What's up with LV forstner bits?

[wood_newbie]

I thought the whole point of a forstner bit was that it would drill a non-through hole with a flat bottom? (Except for the brad point in the middle.)

I ordered a set of forstner bits from Lee Valley that came in today, and their chippers are about 10 - 12 degrees off of straight. My first thought was that, hey, maybe (probably!) LV knows a lot more about drilling angles than I do, and maybe somehow these will still drill a flat-bottomed hole.

Not even close...the hole has the obvious brad point "divot," and then the bottom slopes downward towards the rim by about 10 - 12 degrees.

Am I missing something here? Does anyone else have any experience with these bits?

Not only that, but the 1/2" bit didn't have a smooth rim...there was a decent-sized divot on it.

These bits are made in China, which I didn't know in advance or I certainly wouldn't have bought them. (Let's be fair...LV doesn't claim they're of US or Canadian origin.)

Lee Valley is a great outfit...I've bought enough of their products to say that unequivocally. But can anyone enlighten me on why these bits are "shaped" like this? Are anyone else's forstners shaped like this?

Thanks in advance.

[PDQ]

Take them back. LV will either refund or replace them.

--=20 PDQ

-- wrote in message = news: [e-mail]... | I thought the whole point of a forstner bit was that it would drill a | non-through hole with a flat bottom? (Except for the brad point in = the | middle.) |=20 | I ordered a set of forstner bits from Lee Valley that came in today, | and their chippers are about 10 - 12 degrees off of straight. My = first | thought was that, hey, maybe (probably!) LV knows a lot more about | drilling angles than I do, and maybe somehow these will still drill a | flat-bottomed hole. |=20 | Not even close...the hole has the obvious brad point "divot," and then | the bottom slopes downward towards the rim by about 10 - 12 degrees. |=20 | Am I missing something here? Does anyone else have any experience = with | these bits? |=20 | Not only that, but the 1/2" bit didn't have a smooth rim...there was a | decent-sized divot on it. |=20 | These bits are made in China, which I didn't know in advance or I | certainly wouldn't have bought them. (Let's be fair...LV doesn't = claim | they're of US or Canadian origin.) |=20 | Lee Valley is a great outfit...I've bought enough of their products to | say that unequivocally. But can anyone enlighten me on why these bits | are "shaped" like this? Are anyone else's forstners shaped like this? |=20 | Thanks in advance. |

[Chris Friesen]

Coincidentally, I just bought a set of these and they were fine. Flat bottom holes, smooth rims.

I'd take yours back and get them replaced.

Chris

[James "Cubby" Culbertson]

I have some of their Forstner bits and get flat bottomed holes (except the divot of course). I'd take them back and show them what's going on. Cheers, cc

[Leon]

By forstner you do mean forstner and not the saw tooth bits, right. There are many look alike forstner bits that do not deliver the results of a true forstner bit.

[Doug Payne]

Indeed. The LV description of their sawtooth bits seems to indicate that they *won't* drill a completely-flat-bottomed hole:

"Both styles have slightly sloped chipping bevels so that bits ride a shallow cone of wood to keep them boring straight. Center brads can then be shorter, increasing bit versatility in thin material."

[wood_newbie]

because I was reading the other page on their forstner bits, where they specifically say, "The bit gives a cleanly cut, flat-bottomed hole ideal for plugging."

even show a picture of a perfectly flat-bottomed hole as a feature.

Regardless, I don't know who the hell would knowingly buy a forstner bit that drilled a volcano-bottomed hole into a board, so these will go back.

This is the second time I've found an error in the specs/descriptions Lee Valley provides in their catalogue. On their low-angle block plane, they advertise the blade as being a 25-degree bevel. In reality, it's a 23-degree bevel with a 2-degree micro bevel. I found that out when I bought their MKII sharpening jig, only to find it didn't have a pre-set angle to sharpen their own blade. That certainly wasn't a big enough deal to warrant a return, but the volcano bits are going back.

[Leon]

Yeah, the page you linked to should perhaps say Forstner and Saw Toot bits rather than Forstner/Saw Tooth Bits. And the illustrations should differentiate between the two.

Some people don't care if the bottom is flat or not but would prefer the saw tooth design and the advantages that come with it. I literally drill thousands of 1-3/8" wide holes for Euro stile hinges. I am not too concerned with a flat bottom as the top of the hinge holds the hinge flat with the surface. I only need clean holes that are deep enough to accept the hinge.

[PDQ]

While I agree with your sentiments, I must say that I have both the = 'true' forstner and a set of 'look-alike' saw tooth bits and I find both = to be excellent for their intended purposes.

The former go up to 1.5 inches and the latter go on up to 3 inches. I = find the saw tooth ones much better in boring the big holes as they let = the heat out and chew in better on the big holes.

When one wants clean and flat holes, nothing beats a forstner and a = drill press.

--=20 PDQ

[PDQ]

| > Indeed. The LV description of their sawtooth bits seems to indicate = that | > they *won't* drill a completely-flat-bottomed hole: | >

| > "Both styles have slightly sloped chipping bevels so that bits ride = a | > shallow cone of wood to keep them boring straight. Center brads can = then | > be shorter, increasing bit versatility in thin material." | >

| > =

|=20| You're right, Doug...I didn't see that part. However, that may be | because I was reading the other page on their forstner bits, where = they | specifically say, "The bit gives a cleanly cut, flat-bottomed hole | ideal for plugging." |=20 | = |=20| Then even show a picture of a perfectly flat-bottomed hole as a | feature. |=20 | Regardless, I don't know who the hell would knowingly buy a forstner | bit that drilled a volcano-bottomed hole into a board, so these will = go | back. |=20 | This is the second time I've found an error in the specs/descriptions | Lee Valley provides in their catalogue. On their low-angle block | plane, they advertise the blade as being a 25-degree bevel. In | reality, it's a 23-degree bevel with a 2-degree micro bevel. I found | that out when I bought their MKII sharpening jig, only to find it | didn't have a pre-set angle to sharpen their own blade. That = certainly | wasn't a big enough deal to warrant a return, but the volcano bits are | going back. |=20

Is it possible that these pointy 'forstners' are for drilling dowel = holes?

--=20 PDQ

[Chris Friesen]

I just checked the bits I bought this past week.

The bevels are indeed slightly sloped, but it's on the order of 1-2 degrees. Certainly not the 10-12 degrees originally mentioned.

Chris

[Chris Friesen]

I noticed this as well on the blade for the low-angle jack. The same is true for the higher-angle blade.

I was actually pleased as it made sharpening easier. I found a setting between the original blade bevel and the "nominal" bevel, and used that for my initial bevel. Since the original bevel is shallower, it means I don't have to remove as much metal.

Chris

[Michael Daly]

While the page is a tad confusing, that paragraph is discussing Forstner bits. The Saw-tooth bits are discussed in the paragraph that follows and does not say anything about a flat-bottomed hole.

Mike

[Chris Friesen]

While the saw tooth section doesn't specifically mention flat-bottomed holes, the pictures are pretty clear that the chippers on both of them are almost flat.

Chris

[AAvK]

These are some excellent bits, high speed steel saw tooth forstners made in China by Oldham:

(best price) drilled 12 mortises in douglas fir, sizes including 1" (bit size) x 4-1/4" and

2-2/5", 7 to 9 dips and no sharpening needed yet. These are hard steel, definitely flat cutters and no volcanos.

[John Wilson]

While I agree with your sentiments, I must say that I have both the 'true' forstner and a set of 'look-alike' saw tooth bits and I find both to be excellent for their intended purposes.

The former go up to 1.5 inches and the latter go on up to 3 inches. I find the saw tooth ones much better in boring the big holes as they let the heat out and chew in better on the big holes.

When one wants clean and flat holes, nothing beats a forstner and a drill press.

[Leon]

You might want to up your standards some what. I have a forstner bit set that I know that I have drilled over 1000 holes in Oak and MDF with a single 1-3/8" bit and it still cuts fine, with no resharpening. This is a

15+ year old set that I paid $79 from Trendlines, German steel.

[AAvK]

1-3/8" bit and it still cuts fine, with no

Hey, that's cool! glad you got the right deal. My point is realistic as a test and approval, however, and why pay that much for the LV bits if they are Chinese, if the Oldhams are as well, Chinese? You got a spare 40 bucks, pick up the set I recommend and test the shit out of them, OK? They are still hard HSS for the money, and just as Chinese.

Besides all that I realize the quality for price you express, and what you understand to be my shortcoming in understanding, but I am a new learner. See the sig?

[wood_newbie]

Leon, I can't seem to find anything on Trendlines...are they still in business?

[AAvK]

I did the research... "no" they're not.

was their site. I called all three 'phone numbers and they have all been recycled too.