Vacuum dust coll. system

I'm finishing up the building of my new hobby shop in the backyard and I want to eventually add a vacuum system. My building is small, the area that I have reserved for woodworking after the storage area is occupied will only be about 10x18 which is basically a big room....not a man-sized woodshop but I'll make it work with some good organizing and strategic location of tools etc. What I what to do is setup some sort of a basic vacuum system using a good shop vac. While doing some research on the net I ran across this idea at Tyler Tool's website. http://tylertool.store.yahoo.com/sh80sawducos.html It looks to be something workable for my needs but I would like some advice or possibly some better ideas or suggestions, maybe from past or current experiences. I can't afford or justify a regular dust collection system unless there is something available that is comparable in price with this setup. I would have about $135 or so wrapped up a Shop Vac system from this site using their dust collection system and a QSP vac (w/2 1/2" dia. hose). TIA -- Thanks, Rick
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On Sun, 25 Jul 2004 14:29:27 GMT, "Rick P."
eventually add a vacuum system. My building is small, the area that I have reserved for woodworking after the storage area is occupied will only be about 10x18 which is basically a big room....not a man-sized woodshop but I'll make it work with some good organizing and strategic location of tools etc. What I what to do is setup some sort of a basic vacuum system using a good shop vac. While doing some research on the net I ran across this idea at Tyler Tool's website. http://tylertool.store.yahoo.com/sh80sawducos.html

possibly some better ideas or suggestions, maybe from past or current experiences. I can't afford or justify a regular dust collection system unless there is something available that is comparable in price with this setup. I would have about $135 or so wrapped up a Shop Vac system from this site using their dust collection system and a QSP vac (w/2 1/2" dia. hose).

this: http://tinyurl.com/53txb and this: http://tinyurl.com/6t7pd
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snipped-for-privacy@thanks.com wrote in news:jkm7g0d03j9gpr12rqnfb4n780tfho5kqg@ 4ax.com:

But 30 micron is about 100 times too big. I think you need better filtration than 30 microns.
--
Best regards
Han
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30 micron filtration is better than no filtration at all. You can buy lower micron bags to fit. Greg
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ranted:

Not if it gives you a false sense of security. You can end up doing more damage thinking you're safe.
- The advantage of exercising every day is that you die healthier. ------------ http://diversify.com Dynamic Websites, PHP Apps, MySQL databases
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calmly

lower
So it is better to just blow the dust all over the shop than catching the majority of it? Many people would not have dust collection at all if they HAD to have .5 micron collection abilities. Most wood workers I know just let the dust fly, no collection, no dust masks. I feel a bunch better with my 30 micron bags than no dust collector at all! The air is cleaner with my 30 micron bags than with nothing. Sure, some of the small, gonna get you later dust is still in the air, but in much smaller amounts than before. Greg
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ranted:

What part of the "not if" clause did you miss, Greg?

Of course you do, and because of that, you're breathing in much more of the fine dust that it doesn't catch because you THINK it's safer.

Yes, the air is cleaner with the DC, but it's not at all _safer_. Do what you want, but please don't fool yourself.
ALL of the finer dust is still in the air and you can prove it to yourself with some talc. Wait until the shop is filled with good bright sunlight and turn the dust collector on. Toss a handful of talc, powdered sugar, or cornstarch into it and see the results in the sunshine. The entire room will fill with little white floaties.
So, the best of luck to you. Life is hell with bad lungs.
- The advantage of exercising every day is that you die healthier. ------------ http://diversify.com Dynamic Websites, PHP Apps, MySQL databases
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calmly

all!
of
smaller
Well I know the air is cleaner with the DC than without. I never used a collector before, or a mask. My nose is proff of cleaner air. Before after spending a day in the shop my nose would be packed full af crap, now When I give it a good blow, it is clean as a whistle. Dust is the last thing I am worried about! I figure 480 volts, a fall from a 30ft ladder, or some old lady running me over while I am on my motorcycle will get me first! Greg
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Greg O wrote:

The trouble is that the stuff that your nose fills with, while it is annoying, doesn't really hurt you--it gets caught by your nose, which is there for that purpose, and you get rid of it with a few good blows. The stuff that _hurts_ you is the fine stuff that gets past your nose and into your lungs and stays there. What your clean nose is telling is that there isn't anything in the air that it can capture--that's all. It's not telling you the air is _clean_.
If you only use your shop once every five years it's not really an issue. If you're making sawdust most days then it is a much bigger issue. And it's not so much a matter of "getting you" in the sense that you die as "getting you" in the sense that your quality of life becomes so miserable that dying becomes an attractive alternative to continued existence.
If you're not going to use decent filters then at least use a decent mask.
Find a pulmonologist and talk to him about this. See if he has any pictures of "brown lung" post mortems. Ask him for a bucket before you look at them--you may need it.

--
--John
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Mucus is no respecter of particle size. It'll trap anything it contacts. Thus, despite what SWMBO says, keep the hair in your nose long to create the turbulent flow which maximizes catch.
Might want to do some reading on what really hurts - inorganic particles and organic poisons. Not to mention that the data which shows a modest increase in emphysema is based on particulate environments where the air was opaque with suspended cotton/saw dust.

there
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George wrote:

Believe what you want to. They're your lungs. Just don't come crying to me when you've wrecked them.

--
--John
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Physiology is a fascinating study. Sad that you prefer ignorance.

me
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George wrote:

When you're coughing out what's left of your lungs into your oxygen mask and I'm not we'll see who is sad.

--
--John
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ranted:
I said:

It's what you don't see that can hurt you. Now that I've been away from cigarettes for 15 years (thankfully) my lungs are very sensitive to crap like that. I can't drill concrete unless I have my respirator on. It's another very fine dust.

OK, but if you get old and retire with horrible emphysema, remember that you could have saved yourself a LOT of trouble, time, and pain by investing $30 in a simple sub-micron bag years before.
Ciao!
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On Sun, 25 Jul 2004 14:29:27 GMT, "Rick P."
eventually add a vacuum system. My building is small, the area that I have reserved for woodworking after the storage area is occupied will only be about 10x18 which is basically a big room....not a man-sized woodshop but I'll make it work with some good organizing and strategic location of tools etc. What I what to do is setup some sort of a basic vacuum system using a good shop vac. While doing some research on the net I ran across this idea at Tyler Tool's website. http://tylertool.store.yahoo.com/sh80sawducos.html

possibly some better ideas or suggestions, maybe from past or current experiences. I can't afford or justify a regular dust collection system unless there is something available that is comparable in price with this setup. I would have about $135 or so wrapped up a Shop Vac system from this site using their dust collection system and a QSP vac (w/2 1/2" dia. hose).

\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\ Venture over to your local Sears or Home Depot and look at their clear plastic tubes and fittings that they sell to use a shop Vac as a dust collector... I run a real dust collector in my shop and have a second smaller 1 Hp DC dedicated to a planner and router table... BUT I also got damn tired of dragging my shop vac all over the shop ...when I needed to use the vac cleaner....
SO
I went over the Home Depot and spent a small fortune (13 little orange blast gates, umteeen connectors and tubes along with plenty of elbows etc... ).... I at least now have a central vac system in the shop where I can reach into every corner with a single 8 foot hose just by plugging in the hose to a blast gate...as I walk around the shop.
Works fine as a vac...
BUT PLEASE DO NOT even think this set up is a dust collector...it simply is not... By attaching it to your machines you will end up with a cleaner shop (but not a dust free or even close to dust free shop)..
My purpose (even with the 2 DC's and the vac system) was a cleaner shop...less sawdust on my clothes and on my shoes to be dragged into the house etc... NOT a dust free (and healthy) workplace...
My Vac system "sucks" much better then either of the DC's BUT it was not capable of removing much of the fine dust generated at the saw blade or router bit of my machines...
That said I am completely happy with my "Central Vac System" ..
Bob Griffiths
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I would consider the $99 portable 1hp dust collector from harbor freight. I bought the larger 2hp stationary version of that system and am very happy with the quality of it. I did lots of research before pulling the trigger, including searching this site for previous discussions on the unit, and lots of people were incredibly satisfied with it. I saw the portable unit up close, and considered it to be of very good construction quality. the advantage would be stronger suction, and the ability to run 4" ducting (note at the site they offer a $39 ducting set). With 4" you'll do much better getting the little stuff out of the air. Good luck. (sorry, I don't know why this didn't copy as a link! but here's the site)
http://order.harborfreight.com/EasyAsk/harborfreight/results.jsp?ts=Mon%20Jul%2026%2005:42:10%20PDT%202004

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Okay guys, thanks for all the info. I didn't mean to spark an indepth argument about health issues but some very good points were brought up that I will consider. In fact, the need for a shop vac still exists to help keep the area clean (plus cars etc.) so will get one, also, I think I will go with the 1hp portable DC either Grizzly, Delta or HF. I saw a nice Delta 1hp port. at Lowes yesterday for $119. That should be sufficient for the little bit of work I get to enjoy. Maybe if I am still experiencing a dust problem after that I can add a benchtop air filtration system. Thanks, Rick
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If you know someone in the hvac biz, or salvage, you can save a couple hundred bucks, if you need an overall room dust filter. Aquire an old heater/AC blower, mount in plywood box behind a filter arrangement. Hang from ceiling. I've seen plans online you could probably google. IIRC, you use several filters in series. I've also reaseached using 1 micron filters with such a setup, but the price of the filters makes it cheaper to buy the whole unit already built. Also, I've heard it's a good idea to have a time delay switch, so when you leave your shop for the day, the filter continues to clean the air for awhile, letting less dust settle.
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=============Both of my sons are HVAC Contractors...and I got my squirrle cage blowers for free...so I made a few filters ..plus I purchased a Delta Air cleaner prior to making a few of my own... The home made ones work about 90 percent as good as the Delta... without using any of the expensive bag filters... just plain old furnace filters...
I am NOT interested in protecting my Lungs in the workshop... BUT I enjoy working in a clean place...and if a clean place is better for my health it is a bonus I will accept...
\My comment on the home made ones working almost as good as the Delta ONLY is made frrom the amount of "dust" that accumulates on the filters in a given period of time... The reallity is that the Delta with its bag filter does remove the really small stuff better..BUT when I open the door to the shop in the morning I do not have any layer of dust on the table saws top etc... That is good enough for me...
The timers are EXTREMELY Important...mine run 2 hours after I turn off the lights...
Bob Griffiths
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