Gas or Oil?

Page 2 of 3  
An All Electric house is a joke for 98% of the US that live in areas north of zone 8 as electricity is double the cost per BTU for most. If heating season is expensive unless you have subsides Hydro, gas is the cheapest.
If OP is looking for total replacement gas units are up to 94.5% efficient, that is higher than oil units go.
Add pictures here
<% if( /^image/.test(type) ){ %>
<% } %>
<%-name%>
Add image file
Upload
m Ransley wrote:

I was under the impression that if you have an all electric house, the electric company charges less per Kw hour than for houses that are not all electric. I don't know since I don't use electricity for anything other than those things that require electricity to run. Unlike George Gobel, I don't have a 'gas' guitar.
Add pictures here
<% if( /^image/.test(type) ){ %>
<% } %>
<%-name%>
Add image file
Upload

Two things:
1) Heat pumps (especially ground source heat pumps)
2) "Micro zoned" heating whereby you only heat the ROOMS (no the zones) of the house in active use.
It would be silly to automatically shut out consideration of all electric (with, maybe, a propane vestless heater for backup) living.
In places where it gets VERY cold, you can consider heatpump "background" heat with baseboard electric for room by room comfort.

Add pictures here
<% if( /^image/.test(type) ){ %>
<% } %>
<%-name%>
Add image file
Upload
Gilmer you know Zip about what 98% of the US pays for electricity. It is more than twice the cost of gas per BTU...... Heat pumps? here it goes to -20, so no heat pumps. Gas is cheaper, again.....
Electricity is so much more money that in fact the Chicago utility company used to give free and instal free an electric furnace and utility upgrade. Because they would have a rapid payback. And of course , to the surprise of the recipient who was shocked to death over his more than doubling of utility costs.
Figure this, gas is used to generate electricity here. If electricity was competive Electric furnaces would be in competion with gas. I dare you to find a residential electric furnace istaler in areas of the US with .11 kwh- .13 kwh costs, that is all of the US that is not Hyrdo subsidised Now research your " thoughts" before you speak them. Hopefully you will post further with facts , not misinformed misinformation.
Add pictures here
<% if( /^image/.test(type) ){ %>
<% } %>
<%-name%>
Add image file
Upload
Ooooh-eeee! Need an asbestos suit to read your posts.
You're right. I did a calculation to compare the two here in Manitoba. For 730.337 M3 of gas consumption, I'd need to replace it with 7,646 kWh of electricity, considering that both would provide 27,526 Mj of energy.
At those rates electricity would cost $509.50, gas $218.27. Now that's calculated on the efficiency of my furnace. A more efficient one would lower the cost of gas still more, but not by much.

Add pictures here
<% if( /^image/.test(type) ){ %>
<% } %>
<%-name%>
Add image file
Upload

Well here in Canada (Vancouver) we pay 6 cents/KWH which IS cheaper than gas at $11/GJ (approx 10 therms). I zone heat with electricity and my heating bill is $200/year vs $1200 for gas.
Add pictures here
<% if( /^image/.test(type) ){ %>
<% } %>
<%-name%>
Add image file
Upload

gas
Can I run an extension cord to your house? I'll pay for your use as well as mine. Converted to USD I'm paying triple that in CT. I heat with oil ($1.599) as the only gas available near my house is from eating beans. Ed
Add pictures here
<% if( /^image/.test(type) ){ %>
<% } %>
<%-name%>
Add image file
Upload

Buy a chainsaw and a good woodstove! :)
Thank goodness for cheap hydroelectric power
Add pictures here
<% if( /^image/.test(type) ){ %>
<% } %>
<%-name%>
Add image file
Upload
06 kwh you are lucky with subsidised hydro , in the midwest U.S. I pay 1275 kwh and that is a normal US rate, many areas are much higher here and going higher soon.
Add pictures here
<% if( /^image/.test(type) ){ %>
<% } %>
<%-name%>
Add image file
Upload

OK
Can one also cool and use AC using gas as the energy source?
Just curios
Add pictures here
<% if( /^image/.test(type) ){ %>
<% } %>
<%-name%>
Add image file
Upload
snipped-for-privacy@privacy.net wrote:

Sort of, one can setup a refrigeration cycle, using heat to provide the cooling, however you still electricity to move the air.
They used to have gas powered fridges for example, but they don't move air.
Add pictures here
<% if( /^image/.test(type) ){ %>
<% } %>
<%-name%>
Add image file
Upload

Well, "modern" heating systems also require electric power.
(At one time many gas furnaces had "milivolt" type gas valve which used the small amount of power generated by the pilot light on a "thermpile" to power the thermostat circuit. If the electric was not working, the overtemperature sensor would cut the gas. Thus, you could get a little heat if you had gas but no electricity. Today, most gas water still work that way so if the power fails you can still fill your hot water bottle and take a hot bath.)

Up until the 70s the gas companies were still pushing gas central air conditioning systems. But when the gas shortages hit, they gave up on efforts to create new demand. Without the gas companies behind them, the makers of smaller gas cooling appliance (& AC) gave up the fight.
The "absorption" type of gas (or any heat source) water chillers (for LARGE commercial systems) are still being made but except for large industrial installations that use process steam they just aren't cost effective.
Add pictures here
<% if( /^image/.test(type) ){ %>
<% } %>
<%-name%>
Add image file
Upload

FWIW, my original post specified gas or oil. That's all I'm considering.
Any other comments on my original question?
Add pictures here
<% if( /^image/.test(type) ){ %>
<% } %>
<%-name%>
Add image file
Upload

a few years ago when i last investigated, you could get an ac unit that had a gas powered generator in it that produced the power to drive the normal ac unit in the other half of the unit.
Add pictures here
<% if( /^image/.test(type) ){ %>
<% } %>
<%-name%>
Add image file
Upload

had
ac
I think I saw something about that in Popular Science (or variation thereof.) IF you didn't count the cost of the generator set it was about break even. But the gas engine would need the oil changes every few weeks and a complete re-build ever other year.
It might make sense in you are "off the grid" but ...

Add pictures here
<% if( /^image/.test(type) ){ %>
<% } %>
<%-name%>
Add image file
Upload

http://www.polarpowerinc.com/products/generators/cogenset.htm
Add pictures here
<% if( /^image/.test(type) ){ %>
<% } %>
<%-name%>
Add image file
Upload
http://www.polarpowerinc.com/products/generators/cogenset.htm

Thanks for the link. I "scanned" it and it was a fun read.
Add pictures here
<% if( /^image/.test(type) ){ %>
<% } %>
<%-name%>
Add image file
Upload

This seems like a classic example for doing a cost study for one's individual situation. No one else will have the magic answers for you, your residence or area.
Such a study has two main components; 1) The First cost of a new installation. Also how long will it last; presumably many years, before it in turn will also need replacement. 2) The expected future and on going costs of operating and maintaining. The financial effect of these can be brought back, financially if you wish to a 'Present Worth' cost, in order to compare them directly.
3) Thirdly YOU have to decide what future variables may/will affect you. This will include existing and future costs of fuel, current and future major repairs and when and if they will occur. This may include a future new chimney, oil tank replacement at some future date, future changes in oil tank leakage regulations, possibility that additional liability insurance will be needed to guard against environmental pollution due to oil leakage into ground water etc.
4) Fourthly there will be intangibles that only you can decide if/will affect your decision. these might include future government policies, whether you will ever increase the size of your house, add heating to a future garage, whether you want a system that will be easiest to maintain when you retire, sell or rent the house etc. etc. Also whether these will incur any difference in cost either now or in the future. Intangibles also would include your own assessments of the comparative risks of the various fuels. This would include the need for Carbon Monoxide/Smoke detectors wired and linked as required by local regulations? Insurance requirements? I would suggest that much of this information could be obtained by getting 'several' quotes for both oil and gas for the 'first costs' and also some numbers from the fuel providers for their expectation of future costs. But YOU decide what you think future fuel costs will be.
5) Your choice must adequately do the job you want it to do under all reasonable/expected conditions short of a world flood or a 250 mph windstorm!
While agreeing that electricity is generally more expensive it also has advantages. We decided to go all electric some 34 years ago and for us it was good choice. Our advantages and savings were; no requirement to purchase and install a fuel tank which by now would have needed replacement at least once! No cost for chimney and no need to clean it regularly. Great simplicity of installation, virtually zero maintenance (one circuit breaker and three thermostats, one of which was replaced for cosmetic reasons during 34 years!). Ability to turn down or off, individual rooms, an advantage now that there is now only a single person in a four bedroom house. Currently though the cost of electricity has increased by about 8% and is rumoured to increase gain mid 2005 due to the increased cost of oil which fuels one generating station that produces about 40% of our electricity, particularly during the winter. It has also proved extremely safe and the electric supply very reliable.
BTW. If I install 'auxiliary' heating, say in the form of a properly chimnied and installed wood stove there would be a reduction in my electricity fuel cost, but it would increase my property insurance due to a higher fire risk. At age 71 I am still able to safely maintain our electric heating system with ease. Whereas the maintenance of an oil tank system and responsibility for spilled fuel oil into the ground, which has happened several tomes here at major cost to homeowners, often not covered by insurers, here, would be a worry.
So do a comparative cost study using all obtained info and reasonable financial parameters for interest rates/cost of money etc.
Add pictures here
<% if( /^image/.test(type) ){ %>
<% } %>
<%-name%>
Add image file
Upload
On Tue, 26 Oct 2004 23:58:06 GMT, someone wrote:

You can almost forget about trying to figure out which fuel is cheaper. They are tied to each other in the market, people buy btus, there are many industrial and utility users who can burn either so if one gets lower they switch until it evens up again, and/or single fuel users will go to the other, again until it evens out. Any significant difference will likely be merely temporary. If anything gas may have a more efficient distribution system - nobody needs to drive out to your house in a truck.
Gas, the utility charges what they charge, which is either a good thing or a bad thing. However you can often buy a supplier contract if you like to get into that stuff (in my area, we do that for our commercial properties) and play that market.
Oil, there are plenty of different companies, they charge what they charge, you can try toi time that too, I don't with my residence, I like the company and just go with them. As a result I bargain more for my gas than my oil!
Oil, a leak can be very VERY costly to clean up. There are situations where this is your responsibility.
Gas, a leak may blow up your house and kill you. This is rare but does indeed happen. However, most leaks are minor and just blow away and don't need any cleanup.
My opinion, you already have gas in the house, so worst of both worlds - chance of both blowing up and expensive spill, too. So get rid of the oil and eliminate that peril. You are apparently already comfortable with having the gas in the house, just go with it. It MIGHT even be a LITTLE cheaper, and whether you find utility pricing better or worse in concept than negotiating your own is up to you.
There is no wrong answer. (Years ago, there was.)
-v.
Add pictures here
<% if( /^image/.test(type) ){ %>
<% } %>
<%-name%>
Add image file
Upload
David L wrote:

Another option is propane if it cane be delivered in your area. In some (many?) places you can prepay and get it at the low summer rate thus avoiding any winter price hikes.
--

-Bill

Add pictures here
<% if( /^image/.test(type) ){ %>
<% } %>
<%-name%>
Add image file
Upload

Related Threads

    HomeOwnersHub.com is a website for homeowners and building and maintenance pros. It is not affiliated with any of the manufacturers or service providers discussed here. All logos and trade names are the property of their respective owners.