OT: Nicknames?

[John Stumbles]

My personal objection is that - as far as I can tell, having a general scientific/engineering background but not being an expert in that particular field - GM technology seems to be pretty crude at the moment. "Hey lets fire some bits of DNA from this organism into the cells from that one and maybe they'll stick in the right places. And if not maybe they won't do anything bad, that we haven't forseen and can't clean up."

Strikes me as a bit like the heyday of atomic energy "let's all go out into the desert downwind of the test site and watch the A-bomb going off".

The quality's probably far more variable than mass-produced standardised factory-farmed produce and I daresay some unscrupulous retailers use the 'natural variation' clause to pass of some sub-standard stuff. However in a broader view I know that organically-produced stuff isn't fostering the worst excesses of industrial chemist^H^H^H^H^Hagriculture and, if I buy it through a local box scheme hasn't been trucked halfway across the country.

[Rod]

Just came from a site (blog sort of thing) where I read this:

"I'm just having a big moral dilema wether the armour[1] is a natural cure or no." (sic all the way through :-) )

Seems the person would rather be extremely unwell by not taking something that could make her well based only on whether she can persuade herself it is natural - or not.

Funny how she cares so much about that - and asks on that most unnatural of media - the internet.

[1] Armour is ground up desiccated pig thyroid. (The alternative is synthesised hormone.)

[The Medway Handyman]

Sorry, maize. You would be surprised by how much food has maize as an ingredient. Very hard not to eat it, albeit unknowingly.

[Lino expert]

Is this the origin of the moral maize? I'll get me coat...

[Rod]

I'll have to search to zea if it is...

[dennis]

I hope you like vomit as they are *not* genetically modified. They are selectively breed which is something entirely different to splicing genes.

Are you putting the video on youtube for verification BTW?

Its no worse than your apparent lack of understanding of what GM is.

As I say to the traditionalists.. it was traditional to die of smallpox, TB, etc. so why do they think being traditional is always good.

[John Rumm]

[dennis]

It amuses me how may bacteria and other living stuff they eat. They have an odd view about what is alive and what isn't.

No they aren't. You don't understand what GM is. Selective breeding is *not* GM. Taking genes from one place and splicing them into another, maybe different species, is GM. Its commonly done by using a virus to pick up a gene and then infecting the target with that virus to implant the gene. This is where the controversy starts, how do you know what that virus will do to everything else when it gets out? Go and look it up and then come back (don't forget the video).

Quality is what you have to pay for with organic. It easy to get organic of poor quality, even Tesco sells it. Getting stuff that has been harvested, inspected and properly selected is more difficult. I don't care, organic has no advantage of other food stuffs. I just buy it if its cheap, which it sometimes is.

[Dave]

That is one of only a handful of youtube films that have put a smile on my face. Thanks for that

Dave

[Dave]

I'm with you on this one.

Like taking genes from some icelandic fish to transplant into a tomato so that it can be grown, ripened and cropped all year round, without the frost affecting the plants and the fruit. We will only have to wait a few short years for that to happen naturally. Climate change will see to that. And that won't happen because of using fossil fuels.

Now that is scary. A person eats a GM chicken, sneezes and turns someone else into a GM human :-( His feet turn into chicken claws and we have to re-invent the shoe ;-)

The concept of organic was good when it first came out, but several sources have rubbish it, for various reasons, over the years. I don't have any sources on this, other than what is going through my mind from reading about it.

Dave

[The Medway Handyman]

Typical bloody tree hugger. Ignore the facts, use a Frankenstien spin to make something sound 'agin nature'. Were all doomed Captain Mainwaring, doomed.

Frankenstein spin again. It's just not going to happen. The worse thing GM foods will do is feed the world, those using unscientific scare tactics to delay things are responsible for millions dying of starvation.

If we went 100% organic tomorrow we would be a third world economy in ten years and Oxfam would be sending aid to us.

[Dave]

I normally enjoy all of your posts, but let me make comments on what you have to say below

I am at the opposite end of being a tree hugger, but I do think that Monsanto and the likes are pushing for GM foods for all the wrong reasons. A poor farmer, who plants a GM crop is forced to go back to the GM seed producer to buy new seed for his next crop, instead of using seeds kept back from the last crop. GM seeds are from crops that are designed to be infertile from the farmers last crop.

I don't think so. Think about chicken flu. When is that going to jump the fence into our life?

Monsanto have already gone down that rout with the crop busting weed killer 'roundup'. They have not proved that the genes that are in the crops they advocate will not get spread to other plants. In fact, it has been proved that the GM content has crossed from some crops into other plants that might not be beneficial to a farm crop. The future might well be orange here, i.e. scorched earth. My instinct is softly, softly.

This why I said the above.

Dave

[The Medway Handyman]

If thats the case its the multinationals who are wrong, not GM crops. Having said that, if said poor farmer gets a much better yeild without excess pesticides & fertiliser and avoids starvation - he is still better off.

Probably never. Bit like the BSE scare, we were all doomed then & bugger all happened.

And no body has proved that they could spread.

While millions starve?

[dennis]

We don't need GM to feed the world. We have been doing it for a while now. Its wars and stuff like that that cause famine.

Of coarse GM might offset some of the silly bio fuel induced famine.

[The Natural Philosopher]

THAT was pretty good..;-)

[The Natural Philosopher]

Well its a bt like 'hey lets get your horse to shag my donkey ad see what happens' and you get a mule.

Well its about the only way to learn.

well frankly we grow our own wherever possible. And if we tip slug pellets on the ground its our bloody business.

>

[S Viemeister]

That would be a jenny - you get a mule when the donkey shags the horse.

[The Natural Philosopher]

Im not. Silly me. I though anythng that modified genes was genetic modification.

Like getting a virus, a dose of radiation shagging someone with different genes (i,e not your twin sister)

So what? Either it's viable or it aint. The earth has been producing all sorts of weird crap since the year dot.

WE just found a way to do it faster, that's all.

As far as I know AIDS wasn't produced by genetic manipulation: it happened ALL BY ITS NATURAL SELF.

Nothing man has done is on a par with AIDS.

If AIDS had ben done by genetic manipulation, someone would have stuck it in a lab fridge and never ever let it out..

We might be able to CURE it with a GM product tho..

Its just a question of someone drawing a line in the sand and saying 'natural ' on one side and 'evil and dangerous' on the other.

With AIDS, the evil and dangerous is the same side as the natural...

[The Natural Philosopher]

pretty soon unless someone comes up with a GM chicken that can't catch it..?

..into the grave..

I suspect not.

[geoff]

In message , The Natural Philosopher writes

Where are you going to find that in Norfuk ?