Sure, they are.
Most of the electronics I have were made in China. I bought them not because they were made in China and cheaper than everything else, but because there were no "everything else" to buy.
Hi All,
Just wondering, because I'm having terrible luck with anything made in China. In most cases I have no choice, but to buy the junk that fails a month after the warranty.
About a year ago, I got two small space heaters. Both made in China, but different brands. They lasted one winter with only occasional use.
One failed completely - this is one from Target, made by Midea Fan Mfg. The one-shot thermal protector opened. Second was made by (rather marketed by) Holmes, but also made in China. The Holmes unit burned one of the heating elements and was only putting out low heat.
I bought the Holmes, because the last heater I had from them lasted 15 years. The difference seems to be where they are made. Even if China sourced products are sold at half the price, my cost over 15 years will be 5 times.
Both are very simple appliances. Can't the Chinese make anything that will even approach what was on the US market before?
RichK
Sure they can. Some of the most reliable parts in the PC you're using now probably were made in China. They will make the parts, appliances, etc. every bit as good as the manufacturer pays them to.
You may be confusing Taiwan with the mainland. Taiwan is years ahead. Mainland, well they even manage to screw up a simple C-clamp. Want one as a proof - used twice.
Even so, you must not have heard of the capacitor copy fiasco, if you're talking about computers.
RichK
I've been saying this for years, and it finally seems to be a reality...
"You get what you pay for. When folks buy the cheap crap instead of reasonable quality goods, the companies making the unwanted quality goods will either go bankrupt or switch to the cheap goods."
If you want to do something about it, make a strong point to your retailers that you WON'T support them if all they stock is cheap junk.
"RichK" wrote
No bashy, bashy, the Chinese. We soon to own you!
Not at all, I'm simply saying factories in mainland China, Shanghai mainly, can and do produce excellent first rate things. They are also equally able to make junk. The companies they are manufacturing for,often American companies like Mattel, decide what quality they want to pay for
I can remember when they said the same about Japanese.
I once got a Chinese hacksaw that was very well-made. It got stolen, so I can't identify a "brand" now. I also see Chinese hacksaws that I would call stool specimens - I had experience with one highly prone to popping apart during use, along with the blade being prone to twisting badly enough to make it very difficult (almost iompossible?) to cut straight.
As for Chinese compact fluorescent lamps:
Every spiral one I ever saw nationality of was made in China. Some are made for GE, Philips and Sylvania, and those tend to be made reasonably to outright well-made. (I am aware of a bad run that had some units getting GE's name on them, but that was in 2001.) Philips even has some impressive limited warranties for some of those. On the other end are dollar store compact fluorescents. I have yet to see one significantly outshine a better 40 watt incandescent, nor have I yet to see one with a light output claim meet its claim, and I have seen some with color badly described, some with rotten color rendering, and I already had one give a scary failure (lots of smoke and a burning orange glow in the base that did not stop until power was shut off), and I know someone who had one die early with three loud pops and two of these pops were almost bangs, and he had another die with a lot of smoke output.
- Don Klipstein ( snipped-for-privacy@misty.com)
Wear more Made in China warm clothing and skip the space heater thingies.
You took the words right out of my mouth. My parents were both W.W.II vets (they met in the Navy in the 40's). When I was growing up, Japan & crap were synonymous to them. And when I was a kid, a lot of it WAS crap, like the toys. I don't know if they were overtly toxic, like the recent GHB-bead thing, but I remember taking apart Japanese-made stamped metal toy cars when I was a kid which said "EverReady" or "Pabst" on the inside - they were made out of old flashlight batteries & beer cans. Now names like Honda, Sony, Toyota, Panasonic, etc. are some of the most respected manufacturers anywhere.
Rich: The opposite reason to why we prefer to buy a Japanese brand vehicle; 'manufactured/assembled in Japan'. Even if it costs a little more! The last two "Japanese" vehicles we have were assembled somewhere in Tennessee IIRC? Probably have had some real Japanese parts but definitely minor differences and deficiencies from the genuine Japanese article! For example you don't expect vehicles manufactured for and in North America to have wiper problems! Both of these did. In other words to lower costs. Eventually, probably fairly soon, China and India will get to the point of producing good vehicles. Back in the 1930s Japanese goods were considered junk. Now Japan produces the most reliable vehicles! Also much of the higher quality electronics etc. AND JAPAN IS AN EXPENSIVE COUNTRY WITH VERY FEW NATURAL RESOURCES OF ITS OWN. We in North America are also suffering from the Wal Mart Syndrome. WM drives down prices so severely, often by leaning on the manufacturers that quality suffers. Saw some figures recently that Wal Mart USA alone annually buys more goods from China than the GDP of some of the world's nations! So they have a major influence on world quality of goods.
Some people are specifically looking for cheap stuff and are willing to compromise quality and durability. This is the market Chinese products are trying to fill. When I want a screwdriver or a clamp which I might only use once, I get the cheap stuff from Harbor Freight tools. They are so cheap I get a bunch of them. If one breaks I always have another one on hand. If I want something more durable, I get it from a known manufacturer, usually US or European. Before Chinese products came on the scene, you had to buy the professional grade tools with life time warranties that cost an arm and a leg. There is a need for low quality cheap stuff too. The problem comes when the customers can't distinguish between the good and bad stuff.
So why are we buying this stuff made in other countries anyhow. We only hurt ourselves with lack of jobs and higher taxes here in the US. I must admit I like a bargain as much as anyone else, but often those bargains end up costing more in the end. Spend $20 on an electric heater that lasts one year, or spend $30 on one that lasts 10 years. I am well aware of those cheap CF bulbs and I too have had them go up in smoke and sparks. I'm starting to phase them out and go back to regular bulbs, partially because they never last long, so where is the savings, but more so because I think they are a fire hazzard. China tools are pure crap. I dont buy the most expensive tools, but I am not going to spend a cent on some tool that bends in my hands when I use it, and busts a few knuckles too. I just needed some of the larger torx sockets. Not something I use very often so I was not going to spend much. A no-name china made set sold for $21, a Stanley set was $29. Or an expensive top pf the line set was $59. I decided to pay the $29. Stanley is not the best of all tools, but sure beats some no-name China crap, which will probably snap off at a critical moment and really piss me off, if not do more damage. I think Stanley is made in the USA, but I did not look this time since I was hurried. I could just see it was a better made tool then the el-cheapo china crud.
Adam Smith in "The Wealth of Nations" (1776) settled this hash years ago when he proved that countries should do what they do "best."
If you're only going to use the heater for one year, why pay a $10 premium?
The king of this movement is good old Wallmart they led the charge to China , Mexico and to who ever could make it for what they wanted it. Face it America corpreate America is bitting you in the ass we get the same shit up here in Canada . It is sad but we want cheap prices so we get it for cheap for a reason.
Stanley tool, for example, has 20,000 employees at 114 manufacturing and distribution centers in 20 countries. In today's global market, the line is blurred as to what "made in USA" means. The one thing Stanley tool and every other manufacturer still control, is the quality they demand from overseas plants. There is and always has been a demand for cheap manufacture goods. It's unfair to blame China for supplying them, and it's ludicrous to believe the Chinese incapable of manufacturing quality products
He didn't "prove" anything.
But durable goods are typically purchased for longer usage periods (thats why they are called durable). And then there is the issue of what to do with all of the Walmart junk that fills landfills because you need to buy one every year instead of maybe every 20 years.
Because walmart has everyone hypnotized into thinking the only important thing to worry about is price and most people really don't understand the slippery slope of gutting your own economy and manufacturing and enabling another to be the next dominant world power. "low prices everyday" is a powerful siren song.
We
Less expensive and crap and not synonyms. There were always lower end products, with fewer features and no frills. This can be accomplished by methods other than bad welds and crimps on portable heaters.
If you believe the women in China are told to make bad crimps on wires, you're off your rocker. They do that because they don't know any better and their boss does not care.
Yeah, maybe 20 years from now the quality will improve, but I doubt it. There will always be cheaper (read less trained) labor in China, so do not expect things to change in our lifetime. Comparison to Japan is pointless - two totally different cultures.
I have not seen a product from China which is well made, from C-clamps, to pair of pliers, to dust bins, to DVD players. Whenever possible I look for US made goods, but that's hardly possible anymore, regardless of price. Needless to say the likes of Wal-Mart play a major hand in this.
RichK
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