Why wood prices are going up

Page 6 of 7  

: The concept of fighting wars, even broad ones against terrorism, away from : these shores if possible, is a good one. Sure, it cost's money, lots of it, : and lives ... but a damn sight fewer of _our_ women and children are lost : that way. How soon you forget.
Give one fully documented reason to think that if we hadn't invaded Iraq, any American woman or child (or man, for that matter) would have died as a result of Iraqi actions. There are no weapons of mass destruction. There is increasing evidence that any WMD were destroyed in the early 1990s. There is no evidence for the procurement of nuclear weapons-grade uranium by Hussein. Etc. Al Quaeda tried to kill Hussein, not bond with him. And so on.
Hundreds of patriotic soldiers have died in a war that was based on lies. Anyone who really cares about US safety, and the strength and morale of our troops, should be appalled. Every single soldier who died in the Iraq war, and in the phenomenally bungled postwar situation, died in vain.
    -- Andy Barss
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We attacked Iraq so Israel wouldn't have to.
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Unfortunately, Israel would most likely have gotten their target with fewer casualties......
We missed Bin Laden and Saddam.
Gary

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The problem is if this war had been started by Israel it would end up being WWIII. We would certainly be backing them and that would put us squarely against a billion muslims. With us starting the war, citing 9-11 we had some small plausible deniability that it was another crusade. Don't get me wrong, I still think this whole thing was a dumb idea. Another war without an exit strategy any no clear objectives.

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-- Is there no way that you can keep yourself from using this newsgroup as a place to vent on politics? At least mark it with OT
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wrote:

Is there no way that you can keep yourself from posting this same tripe every time you read something you don't like? At least skip over it, and don't bother the rest of us.
Furthermore, you've already proven that it doesn't make any difference if it *is* marked OT, you're still gonna whine and moan about it anyway.
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You seem to spend more time worrying about it than doing anything else. It sure seems like you enjoy it.

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-- Is there no way that you can keep yourself from using this newsgroup as a place to vent on politics? At least mark it with OT
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the second time in as many minutes, thereby inviting this response:
PLONK
-- Regards, Doug Miller (alphageek-at-milmac-dot-com)
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on his

That's exactly my point, the good times weren't due to Clinton, but the bad times aren't due to Bush and vice versa. Economic trends of the magnitude of the 90's boom and the current downturn are way beyond the influence of the President, regardless of what brand of idiot they are.

if
Pharmaceutical companies do nothing of the sort, at least not in general and in actuality not even very often. They spend billions of dollars a year funding research to find medicines. They don't HAVE to do that, you know. It's a business, though, which it seems to me that most people forget, particularly the individuals who think everything should be controlled or damn near free. Just because John Doe from Somewhereville, USA happens to have a need for a particular drug that the big bad pharma company makes and can't afford it doesn't entitle him to get it for free. In the end, any price controls and other various forms of government intervention will simply result in fewer drugs being developed, plain and simple. Why would businesses choose to remain in an industry that won't allow them to grow and compete? personally, the socialistic approach to health care that several European nations and Canda utilize is horrid. So, basically, the elderly "give me my drugs for free" crowd is likely going to have an impact on my grandchildren maybe having a disease that they have no treatment for. Thanks a lot.

rush starting very,

jobs
That's the only good thing I can think of resulting from the aging of the over bred generation.

and
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Mike in Mystic warbles:

Sure they do. Where do they get their new drugs if they don't?

Ah, but if he's able to drive to Canada he gets it for less than half price.
Why is that? Because our marvelous pharmaceutical companies think the U.S. is the font of drug research blessings for the entire world, that's why.

Nonsense. Profits may drop if drug prices are stabilized throughout the world, but the drug companies are NOT about to stop developing their only source of income.

How?
WTF does that mean? Over-bred? Compared to the whining ninnies of younger generations, or what? Or are they like German shepherds and we can expect hip displacia at a young age and in many?
Charlie Self
"Patriotism is not short, frenzied outbursts of emotion, but the tranquil and steady dedication of a lifetime. " Adlai E. Stevenson
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and
know.
They are in business to grow revenues. If the government stops them from doing that freely, then the attractiveness of the business is greatly reduced. If you add up all the assets of Pfizer (the company I happen to work for, so I do have some insight here), it is only about 60% of their market capitalization. The other 40% is from shareholders opinion of our growth, our future revenues. If the government limits our ability to grow, then we become a bad investment.

and
price.
is
This opinon of yours is so misguided and inaccurate it literally made me laugh out loud. The pharmaceutical companies are in those markets because there is a potential to make a profit. Sure, the free market of the US might bear some of the burden in this system, but if a large enough population starts going to Canada and reduces profits in the US, all the pharmaceutical companies are going to do is to either stop offering their drugs in those markets (this is the most likely scenario), or attempt to negotiate with those markets for different trade practices. Either way, consumers going to Canada is only ensuring one thing - that they are compromising their health by increasing the likelihood that they get duped by some illegitimate third-party schlepping cheap drugs in front of their faces.

world,
of
They might not STOP, but they might have to lay-off hundreds of thousdands of employees and greatly scale back their research and production activities. Sort of like the airlines. They didn't stop flying, but they changed their ways to deal with the situation. I'm sure you're looking forward to a government controlled airline, too.

I only have experience in a limited number of locations personally, but have been told first-hand from friends that have dealt with these things. A friend of mine in England, for example, needed surgery that was deemed "elective". He was in a great deal of pain, but it wasn't life threatening. So, he waited almost a YEAR!! to get the surgery. He looked up the same surgery and procedures in the US and found he would have likely had the surgery within a week in the US. For my own part, I was in Quebec on vacation and came down with a extremely serious illness and had to go to the hospital for some blood tests. They had blood analyzers on the receptionist counter so that the charge nurse (if that's what they're called) could analyze samples in between answering phones, filling out paperwork, checking in patients, etc. And, they insisted I pay in cash in full before they would even let me in the phlebotomy chair. And they charged me up the ass, thank you very much! But, that's beside the point. My point is that socialist-run medicine means fewer choices and likely mediocre at best services. Are you really willing to go that route in the US, just so you can save some money on prescriptions? I know you'll say "prescriptions are one thing, the medical system is another", but I beg to differ. The two are related, and it isn't too hard to see how letting the government control one aspect will likely lead to them getting their hands on everything.

hip
I just mean that the burden on our society by the lapsing social security system, other social systems, un-insured individuals, etc. by the "baby boomers" scares me to death. I really wonder lately listening to the more aged of my colleagues and their paranoid, almost terrified, view of their existences whether our nation will make it through their ability to screw up the country. Do you really want a bunch of geriatrics having the power to influence decision making legislation? Last I checked, only a slim minority of the let's say 70+ crowd really thought too much about the future other than their own. My grandmother lived to be 89 and the last about 10 years of her life were spent being terrified of anyone under the age of 35. I guess "they" will have their chance to get all of us "young'uns" back soon enough.
Mike

and
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Mike in Mystic responds:

Actually, what they're trying to do is force the feds to control the market for them.
You can laugh, but your opinion is based on inside information that stops at the walls of your office or lab.

I've heard this one time and again and seen neither proof nor any kind of rationale. The cheap drugs being schlepped are the cheap drugs manufactured by divisions of U.S. companies in other countries. Or they're from non-U.S. companies where the U.S. division is the overseas unit.

I'm not looking forward to a government controlled anything, but I'd sure as hell like to see a medical set up in this country that works for everyone: the most recent figures I've seen tell me that 41+ million Americans are without health insurance. From personal experience, I can tell you that can be both painful and expensive. The expense comes from the medical community having allowed insurance companies to lock them in in charges for insureds. Thus, if you're between policies for any reason, and you're not on the dole, you pay from two to three times the insurance established cost for medical treatment.

Jesus. I wonder why!
Charlie Self
"Patriotism is not short, frenzied outbursts of emotion, but the tranquil and steady dedication of a lifetime. " Adlai E. Stevenson
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general
year
grow,
U.S.
I recall a CBS 60 Minutes episode many years ago about counterfeit drugs sold by U.S. wholesalers to U.S. pharmacies. Also, do you remember the cancer medication that was diluted by a pharmacist in the U.S. to increase his already obscene profit margins?
Several Republican politicians and pharmaceutical companies raise this dire warning about the potential of counterfeit drugs from Canadian pharmacies, but, when asked to cite specific cases, they can't. Can you? If not, then where is it more dangerous to buy drugs?

source
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tranquil
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They spend more on marketing than research of late.
Tell me why an "established', been-around-a while-medicine went from ~ $40 to $200 in about a year?
Renata
On Fri, 19 Sep 2003 21:09:17 GMT, "Mike in Mystic"
--snip--

(no stain for email)
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In rec.woodworking
Interesting how he sees that the pharma companies spend billions on research and yet he doesn't see that the oil companies do the same drilling dry holes.

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Renata notes:

Lewt' not attritubte to me that which is not mine. I said that drug companies screwed the consumer. The rest of it was someone else's take.

I'd love to know, too. Kind of like why I can get my VIoxx shipped in from NZ for $132, while the same prescrip costs 3 times that here in the states, with shipping.
Charlie Self
"Don't hit at all if it is honorably possible to avoid hitting; but never hit soft." Theodore Roosevelt
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bad
help
and
and
and
I lived most of my life under the Canadian healthcare system, and it worked very well for me. And I *never* personally knew anyone who was mistreated in any way. Now that I live in the U.S., I heard lots of horror stories about people turned away because of inadequate or no insurance. In my opinion, it is the U.S. system which is horrid.
So, basically, the elderly

tranquil
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On 19 Sep 2003 18:19:21 GMT, snipped-for-privacy@aol.comnotforme (Charlie Self) pixelated:

Oh, SHIT! You can NOT be serious, Mike.

(big sigh...)
Very shortly now, we're going to have a death count from the Little Shrubbery War which is higher than the WTC attack. The sad fact is that VERY little has been done to actually PROTECT us because there is no way TO protect a free society. One person can break into an armory (explosives cache, etc.) and find enough boom booms to level half a city, then be halfway across the country before it was found out. One errant soldier could do even worse damage. What if that tank in LoCal a couple years ago was fully armed and he wanted to do damage? He could have leveled several city blocks before a rocket took him out.
Look how long it took to stop a simple sniper last year!
No, we're throwing away billions on false wars and false defenses and it's making me sick. The terrorist are gettig their way. We are no longer an entirely free nation and we're tossing more and more of our freedoms and rights away with each new bill through congress. As a country, we let fear stop us from living and moving about. It's absolutely assinine. Wake UP, boys & girls.
I'm voting ANYBODY BUT BUSH at the next election. I hope we have someone actually -worth- a vote by then, but I'm not holding my breath.
----------------------------------------- Jack Kevorkian for Congressional physician! http://www.diversify.com Wondrous Website Design ================================================
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Charlie Self wrote:

Agreed. $60 a freaking PILL?! For 15 cents worth of chemicals.

IME so far, the boomers aren't going anywhere until they die. I don't know anybody who has the slightest illusion of being able to retire.
The whole stock market thing didn't help either. Dad, for example, lost almost all of his retirement money to the downturn. At best, he can't retire until things pick back up, and more practically he's figuring on working until at least 10 years after his death.
--
Michael McIntyre ---- Silvan < snipped-for-privacy@users.sourceforge.net>
Linux fanatic, and certified Geek; registered Linux user #243621
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