TS-Aligner Fall 2007 Promotional Offer!

Hi Folks!

Every year I post a special offer here on rec.woodworking to show my appreciation for all your help and support. This year is no different.

TS-Aligner Fall 2007 10% Mail-in Rebate Offer!

Buy a Genuine TS-Aligner product and related accessories from any valid woodworking tools and equipment dealer between September 1, 2007 and December 31, 2007 and receive a 10% factory direct rebate. Any dealer will do, even if they have never sold TS-Aligner products before. Just have your favorite dealer give me a call or send me email. I'll provide them with everything they need to facilitate your purchase.

Follow this link for details:

formatting link
let me know if you have any questions or comments. If you think the group would benefit from the answer please feel free to post your question/comment here. I will keep track of this thread and answer promptly.

I will be posting reminders to this thread throughout the promotion to make sure that everyone who visits the wreck gets a chance to see it.

Thanks, Ed Bennett snipped-for-privacy@ts-aligner.com

formatting link
of the TS-Aligner

Reply to
Ed Bennett
Loading thread data ...
< fwiw soap box>

Ed, you're a good guy with a great product, but I gotta tell you, I've personally reached the point where I see "mail in rebate" and I immediately run the other way.

No way in hell I will ever buy _anything_ using that method of promotion.

< /fwiw soap box>

Sorry ... It ain't your fault, but you don't often get the opportunity to tell it to the horse's mouth. :)

Reply to
Swingman

Excellent product! I use my TS-Aligner Jr for EVERY project. I used it today to make sure my Osborne EB3 (miter gauge) was still square after laying around the shop for a while. Took me 5-10 minutes and I didn't have to make a single test cut.

No affiliation just a satisfied user.

Review:

formatting link

Reply to
GarageWoodworks

Me neither. Not knocking the product but that's why I buy much more stuff from Best Buy than Circuit City. An offered rebate is ignored.... the price had better be right to begin with or I ain't inclined to buy.

I've been screwed by big companies like Western Digital because I bought TWO instead of one hard drive (isn't that the point?). Wel, screw them... and that's my feeling toward any rebate offer I read.

There are better ways to promote a product.

Reply to
Mortimer Schnerd, RN

I appreciate the feedback. Thanks. Can you elaborate a little? What exactly is the problem with a mail-in rebate?

So, the goal here is to provide some sort of benefit to dealers and customers at the same time. I want to reward existing dealers with more business. I want to attract new dealers by creating some direct demand. And, I want to reward customers with some savings on their purchase. A "sale" depends on participation of existing dealers. They aren't generally very motivated because the retail discount doesn't translate to much at their wholesale pricing. And, it does nothing to attract new dealers. Besides, it tends to devalue the product in the eyes of the customer. If you have an idea which is better than the rebate then by all means share!

Thanks, Ed Bennett snipped-for-privacy@ts-aligner.com

formatting link
of the TS-Aligner

Reply to
Ed Bennett

So, am I correct in my understanding that the negative aspect of rebates is a bad experience with a poorly administered rebate program? If you really received the discount that you expected then you wouldn't have such a bad opinion of rebates?

The pricing thing is actually a rather difficult challenge. As a manufacturer, I can't dictate retail pricing and terms to dealers. All I can do is offer incentives for them to participate. If I knock

10% off of their wholesale pricing, they're not likely to knock 10% off of the retail price. If they do, it's viewed as a penalty, not a benefit.

You say that there are better ways, please share them!

Thanks, Ed Bennett snipped-for-privacy@ts-aligner.com

formatting link
of the TS-Aligner

Reply to
Ed Bennett

How is it that companies like Best Buy can offer competitive pricing to Circuit City while at the same time avoiding the ubiquitous rebates that CC offer? I don't know how they do it but I do know that they do it all the time.

To respond to your reply to the other poster, yes, the negativity associated with rebates is directly related to poorly administered programs. They make you hop through the hoops... if you forget to include one little requirement you're out of the running... there are unreasonable restrictions. "One to a household"? What the hell difference does it matter how many households are involved? Isn't the whole idea to sell MORE items? Or would you rather it remain "one to a customer"?

But let's say you jump through the hoops, cross all the t's and dot all the i's. Then they just claim they never received it. Please remail it. However, since the original proof of purchase was in the first envelope and the company won't accept copies, that become a joke. However, the joke's on the original company as I no longer buy their products. They only get one chance to rape me.

You had to ask these questions? You've never tried to get a rebate yourself? You must lead a sheltered existence. I don't know anybody who hasn't been screwed by a rebate offer.

Reply to
Mortimer Schnerd, RN

The problem with a rebate regardless of whether you get it fulfilled or not is that it takes a minimum of 2-4 weeks to receive. Typically this goes up to 3 months. The poor performance by many of those responsible for delivering the rebate has left a very bad taste in the consumers mouth. Foe me, the rebate IS NOT an incentive to buy a product. If the product I buy also has a rebate then that is a plus, but certainly not a reason to buy that product. Basically the customer has to work to get his hopeful discount.

The better way that you want to know about would be the same one that the automobile manufacturers use. They advertise "X" dollars cash back and this translates to immediate price reductions to the consumer. The dealer simply provides proof of the purchase to the manufacturer and is reimbursed the discount. You could simply request the copy of the invoice from the distributor or reseller and give him back the 10% of the sale price or credit his account. The customer comes out ahead and really and truly you are here to serve the customer, not the other way around.

Reply to
Leon

"Mail in rebates" are _specifically_ designed/used to sucker that part of the population who are indeed suckers.

I'm not a sucker, I want to know what the selling price is on the BIG tag up front, not in the fine print; and I want to pay that price and walk out the door, done deal, and to hell with a "mail in rebate".

In many retail establishments these days you have to read the fine print to find out that what you see on the big, easily readable price tag is ONLY the price should you choose to be a sucker and jump through hoops to go through the "mail in rebate" scam/promotion.

If you can sell if for $100 and make money, the only reason for the "$25 mail in rebate" scam at $125 is to play the odds and the sucker.

This is one of the most despicable practices in modern retailing and, if it can't be outlawed, it should be shunned by anyone with any sense until it becomes obvious to those who use the scam that it will no longer work.

Unfortunately, 50% of everyone who walks in the door is, by definition, below average IQ, and the "mail in rebate" scammers continue to get away with it.

Personally, I would not knowingly tar myself with that brush were I in the retail business, but that's just my opinion.

Reply to
Swingman

There, Ed, is your answer on how to approach your "sale" in a manner that does not make the thoughtful, informed buyer feel like he is being scammed.

Well put, Leon!

Reply to
Swingman

  1. The mail in rebate tells me first that the product is over priced as the manufacturer is willing to send me the rebate.
  2. I have to pay sales tax on the price initially paid.

  1. I then have to gather the necessary rebate forms, fill out an envelope and pay for postage and mail the rebate request in hoping something doesn't get lost/trashcanned along the way.

  2. Somebody at the other end has to process the rebate and send the check to me.

  1. After the usual three to six months time lapse, all the while tying up my money, I have to waste more time cashing the check (providing I even get it).

If the item were priced at the point of the original price minus the rebate to begin with, I would have saved the cost of the extra tax and postage and a number of people would have save a lot of time and wasted energy.

Reply to
Nova

Also why I will not buy most electronic items, like printers, from CC. If the "mail in rebate" is a good thing for the customer, fine ... let the retailer pass on immediate savings to the customer, and send in the rebate themselves.

I would be willing to bet that's what you're seeing in many instances at BB (although still not my favorite retailer for electronic goods).

Even with shipping, I often get a better deal online ... Web 2.0, doncha know! :)

Reply to
Swingman

So, who would be your favorite electronic retailer? I'm looking for a Channel Master CM4221 antenna to signal the HDTV (720p) I bought from Circuit City today (NO REBATE!) I could internet one but would like to take it with me soes I can set the whole rig hooked up when I get out to the ranch late this week.

Reply to
Dave in Houston

From an old marketing man's perspective;

Almost everybody has been screwed by a rebate at one time or another.

Therefore all rebates are considered scams.

Therefore all stores/businesses who offer them are considered crooks.

And if you should offer a rebate, you will be lumped into the afore mentioned crook catagory.

Don't get angry with me Ed. The number one problem I had with marketing clients was their howls of protest that they were not the bad guys. Even though their business practices were exactly like the bad guys.

Remember, from a marketing perspective, perception is everything. For many (most?) folks, rebate means there is some kinda lie'n and cheatin' goin' on here.

Reply to
Lee Michaels

The seller is also banking on a lot of customers buying the product because it is such a great deal with the rebate, but then they forget, lose the paperwork and no money is ever sent. Good deal for the manufacturer.

I've bought products with rebates, but not because of them. If it is only a buck or two, I don't bother with it. Staples has a good program where you can send the info on line. I've done that with success a couple of times.

Reply to
Edwin Pawlowski

How about an instant coupon savings. Customers can print one off your website or you could affix one to each box like a lot of manufacturers do today. Then you can instruct distributors that for each one they turn in that they can get some type of incentive. I wouldn't do rebates.

Allen

Reply to
Allen Roy

I think one difference between what you're doing and the typical rebates is it sounds like you are handling the rebates yourself - though I don't see a link to the actual rebate form in your link. Usually rebates on stuff bought at retail use a fullfillment center, whose sole job is to look for any reason to deny the rebate. I've heard they actually get rated by the percentage of rebates they reject, so there is tremendous pressure on them to find, or make up, any reason to deny.

I've never ever personally not received a rebate, though I haven't really done that many. I don't see what's so difficult about reading instructions and sending the thing in within a month. I did recently send in some pretty large rebates on Pentax camera stuff. On the forum I read people used to glow about the handling of their rebates. Then they changed fullfillment centers and I've heard nothing but complaints since. For a company that has had perpetual rebates for a very long time (every few months the rebates end and they announce a new set of pretty much exactly the same rebates) it's just very bad to be having bad word of mouth. And it makes you wonder if the word of mouth was good about your rebates will be handled well, why did they change centers?

So if I were you, I'd make it clear I'm personally making sure the rebates are handled properly. And I would have the rebate form up on my website as a pdf. I would make sure I have the absolute minimum of stuff the customer has to fill out and fine print on the form. It's of course necessary to have reasonable limitations, but go through the rebates looking for reasons to give the money not reasons to deny it.

-Leuf

Reply to
Leuf

| Every year I post a special offer here on rec.woodworking to show my | appreciation for all your help and support. This year is no | different.

I've noticed. I haven't bought, but I've noticed - and appreciated your willingness to offer people a break on what I understand to be a good product.

| Buy a Genuine TS-Aligner product and related accessories from any | valid woodworking tools and equipment dealer between September 1, | 2007 and December 31, 2007 and receive a 10% factory direct rebate. | Any dealer will do, even if they have never sold TS-Aligner products | before. Just have your favorite dealer give me a call or send me | email. I'll provide them with everything they need to facilitate | your purchase.

If I decide I'm going to buy a tool, it's because I've decided that I have a current (and nearly always, also a future) need and the tool in question meets or exceeds my needs. I don't want to be a participant in a sales and marketing process - I just want the tool so I can put it to work.

Like many others, I don't trust rebate offers. At this stage of the game I've come to believe that rebates provide the offerer with (another) opportunity to clutter my mailboxes with wastepaper and spam and to sell contact info to others, and I won't even consider putting first class postage on an envelope and going to Kinko's to make a copy of my receipt unless the rebate is large compared to the dollar and time cost involved.

Having said that, I'll follow on with the info that large rebates (the kind I just said might prompt me to take action) set off my internal alarms that a product is normally grossly overpriced to begin with, and that I need to be wary of the manufacturer/vendor involved.

Worse for you, if I decide I need your product at a time when it's not on sale, I'm likely to feel resentful because I know I'm paying 11+% more than if it were discounted 10%. I realize that this isn't completely rational - but that doesn't change the fact that I'm not feeling good about either you or your product, even though I've never met you or tried your product.

-- Morris Dovey DeSoto Solar DeSoto, Iowa USA

formatting link

Reply to
Morris Dovey

I can't comment on how multi-billion dollar outfits like Best Buy and Circuit City make their marketing, pricing, and promotional decisions. I suspect that the process is significantly different from mine ;-) I'd bet that the monthly mortgage payment doesn't figure into the formula.

Yes, I have gone through all the hoops on a number of occasions to get the rebate. It is a PITA to be sure. There are no hoops with my rebate program. The form is included in the box for every TS-Aligner product shipped to dealers. I just want to make sure that you actually purchased the product(s) and that you are a real person. Just fill out the name and address (without which you cannot receive the check) and mail it back within a month of the purchase. I personally receive the mail and process the payment. The name and address get filed away forever - never to be used for spam or junk mail.

Contrary to popular belief, a lot of rebate programs aren't about increasing sales; they generally have ulterior motives. Often, they are collecting demographic information. It's cheaper to pay end users to fill out the form than to pay a market research firm to hunt down the info sometime later. So, "one to a household" makes sense. My ulterior motive involves building a dealer channel.

Won't happen with me. But, I understand why people might believe that it would.

Yes, I have, on several occasions. Once they decided not to award the rebate. But, it didn't bother me all that much because I wasn't actually betting my financial future on receiving the rebate. The rebate just prompted me to take a closer look at the product that I wasn't paying much attention to. It added weight the decision process. I didn't feel as if I had been ripped off because the product didn't cost any more than it normally did. The rebate would have been gravy. No real regrets.

Ed Bennett snipped-for-privacy@ts-aligner.com

formatting link
of the TS-Aligner

Reply to
Ed Bennett

Yep, the instant rebate. It requires the dealer to do something. For high volume products which have good demand from a manufacturer that they cannot live without this works. But, it doesn't work for my products or my purposes.

Ed Bennett snipped-for-privacy@ts-aligner.com

formatting link
of the TS-Aligner

Reply to
Ed Bennett

HomeOwnersHub website is not affiliated with any of the manufacturers or service providers discussed here. All logos and trade names are the property of their respective owners.