what the payoff period for a new unit is, I tell them about 15 minutes after I hand you the bill....it will take that long to read the warranty to you and familiarize you with the controls, and for you to write a check....then of course, we pull out the States calculation sheet and show them what they might save....thats MIGHT.
If you have a $400 a month gas bill, and you put in a unit and its only using $200 a month, you STILL have a $200+ a month investment in the unit.
IF you have a gas unit thats using $200 a month and you put in a heat pump that eliminates your fuel bill, but raises your electrical by $100 a month, you still have $100 a month going into that machine.
Payoff? Depends on how you look at it. Some see it different than others.
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OK-- who left the sky light open? We got us an MBA in here now...
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are
Dammit man..I handed YOU the tamper proof Torx and the driver...

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CBhvac wrote:

((snipped))
My Amana is 80 percent (if you devide output by input rating) and it sure isn't quiet, so I guess it doesn't qualify as a sealed combustion. The burner is just about as loud as the blower. That's what I meant, the blower. Will probably be in operation more of the time. Total blower time should be longer and even if the blower operates at a lower speed and is quieter at that time much of the time, there is still noise that may be irritating.
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There is quite a bit of burner noise on 80& units, especially if they have inshot burners.
I guess it depends on a person's sensitivity to noise. We recently replaced a 90% unit with a 90% 2 stage and had the owners comment on how they couldn't tell if this one was running other than the house was warm.
On Wed, 07 Jan 2004 06:44:57 GMT, "George E. Cawthon"

--
Is 'tired old cliche' one?





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????
Based on what? I'm going to have to see some info to support that, many higher efficiency units have variable speed blowers that ramp to speed, reducing blower noise etc. Just don't install a Lennox Pulse if you're concerned with noise, we're not talking Atta-Boy's here! ;-)
- Robert
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American Mechanical wrote:

Based on surmise. You are just considering loudness. I would expect the more efficient furnaces to run the blower more of the time, especially if they use multiple blower speeds. Just because the blower doesn't run at full speed doesn't mean the blower noise isn't irritating and that could be considered more noise, or noise more of the time. I prefer a house to be dead quiet but it seledom is due to the computer and refrigerator, let alone the furnace.
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wrote:

THen you definately don't want a Goodman either
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On Wed, 07 Jan 2004 07:42:40 GMT, "George E. Cawthon"

A small furnace noise observation: I was quite annoyed with my furnace for the first few months. Sometimes it seemed quiet but quite often there was a rather loud, slow, and pulsing resonant sound coming from it that could be heard through the entire house. At first i thought it was fan noise but strangely enough this would be louder up in the bedroom than when i stood downstairs by the furnace. I eventually just gave up and assumed our ducts were resonating somewhere in the wall.
A few months after that we painted one living room wall and i was up on a ladder near the return air intake. It was a very wide vent (2 feet whereas all the others were 1 or 1.5 feet). Turns out it is the vent cover that was resonating. Not vibrating against the wall or the duct. But resonating itself. I stiffened it up with a piece of wood on the inside and now all is quiet. I have to stick my foot infront of a register to tell if the furnace is running.
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One of my 3 furnaces made a terrible rumble when it started up. Couldn't figure it out until I was in the basement standing next to it when it started up and I saw the PVC exhaust pipe vibrating against the gas intake pipe just at startup. A sponge between the 2 solved that problem.
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kevins_news wrote:

My furnace had a very specific annoying sound to it (among all the others noises). It was the flue (exhaust stack) resonating. I put pressure on it and most of the resonance stopped, so I wedged a 3" can between it and the wall. The can provide just the right amount of pressure and prevents heat transfer to the wall. Burner and fan noise is still there but at least that part of the noise virtually disappeared.
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No. Going from a ~80% efficient furnace to maybe a ~92% or 95% furnace isn't going to make that much of a difference to you.
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