How do I do this? I have done some wiring work (safely). My thought was to disconnect the hot wire from the switch and run it to the outlet with the new wire (black conductor of course), then run the white wire from the outlet recoded as black to the switch. Will ground everything properly. The switch only controls a small outside light. Is this the right way to do it ?
TIA, James
I'm confused. You say the switch controls a "small outside light" yet you want to run a wire from the switch to an "outlet".
What am I missing?
On Sat, 25 Jan 2014 19:16:34 -0600, DerbyDad03 wrote (in article ):
The light was once always powered (that way when I bought the house) and I had an electrician install a spst swittch to it so I could turn it off without unscrewing the bulb. There is only one 2-conductor wire to the switch and I want to power an electrical outlet from that switch wiring if that's possible.
That is wrong, the outlet simply needs to go in parallel with the outside light. If you don't know how to do that, call a licensed electrician.
It won't work. What you have at the switch is a place to break the hot wire. There is no neutral in the box.
You have to pick up power where there is a hot and a neutral. (and ground)
I may have read what you have written wrong. How many wires do you have in the switch box you are describing?
If you only have two wires and a ground it won't work. If you have a white wire in the box with a wirenut on it, you can do what you are asking.
On Sat, 25 Jan 2014 20:01:18 -0600, philo wrote (in article ):
I think I understand. Pigtail the always on hot wire to the switch and run hot from that connection to the outlet. Pigtail neutral wire to the switch and attach neutral from outlet. Is that right?
No.Absolutely not!
The two wires going to the bulb...
bring those down to the outlet. ( and ground of course)
Inside the switch box there would be no "cold" (return) wire which is necessary.
Hold on there, Phil. We need to know what is in his existing box, and the location of the new outlet.
James, you first have to determine if you have a "neutral" in the switch box. If the answer is no, then you will have to find another means of installing an outlet. A white wire does not necessarily mean that the wire is a neutral. However, your method of pig tailing the hot to the switch is correct. Pig tailing the "white/neutral" to the switch is not.
Please get back to us with what you actually have present in the switch box.
If I read you right, you have
Incoming to the switch box is black, white and ground (I hope you have a ground).
Outgoing to light is black, white and ground
Incoming black goes to switch with the outgoing black coming off the other switch terminal.
Incoming white is wire nutted to the outgoing white.
That is the way it _should_ be.
To add the run to the box.
Incoming black pigtailed to switch and outgoing to box black.. Existing outgoing black remains on switch.
all three whites are wire nutted together.
Keep in mind that all switches must switch the hot wire.
Harry K
No, that's the way it _could_ be.
It's possible (probable) that all he has is a single run of Romex from the light fixture, with the black and white being used as a switched hot.
In another post he said that the light was always "on" when he bought the house and he had an electrician install a switch. The easiest way to do that would be to simply run a length of Romex from the fixture to a new switch box so that the hot can be switched. Based on that post, I'm pretty sure that there is no neutral in the switch box.
Yes, it's possible that the electrician rewired the run to the fixture, routing a neutral through the switch box, but that seems like a lot of extra work just to add a switch.
Right you are and it is indeed the most likely way the switch was added. If so, adding a box won't be simple due to the missing neutral. I would assume (and yes, I know) that the electrician would have marked the white as being a black (or red).
Harry K
You are right...there could be a 'cold' wire in the box... I jumped to a conclusion because /usually/ there is not.
I think the OP should call an electrician as this is /very/ basic and if he does not understand it...should not be dealing with it.
See the second part of my answer first.**
Only one 2-conducter cable to the switch. Where does the cable come from? The outside light, I'll bet, but regardless.
Have you measure the voltage between ground and each side of the switch when the swiitch is off? Maybe you have. But have you measured the same voltages when the switch is on? They won't be the same as the first set of measurements.
Have you measured the voltage between the two wires when the switch is Off? Maybe you have. But have you measured the voltage between them when the switch is On? That will probably surprise you.
Have you used a meter with 110Volt current? If not, post back so we can discuss safety measures. For a start, never measure resistance until after you have measured voltage between the same two places and found that there is NO voltage. Otherwise you risk a big spark and ruining the ohmmeter.
**No. You're trying to put the outlet (receptacle) in parallel withr the switch. If you do that, when the switch is off it will be like paragraph B below. When the swtich is On the new light will get no voltage and it won't light.B) Or say you're putting in the receptacle in place of the switch: When you do that, say you plug a lamp into the receptacle. Then all the electricity that would have flowed through the switch will flow though the new lamp. And where will it go after that? To the outside light. So the two bulbs will have to share 110 volts. Say each bulb is the same size and type. Then each will use 55 volts and neither will shine bright enough to be useful.
You need to make a drawing of all the wires currently there, and in another color, all the wires you plan to add, and look at it closely and hopefully you'll see why this can't work.
I think so too.
However, he should not feel bad about it.
When I was in engineering school, one of my room-mates made the same mistake when trying to wire a switch to an outlet and I had to fix it for him.
He went on to be on the design team for the CT-scanner at GE (Fast Fourier transform development) and later on the design team for the Cray-1 computer. (Logic designer) He really was quite brilliant.
I ended up being an engineering "flunky" in the industrial battery-charger business where I did not work with anything more hi-tech than hi-frequency conversion and IGBT's.
+1
Until the OP clearly explains what already exists and what he wants to do, no use trying to decode all the possibilities. Another critical piece of information, does the outlet have to be powered all the time, or is it OK if it's controlled by the light switch too?
I was trying to figure that in my mind, and I got the same thought. Can't get an outlet off a SPST switch box.
On Sat, 25 Jan 2014 20:34:25 -0600, Metspitzer wrote (in article ):
You are right. Aftger some digging I realized I need to rewire the switch loop and light with 3-conductor wire to get a neutral wire in the setup. Thanks!
You still haven't explained how the switch and receptacle will interact. Will the switch control both the receptacle and the light or will the receptacle always be hot?
There's another item to consider: Right now you have 2 conducting wires, a ground and switch in the box. It sounds like you are planning to add 3 more conductors and a ground to the box. The switch box might not be big enough to meet code with all of those wires.
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