What's up with price of solvents?

[todd]

You seem to have trouble sticking to the topic. The topic is about the price of solvents, which are directly related to the price of petroleum. The price of petroleum isn't set by what some hand-wringers decide is a "fair" price. It's set by a worldwide market. A large part of the market price depends on the current state of supply and demand (among other factors). If you don't believe that's the case, I don't know what else to say.

As for your widgets, you can sell them for whatever price you want. You can operate as a charity if you wish.

todd

[Tom Nie]

How does Supply & Demand account for the rate of Medical cost increases? How do you justify the fuel situation following Katrina? Contrived collusion? Opportunistic pricing? Blaming SUV's is simply simplistic.

Computers, etc. can drop 90% and their effect would be miniscule compared to the insiduous multiple effects of medical and fuel. Aside from what is personally spent on these two there are the hidden expenses within any product's price for these two. Look at the corporations, even municipalities, that are escaping from including medical benefits for retirees, even present workers.

We have anti-trust laws because Supply & Demand works fine - only to a point. We had price controls in the past because the market got out of hand.

Our Balance of Payments has been out of whack for so long that the world has purchased the U.S. with their excess dollars instead of conquering it. What American "named" company is actually owned by an American company any more? Politicians are influenced by Big Money and the BM isn't ours anymore. We're like the dog carrying ticks around. Doesn't that also make it convenient that we're supposed to be the world's watchdog? Run up still more debt to pay for that role? And if that role is opposite your position then it makes us a handy scapegoat for you to hate and protest. That way you're burning our flag instead of someone else's.

Son, this ain't your daddy's WWII world anymore.

[Chuck Taylor]

[shrugs] I said *able*. Where I live, I'm (mostly) free to decide for myself what to do with my own money, even if I choose to indulge my greed.

[Chris Friesen]

Actually, supply & demand exactly accounts for medical cost increases and fuel costs.

Companies are mostly amoral, and they have limited production capacity. Therefore, the way to maximize profits is to jack up the price until the (profit_per_unit * units_sold) reaches a maximum. There is a demand for petroleum products and high-priced advanced medicine (wonder drugs, MRI, specialists, etc.), so the "price_per_unit" can be staggeringly high without driving people away.

If you're willing to settle for a lower level of medical care, the costs drop substantially.

If fewer people drove cars, the price of gas would likely be lower. (Now at some point you'd lose the advantages of economies of scale, so there is a lower limit.)

I suspect the only reason gas isn't *more* expensive is fear of political backlash from the consumers. Note that in europe it's easily

2-2.5 times as expensive as in North America, while in Venezuela they pay around 5 cents a litre because the oil wells are state-owned.

Chris

[Juergen Hannappel]

[... Market explained]

So for all the market advocates: learn german and read:

Wenn ist das Nunstruck git und Slotermeyer? Ja!... Beiherhund das Oder die Flipperwaldt gersput.

[Locutus]

So when does "savings" become "greed"? If you have savings you are obviously making more than you need right?

[George]

Nope, not so. Big new players in the demand side, cartel on the supply with oil, and all kinds of new risks.

It might help you to reflect on the fact that the US is the "greediest" nation in terms of use of all resources. It's US who are offering the $105 per widget, a sum Brazil and Burma (Myanmar) cannot begin to pay for them. If you seek the face of greed, you shave it every morning....

[George]

SNIP

Back in the USSR, a medical doctor's worth to the system was the determinant in computing their pay. They made less than second-level supervisors in factories, whose purchased diligence could be measured in output.

Of course, even before Levis and Marlboros, the Soviets I traveled with wanted OTC antihistamines, aspirins, decongestants. Or if female, cosmetics.

[John McCoy]

Brian Elfert wrote in news: [e-mail]:

Per the DoE, you're 3 cents below the national average (for last week, the DoE's numbers are always a week out of date). So you might want to rethink "pretty high compared to the rest of the USA" :-)

$2.97 sounds like New England somewhere, or perhaps Cal. Here abouts (S Fla) it's $2.70 something.

John

(willing to bet your gas price is less than our $2.63, too)

[Tom Nie]

Explain this one to me. Diesel is poorly refined gasoline - sorta. Why have I been paying so much MORE for diesel, an inferior product?

Could it be that user group has the least control over its consumption (trucks & commercial users)?

[Locutus]

Actually I have heard it depends on your area, where I am at, diesel is quite frequently cheaper than regular gasoline. Or at least slower to respond to price increases (and decreases).

[David]

[Tom Nie]

David, That's cool. A good bit of sensible, some gobbledygook smokescreen, and then, against presented reason, the cool bottom line, "because we can".

A constructive, informative reply. Thanks. TomNie

[DouginUtah]

Diesel has more BTUs per gallon. There are also other reasons.

[Tom Nie]

Doug, That may be but has nothing to do with the dollars and cents of production which if simpler means less. Or put another way, as soon as they have to do or add anything they use that for price justification - the reciprocal would be less is cheaper. TomNie

Diesel has more BTUs per gallon. There are also other reasons.

[George]

Fleets and airlines buy diesel (or jet fuel) on long-term contracts, so the oil refineries have to raise the price of the market stuff to try and recover something during cost increases.

All refining is the same, just depends on how high up the column you tap. Of course, if you "crack" the heavy stuff to meet the demand for gas, there's less available for heavier fractions.

Note that, as with gas, the greatest profit goes to the tax man who invests nothing, risks nothing, does nothing except collect. Then back to you as highways, if your congresscritter has pull ....

[Robatoy]

I only shave my *own* Canadian/Dutch face. Who'd let me near them with a razor...especially a straight razor? I have been called lots of things in my life...but greedy? Nope.

[Leon]

That is the point I was trying to make. ;~) I'll take all that I can get but more than needed is not greed. IMHO greed is forcing your customers to pay more than they are comfortable with when your profit margin is high.

[Leon]

I understand what you are getting at but, let me give another example. My wife has a relative inexpensive long arm sewing machine. Nice piece of equipment but no where near the labor or materials to manufacture it than say a stationary planer. The sewing machine cost $7,000.00. Other sewing machines in its league easily top $20,000.00.

[Leon]

Now because the diesel fuels are having to be reformulated just like the process that gasoline has been going through over the last several years. IIRC the diesel has to be reformulated to reduce or eliminate the sulfur emissions.