Woodhaven - The Name Raises my Bloodpressure

[JGS]

A couple of weeks ago I was browsing Woodhaven's online catalogue and came across a circle cutting jig kit for a router ($75 plus $20 shipping) which appeared to overcome the two short comings of my homemade $2 nail and hardboard set up. Another $23 (CDN this time) and I had it out of customs and assembled even though it arrived with a few stripped threads. The first thing I noticed was that I needed to use a straight cutting bit that was about 1 1/8" longer than the ones I normally used. No problem. But how do you start the cut. With my hardboard set up I lifted the router a bit while flexing the hardboard to start the router and then lowered it to start the cut. The arm on the Woodhaven unit allowed for no flex. Checked the picture in the catalogue again and yes they were using a fixed base router very similar to mine. So I emailed them. It bounced back as my sender was in their "bad mail file", whatever that means. So I called them on my nickel again as their 1-800 number does not work in Canada. A couple on calls later I got their "technical" guy. His reply was that I needed to buy a plunge router. His other suggestion was to start the router and lower it into the base while RUNNING. I called back and spoke to a very nice lady at the sales desk who said she would check to see if they would pay the postage if I returned the unit. When she called back a couple of hours later to say they would pay the postage both ways I asked about the customs fees. We talked for a minute or so and it became obvious that this was a lose-lose situation. If they paid the shipping and customs it would cost them about $56 to retrieve an item they retail for $75. It would have been cheaper for them to make another one, I think. On my part I would be out about 6 or 7 long distance calls plus packaging costs, travel into town, ect. I asked that before she got back to me about the customs cost they consider another possible solution. Simply put, I would pay the original shipping costs plus the customs fee and they would credit my account with the purchase price. They reduce their loss and I get $75 back to be used toward the purchase of a plunge router. They responded yesterday, No, send it back with no mention of the customs cost. They are the ones who misrepresented their product and are now failing to make it right. Not exactly the Lee Valley experience. Rant off, JG

[George]

Well, starting in a hole you make with your drill might work.

To avoid customs with things router-dedicated, try:

rumor has it, purchases from there can cause growths on the head....

[Frank Ketchum]

I have done this with my homemade circle jig since I don't have a plunge type router either. With the router running just above the surface, twist the base to plunge it into the workpiece. What's the big deal?

Frank

[Mike in Mystic]

That does sound a bit wrong on the way they handled things. I was curious to see what the jig looked like and pulled up their website. Is this item #

415? Listed at $69.99 US?

Anyway, that tech guys suggestion about lowering it while running is actually perfectly reasonable, now that I see the picture. The router plate that it comes with appears to be secured to the pivoting arm. If you simply rotate the router motor in its base so the bit isn't touching the material and then turn it on and rotate it slowly to the depth you need, it really isn't unsafe at all and seems like it will work fine. In fact, that seems to be exactly how you have to use it (with a fixed base router).

My point is, unless you already sent it back, you should give it a try and I bet you'll see it works just fine.

Mike

[DarylRos]

I agree. Before ranting that a product does not work, you should see if it does. Sometimes, we have preconceived notions of how a tool works. The Woodhaven people really know routers.

Lowering a spinning router with a fixed base into a large board is probably not dangerous, just different and awkward. Remember, a plunge bit is designed to plunge into wood. Or use an upcut spiral bit. Both are MEANT to be used that way.

If you are using routers, I would think it makes more sense to spend the bucks on a plunge base as accessory number one before getting anything else (except maybe a fence).

[JGS]

Hi Guys, Yes it is item 415K. The pivot pin on their unit is too short to allow you to raise the router at all. The arm has zero flex, so you cannot twist it. That is how I started the cut with my $2 hardboard jig. As to removing (or almost removing) the motor from the router base (PC690), starting the motor and then reinserting it back into the router base while plunging it through some material, in addition to being scary would require two hands, therefore I would need someone else to hold the pivot pin and the jig's base plate. However, as it is such a PITA to return it maybe I'll give it another look the next time someone drops by. Cheers, JG

Mike > That does sound a bit wrong on the way they handled things. I was curious

[James D Kountz]

You have a legitimate gripe there no doubt but on the other hand depending on how your raise/lower works on your router (usually turning the motor/ring) this is not a big deal to do on a non plunge. Think about it, if it were a plunge you would still lower the bit down with it running. Now I do realize that the plunging action is a lot smoother and easier but all the same this action can be done on a non plunge router too. Just thought Id throw that in.

Jim

[Mike in Mystic]

Maybe I'm missing something, I don't know.

I didn't ever mean to try to raise the whole router, with the baseplate, with the motor locked into the router housing.

I mean you should unlock the motor, rotate the motor upwards so the bit is above the work. If you have to use a shorter bit to start off, then so be it, but you shouldn't have to "almost remove" the motor at all.

As far as needing two hands, I don't agree. You just hold onto the baseplate with one hand and rotate the motor with the other, when you reach the depth you want, hold the motor stationary and then lock it down with your other hand. I'm not sure what you mean by needing to hold the pivot pin, does it not have means to lock it down? The way I'm thinking of it, the only thing that would move is the router motor, not the base and no flexion should result on the pivot arm. I've done similar things to make stopped dadoes for shelving. I had guide fences sete up on both sides of the router base, set the router down on the material with the bit retracted, lowered the motor after turning it on until I hit the depth I needed (using the depth ring, which I had set to zero earlier with the bit on the surface of the material), and locked it down and made my cut.

Anyway, it sounds to me like you might have simply misunderstood the tech guy from Woodhaven (or maybe he didn't really make it clear, I don't know) and/or you just don't want to make the cut this way, which is fair, I suppose. I think we're all (those you responded telling you to try it this way) just trying to allay your fears and ensure you that if you just take your time this type of cut isn't really difficult, nor dangerous.

Mike

[Bay Area Dave]

drill a hole first!

dave

JGS wrote:

[Daniel Martin]

You did mention Lee Valley at the end of your post. I did see LV selling what you are looking for and it would have been much easier to deal with them. You wouldn't have customs to deal with.

As a Canadian I see no advantage of buying American unless it's a product that we do not have here locally.

Daniel

[Rob]

I have bought quite a few things from Woodhaven and found their products to be of very high quality. The one time I had a problem, they provided outstanding customer service.

I rank them with the best in the industry.

Rob

[JGS]

[JGS]

Hi Again Mike, Thanks for the in-depth description. I think I should explain what I had in mind for the jig. The intended use of this jig is to help me make round table tops ranging in size from 24-42 inches. They are up to 2" thick. This means I would have to raise the motor at least the 2". I start by making a rough cut to within 1/16 - 1/8" of the intended circumference with a saw and then switch to the router. Maybe I am being just a big chicken. Now if I was cutting shallow groves in a piece that would be a different story. Others have suggested drilling a hole to start. I know this could work with some trial and error (the hole has to be in exactly the right place) but the jig was suppose to make the operation simpler with less chance of error and to stream line the operation. Cheers, JG

Mike > Maybe I'm missing something, I don't know.

[George]

Trial and what? Draw the circle you're going to cut and bore the hole (larger than your bit) tangent.

Before I got a plunge I used it often, and it was a piece of cake.

Second method is the one often used for bandsaw jigs, where one side of the wood is tangent to the circumference, providing a starting point. You place the center point of your router jig by dragging the bit up to the edge. Also works fine, though with either method you are best advised to have a firm grip on the router as you start.

[Bridger]

how about using the jig to make the first trimming cut about 1/2" deep, then finishing with a top bearing pattern bit with the bearing following the first cut? Bridger

[Stuart Wheaton]

Use the nifty jig to make a template for the table out of 1/2" MDF or similar. Screw or tape the template to the table blank, and use a flush trim bit to cut your tabletop. Save the templates, and label them for diameter.