eselk,
Take a file to the pipe to get the rest of the solder off or reheat it and use a soldier wick to suck it off. You can get wicks in HD or somewhere similar. A round file worked without alot of pressure should be fine also.
Most leaks are caused by the copper pipe not being hot enough when you apply the solder. Otherwise not enough flux. Make sure you clean the ends with sandpaper before applying any flux or solder.
Good luck,
Air gets into the water lines when you work on the pipes, and when you turn the pressure back on it blows out the faucets etc for a few minutes.. No problem.
If the fit-up is too tight, solder can not flow properly into the joint. This can be a problem is the pipe is slightly oval or has a bent place.
Don Young
its not hot enough or not clean enough.
.. snip...
Thanks to all who replied. I got it last night! Yeah!
I wish I could say for sure what the problem was, but I ended up doing pretty much everything that was recommended in one shot, so not sure what really helped the most. I think part of the problem, and why I had to try so many times, was that after it was leaking the first time, I was probably trying to hard on all of the next attempts assuming that something was wrong. In the end, I just said to myself, "The other fittings went on fine, so stop trying so hard and just give it one more shot, just pretend it is the first time your doing this one, and that it was never leaking."... I just went back to basics, and didn't try too hard, and it worked. Plus I opened the faucet, used sand paper, bread, and several other tips as well, so was probably a combination of everything.
Thanks again!
p.s.-Could have been the fishing gods helping me out as well, because of the 1 day delay, it could time out that I'll be waiting for waterproofer to dry on Saturday instead of Friday, so maybe I'll get to go fishing after all =]
My own experience is that I got a rough "lava rock" type look to the solder when I had insufficient heat. My first soldering attempts were made with a 6" long butane torch and it took about 5 minutes to heat the joint sufficiently. Then after I dropped a pipe wrench on my torch I couldn't get a decent looking joint at all. The solder would tend to kind of glob on.
I got a new mapp gas torch and it made a huge difference, only about
30 seconds to heat the joint sufficiently and the solder would wick right in. I noticed that you said in an earlier message that you remove the heat when you start applying the solder. This could allow the temperature of the copper pipes to fall and lead to the rough finish you're observing. (Copper is an excellent conductor of heat so if you remove the torch I'd expect the temperature to fall fairly quickly as the heat spreads out down the pipe.) I continue to apply heat towards the inside of the joint until the solder wicks.Years later, that's funny. But not at the instant it happens.
Could very well be, I'm not sure how to tell what the right amount of heat is. I read that if it gets too hot, it will burn the flux, which I guess causes problems. I know it is hot enough to melt the solder, because on most attempts I've been removing the flame before applying the solder, just to be 100% sure I'm not melting the solder with the torch.
CY: Heat the other side of the pipe. Keep the solder in contact with the crack between the fitting and the pipe. When it just barely flows, that's enough heat. If at all possible, make all fittings horizontal.
When I've removed the elbow, most of the time I'm seeing a nice coating of solder where the elbow was (inside), so it must be flowing to the inside like it should. However, I usually do need to run the solder around the pipe, not just touch it in one place and have it run around the pipe "magicly" like I've heard about.
CY: H eat the bottom of the pipe, and touch the solder to the top. Run the solder left and right, so it flows down both sides. For horizontal fittings, when the solder drips otu the bottom, that's enough.
I've read different methods, and some say to just apply the solder in one place and it should run around all sides, and other people say to run the solder around in a circle. Which is best/better/correct? I can't really get to the far side very easy, so I guess just holding it in one place would be nice, if I can get that to work.
CY: Ideally, it flows all around, but I usually apply solder all around, manually.
Should the solder just stay inside and all the way around the pipe?
CY: Yes, it should stay inside and all around. Does, if the fitting is bright clean, and very tight when you push it together. Sand the outside of the pipe, and wire brush inside the fitting.
What I'm usually seeing is that some stays at the top, but more flows towards the "bottom" (whichever way gravity pulls it). So I usually do have solder all the way around, but a bit more in the direction that gravity was pulling it.
CY: If the fitting is horizontal, apply enough solder so that it drips out the bottom.
After reading the post by Heathcliff, I am starting to wonder if I'm getting solder in the right place, but maybe water or air is flowing through prematurely and creating narrow paths for the water to flow through when I turn the water back on. I'm 99.9% sure there is no water, but I hadn't thought about air.
CY: Well, never know.
The first thing I'll do when I try again tonight is to open the shower faucet, that way air can escape that way, and also water if it boils up that far (but again, I'm pretty positive there is no water).
CY: Good to leave a faucet on, after (downstream from) the fitting. That way any pressure that builds up from the heating has an escape.
We never doubted you. You're a fine plumber. Be sure to charge enough, you're worth it.
I haven't checked this Group in a few days so I'm coming at this late.
I had a similar problem with repairing 1 small horizontal section of pipe. I just couldn't get the solder to flow. I ended up with gobs of solder dripping on the floor. Cleaning and fluxing over and over didn't help. It was frustrating as hell. The problem was that water was still slowly dripping through the system and collecting in this perfectly horizontal piece of pipe. The torch was heating the water, not the pipe! The solution was to cut vertically at the nearest elbow (letting the water drip into a bucket), repair the horizontal piece with a new elbow, THEN solder that to the vertical piece.
Bottom line lesson for me...water is a great insulator and you can't solder with even a small amout of water sitting in the pipe.
--Jeff
Actually, the reason you can't solder with even a small amount of water sitting in the pipe is that water is a *terrible* insulator -- but it's very effective at transferring heat away from the spot that you're trying to heat.
Wait till you try it with a nice acetylene/air turbo torch, with the BIG tip on it. Takes about 5 seconds to heat up a 3/4 pipe joint to soldering temp, in 30 seconds the pipe melt!
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