Uhhh, horrible flourescent lighting

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My opinion of fluorescent lighting: Can't stand it. Especially in my shop where it makes my wood look pale. When I'm knee-deep in a project and there's wood and shavings all over, fluorescent makes it look messy where incandescent gives everything a nice glow. I know the advantages of fluorescent but just not willing to put up with the dull mood it creates.
On a related note A client of mine just installed power-saver bulbs in his basement. I went down there and turned on the switch. I could see the bulbs came on but none of the light actually reached the floor, heh.
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Battleax said:

There are many color spectrums available in fluorescent bulbs. Tri-spectrum and broadband bulbs eliminate much of that washed out effect you get from cheap "shop lights". Which is why everyone from art departments to operating rooms to your local butcher uses them. And if you buy them from a commerical lighting supplier (not Grainer or the Borg), they are not expensive.
But to each his own... <g>

ES bulbs are NOT the same as real T-12's or T-8's - they're mostly a bad joke - a knee jerk reaction to increased energy costs in the 80's.
Lumens per watt are greatly increased over incandescent.
FWIW,
Greg G.
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and another xpert................. Howdy!

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The "dull mood" comes from the spectrum (mix of colors) given off by a "cool white" fluorescent tube. You might want to try a "warm white" tube which produces a yellowish color, or a "daylight" tube which produces a bluish color. There also is some variation between different manufacturers. I really like the spectrum given off by the GE branded compact fluorescent bulbs (ie. compatible with incandescent fixtures) from Menards. I have 9 of them in my kitchen. I also like the Feit brand.
In my shop, I use cool white, high output bulbs. Cold and dull, but with white walls and a gray concrete floor, I just want it bright.

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AL said:

I use T-8 5000k broad-spectrum bulbs - $3.05 each. Just like sunlight at noon - without the cancer. <g> They last for _years_ and no flicker - well, no visible flicker when they run at 22kHz on an electronic ballast. I HATE the strobing effect of magnetic ballasted lamps.
FWIW,
Greg G.
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another worthless opinion of ignorance extraordinaire battleass.
Just saying Hi!
BWAHAHAHAAAAAA

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electronic ballasts. Not the cheap HD type but from a local wholesale electric supplier. Man are they bright and the color is 5000k - very bright! Dave
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On Wed, 23 Nov 2005 14:00:14 -0500, "Battleax"

Spend the money for better bulbs.
Retail stores don't move much merchandise under dull, cold lighting. They figured out long ago that "True Color" fluorescent are worth the bucks.
Barry
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On Thu, 24 Nov 2005 12:35:14 +0000, Ba r r y wrote:

I've used the GE "Kitchen and Bath" bulbs both in the workshop and for lighting my model railroad. To my eye, they're very close to sunlight but I don't know the color temperature.
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On Wed, 23 Nov 2005 21:30:16 -0800, Larry Blanchard

Got any model RR photos on the web?
Years ago I was into that, and I still enjoy looking at other's stuff.
Sooo many interests... <G>
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On Thu, 24 Nov 2005 23:52:33 +0000, Ba r r y wrote:

Not many - some "under construction" types. See at:
http://www.intergate.com/~lard

Tell me about it. I recently picked up a new one - tropical fish. I guess I'll give up gardening to make time. Besides, I'm getting too old for shovel work :-).
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Need some guppies?
;-)
Go for the African cichlids or S.A. killifish... In my mind they're the most interesting. Or perhaps the mormyrids...
Or the Amazon cichlids...
Or...
--
Life. Nature's way of keeping meat fresh. -- Dr. Who

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On Thu, 24 Nov 2005 19:12:28 -0600, Dave Balderstone

Tinfoil barbs are also very cool. We had one that had gotten to frying pan size before we left Texas. Forgot what we got for it at the pet store when we moved. The cichlids were neat also, but the Barbs added an interesting splash of silver.
+--------------------------------------------------------------------------------+ If you're gonna be dumb, you better be tough +--------------------------------------------------------------------------------+
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On Thu, 24 Nov 2005 22:14:09 -0700, Mark & Juanita wrote:

Right now I have 3 empty tanks and am building stands for them (obligatory woodworking reference). The "display" 29 gallon in the livingroom will be various tetras. The 20H in my room will be forktail blue-eyes or a related species, and the 20L will be dwarf neon rainbows. All tanks will have some catfish for cleanup duties.
I do have a 10 gallon with a variety of fish and some #$#@! pond snails, and a 5.5 gallon with some female platys - the males are in the 10 gallon. After 3 generations I thought it was time to force them into celibacy :-).
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Larry Blanchard said:

Don't forget the Pl*co...

Inbreeding elicits strange effects after a few generations... [POT] Just ask the current administration. <g>
I have a few planted aquaria. Reef tanks are my passion, but moving in a few years kind of ruled those out...
This is the 75g in the Media Room. (That's the room with the 5 32" televisions sitting in the floor as back-up to the aging projection set - just can't bear to throw things away or sell them...)
http://webpages.charter.net/videodoctor/images/aquaplants_1_2l.jpg
Old picture - it's now a jungle in there... The fish are all hiding, but it's primarily various tetra species. Some of the fish in there are over 3.5 years old! The oldest is a small grey, wormlike loach that was shipped by accident to a pet store. I grabbed it up immediately, but alas, haven't been able to find a buddy for him.
The 29g in my office contains German blue ram cichlids, a few cory catfish, and a fast growing pl*co. And a few neurotic long finned zebra danios that SWMBO just HAD to have...<ughh..>
And to remain true to the original thread, it is lit by 4' T-8 5500k fluorescent tubes. They run for 12 hours a day for two years, and are then transferred to the shop, where they continue to function. I date the bulbs when installed, and some of the shop bulbs have dates of Jan 2002. I haven't had to toss one yet - but it's getting close...
FWIW,
Greg G.
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On Fri, 25 Nov 2005 13:17:50 -0500, Greg G. wrote:

Very nice. My 10 gallon looks like that, on a much smaller scale of course. And the larger tanks will too.
If anyone hasn't looked at Greg's tank picture yet, do so.
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What's that plant in the foreground? Hair Grass or some kind of Micro Sword?
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Bill Stock said:

It's a common micro sword - Echinodorus tennellus, The true hair grasses demand too much light for my meager budget.
The plant content includes:
Narrow Leaf Chain Sword (Echinodorus tennellus) Water Wisteria (Hygrophila difformis) Floating Hornwort (Ceratophyllum demersum). Anubias afzelli Anubias coffea Red Melon Sword (Echinodorus barthii) Amazon Sword (Echinodorus bleheri) Cryptocoryne lutea and other Cryptocoryne sp. There is a bit of loosestrife and bacopa as well.
Greg G.
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On Fri, 25 Nov 2005 21:18:13 -0500, Greg G. wrote:

Do you harvest handfuls of the stuff every few months? I do :-).
And I'm glad to hear it doesn't need a lot of light. Maybe I'll try some in a 20 with just a single 15 watt fluorescent.
I've got a 20 long that's very old (cost me $2 at a garage sale) and none of the commercial hoods/tops fit it. I'm going to build a top (woodworking reference) using four waterproof incandescent sockets and put the screw-in fluroescents in it. 60 watts for 20 gallons = lots of red plants :-).
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Larry Blanchard said:

I have a 32 gallon trash can at this very moment that is half full of it and other plants. I was selling the pulls on eBay for a while, just to get rid of it, but since I'm not selling Tektronix scopes at this time, it was too much trouble. Want some?

You might want to think about the screw-ins. You are free to do as you please, of course, but they are not rated for enclosed operation. The cheap-ass resistor ballasts get mighty warm in an enclosed space, and their light output it not optimal for this application. That twisted, contorted bulb is not very aquarium friendly. Remember that light striking the water's surface must do so within a certain range, or it bounces off. Also, I've found it difficult to find bulbs with the right color temperature - they range from 2700k to 3200k. Most are warm white, some are cool white, but none are tri-spectrum and I've never seen a 5000k screw-in. They heat the aquarium substantially without forced or convection ventilation..
I don't remember off-hand what the length of a 20L is, but common F20T12s should fit, as I recall. (24") BigAls has a selection of T-8 bulbs in unusual lengths. They are German made and sold by ZooMed. The only place I could get 5500k 30" T-8 bulbs to fit my 29g. I started with 4 bulbs and it was WAAAYYY too bright, I subsequently re-engineered for two tubes and everything is now happy. Even the chain swords became dwarfed and flattened - hated the excessive light. The fish weren't too fond of it either. Exceeding 10,000 lumens over a 29g made them rather jumpy...
I do build my own hoods, however, and bend my own reflectors. They are computer designed by me for aquarium use - 'cause the stuff that is sold for the aquarium market is such crap.
If you are interested, here are a couple of links to my reflector designs for T-8s and T-12s - complete with photon videos. <g>
http://www.thevideodoc.com/Images/T-8DualReflector.jpg
http://www.thevideodoc.com/Media/T-8DualReflector.mpg
http://www.thevideodoc.com/Images/T-12Reflector.jpg
http://www.thevideodoc.com/Media/T-12Reflector.mpg
FWIW,
Greg G.
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