To Turbine or not to turbine

Page 2 of 2  
DonkeyHody wrote:

Hmm... I found a well used unit a a flea market for $65US. Works great (lucky me), but the cleanup couldn't be easier. Rinse out the cup, run water through the tube thingy, and clean the little guide thingy that screws on the front. Takes 5 minutes. I guess different ones are made differently. I would definitely pay attention to what is needed to clean it.
Harvey
Add pictures here
<% if( /^image/.test(type) ){ %>
<% } %>
<%-name%>
Add image file
Upload
Hello, There is two inherent problems with HVLP andfirst is the air is warm to hot which is problematic because the heat makes the finish cure faster then if the air was 70 degrees and 50 RH. The finish will not flow out like it should. It will be acceptable but not as good as conventional air spray. Some guy/gals will tell you that they get it to flow and the finish is good or great, but more often then not for the average guy/gal the finish is okay fair to middle compared with conventional. And when shooting water base it's most likely going to need to be reduced to get it to spray and then this problem really becomes apparent ( runs and sags or lots of coats) and when spraying lacquer you need to dump retarder in it to stop the blush and dry spray appearance.The second problem is that the cup is not pressurized and it relies on suction to pull the material up and out of the cup the problem is pressure is what makes the suction so when you reduce the pressure like HVLP LP meaning low pressure you reduce suction. to compensate you need to reduce the material and with some materials ( like water base ) to the point of making crap out of it. There is a solution which is a HVLP CONVERSION and I know you are concerned with cfm requirements but there are guns out there that only use 5 or 6 cfm and have nozzle pressure of 21 psi. they have pressurized cups and tanks and cost less then 500.00 bucks, as far as water and crap in the lines that is easily remedy with a in line filter or dryer filter on you compressor or both and with practice you will not believe the finish, piano quality lacquer not a problem. Here is a link to homestead finishing they sell Astro as well as others take a look at these and see if you might rethink HVLP turbine. http://www.homesteadfinishing.com/htdocs/asturo3.htm Give these people a call they are a wealth of information. I am sure they will get you on the right track. ( no I am not affiliated with them just passing on experience)
Donald Grudeski President of Brush Boy Painting Company

Add pictures here
<% if( /^image/.test(type) ){ %>
<% } %>
<%-name%>
Add image file
Upload

I made a mistake it is 21 psi at the gun inlet and 10 at the nozzle Donald Grudeski President Brush Boy Painting Company
Add pictures here
<% if( /^image/.test(type) ){ %>
<% } %>
<%-name%>
Add image file
Upload

SNIP
Wow. If I had all those problems, I wouldn't do my own finishing. I think of all the cabinets, trim, entryways, etc., I have finished over the years, and I haven't run into all the things you describe.
I miss high pressure application because of the ease of application.
But I like saving material.
I don't miss the drift. Check out Max's post above.
I had problems getting started with hvlp because I wanted to set the gun up and use the system like high pressure. Its like learning any other system, and investment in time and materials must be made. Once ironed out, I never looked back.
Robert
Add pictures here
<% if( /^image/.test(type) ){ %>
<% } %>
<%-name%>
Add image file
Upload
I spray a lot of waterbased acrylic. I have 10 Gallons sitting in my shop waiting to be applied.....Yup 10 gallons. I have no problem with runs and sags when I spray and I don't think three coats is "lots of coats"?
Just my experience.
cm

Add pictures here
<% if( /^image/.test(type) ){ %>
<% } %>
<%-name%>
Add image file
Upload

While I don't spray water based clear coats with my hvlp (latex paint goes through the airless), I spray a fair amount of conversion lacquers.
I am with you. 3 coats is nothing. At a three mil wet layer per coat, it takes a minimum of three coats to get a final thickness of 3 mil which is what just about all manufacturers recommend. Spraying CAB lacquers, a having good spraying conditions, you should be able to put on multiple coats easily in a day without problems.
Shooting MLC Ultrastar (water borne), I know BARRY has noted multiple coats in a day as his norm.
But, we all have different experiences.
Robert
Add pictures here
<% if( /^image/.test(type) ){ %>
<% } %>
<%-name%>
Add image file
Upload
snipped-for-privacy@aol.com wrote:

Three coats (1 sealer, 2 top) in one day, scuffed with 400 in between, in Connecticut weather, sometimes in 1/2+ day. I can sand 45-60 minutes after spraying.
However, I won't stack parts until the next day. DAMHIKT.
Add pictures here
<% if( /^image/.test(type) ){ %>
<% } %>
<%-name%>
Add image file
Upload
Donald Grudeski wrote:

Warm air is great with water base lacquer. The simple way to cool the air when warming is a problem is to add more hose. Shutting the turbine down when not in use (I use a dust collector remote) also helps.
> And when shooting water base it's

Not true at all, with my Fuji Q4, ML Cambell Ultrastar and ML Campbell NC Lacquer. I spray Ultrastar right from the can.

Not true on my Fuji siphon gun, it has a pressure line to the cup. Anybody who has opened the cup at the wrong time knows full well just how well it's pressurized! <G> I also have a 2 quart pressure pot that runs from a standard compressor.
For my gravity feed gun, I go up a tip size.
Are you sure you've used a good HVLP?
Add pictures here
<% if( /^image/.test(type) ){ %>
<% } %>
<%-name%>
Add image file
Upload
*SNIP* of good information

When I demoed the Turbinaire unit, I almost bit on the spot as the guy opened a quart of really thick latex enamel in front of me, let me stir it to make sure there was no friggin' in the riggin', and he poured some directly in the cup and let me spray.
That >almost< sold me as I thought "surely no other system can do that". But in truth I think most 4 stage systems from the big boys will, and some of the 3 stage machines will do that, too.
I thin because of my shooting style and climate. If it is 65 - 70 degrees and about 50% relative humidity, I don't thin or mix anything with the clear coat. That actual day usually happens about twice a year around here.

LOL. You are definitely sturdier than I am. When I read that post there were so many things that were just completely wrong I deleted my original response. You just said it best and I think you hit the nail square on the head.
Robert
Add pictures here
<% if( /^image/.test(type) ){ %>
<% } %>
<%-name%>
Add image file
Upload
This was the "only" negative comment I could find about hvlp.
I realize nobody who has ever bought a unit is likely to admit a problem, but most of the folks that are making comments have been around this group for a while.
I just got to decide which flavor at this point.
I am convinced it will be a good thing.
snipped-for-privacy@aol.com wrote:

Add pictures here
<% if( /^image/.test(type) ){ %>
<% } %>
<%-name%>
Add image file
Upload
Pat Barber wrote:

Please don't put me in that bucket.
I'm more than happy to pan anything that doesn't meet my expectations, regardless of what I paid for it. I don't find sharing my negative experiences a with product or service as a reflection on myself. If I dropped $700 on spray equipment and I didn't get total satisfaction, this group would be the first to know. <G>
Add pictures here
<% if( /^image/.test(type) ){ %>
<% } %>
<%-name%>
Add image file
Upload

Or me. I will scream like a mashed cat when I am screwed by a tool maker. I don't care what it is. And the more money I spend, the louder I will be.
This is one of the great aspects of an unmoderated, unsupported free- for-all atmosphere. You can tell it like it is, and while you may hurt some feelings you can certainly relate your experiences without worrying about having your post deleted or edited.
With there only being a few large tool makers anymore that have tools readily available, I think it is important to share what you find out when you make a purchase. It saves the rest of us time, effort, money and heartburn.
I don't know of any one tool maker (OK, Festool guys, maybe yours ;^) calm down...) that consistently makes great tools manufactured to exacting standards across their entire product line.
Sharing information is without doubt the best part of the internet.
Robert
Add pictures here
<% if( /^image/.test(type) ){ %>
<% } %>
<%-name%>
Add image file
Upload
Yep... you do seem to "voice" your concerns with little regard to what the tool makers do or say. The open discussion has been the main reason I have hung out here for a right good while.
I'm from the south and we have more "saying" than carter has liver pills, but I don't recall ever hearing the "mashed cat" version.
Excellent.
snipped-for-privacy@aol.com wrote:

Add pictures here
<% if( /^image/.test(type) ){ %>
<% } %>
<%-name%>
Add image file
Upload
I have one of the smallest and oldest turbines out there which I purchased used. The turbine I bought was manufactured in 1984. I am sure a bigger turbine or new gun technology might be even better, but I won't find out until mine finally dies. Until then I will enjoy the ease of spraying with my old TP turbine http://tinyurl.com/25vr5h .
You will not regret your purchase.
cm
wrote:

Add pictures here
<% if( /^image/.test(type) ){ %>
<% } %>
<%-name%>
Add image file
Upload
"Pat Barber" wrote:

If you can supply 15 SCFM, may have something of interest.
Contact me off list for details.
Lew
Add pictures here
<% if( /^image/.test(type) ){ %>
<% } %>
<%-name%>
Add image file
Upload
I bought a used turbine rig about three years ago and at time had done very little spraying with a compressor gun. I use my turbine almost once a week now and wonder how I lived without it. I find it easier to use than the conventional gun compressor set up.
cm

Add pictures here
<% if( /^image/.test(type) ){ %>
<% } %>
<%-name%>
Add image file
Upload

I think the thing I like the best about the hvlp turbine is its predictability. Once you get comfortable with it, it is much easier to work with for a range of finishes than a high pressure sprayer.
No worries about driers, in line filters, contaminates, etc. as with high pressure. And the gun is no harder to clean than any other. But the best part of course is the lack of overspray. It is rare for the overspray to travel more than a few feet, and the atomized haze doesn't hang in the air for 30 minutes waiting to land on something.
I sprayed out some bathroom and kitchen cabinets inside a house we remodeled, in the client's garage and all we did was hang some plastic up about 4 feet from the ground. No problems there and no complaints from the client.
When it is a real tear out remodel of mine or one of my amigos, I don't have any problems throwing a piece of plastic over sawhorses and spraying in a living room or den. The over spray pretty much just falls to the ground.
It is such a huge thing to not have to tape off a whole house, evacuate the living areas for hours while the drift settles, and to be able to be more flexible where you can actually spray. If I had known it worked this well I would have gotten on it earlier, regardless of the savings in material. To me, that's just icing on the cake.
Robert
Add pictures here
<% if( /^image/.test(type) ){ %>
<% } %>
<%-name%>
Add image file
Upload

Site Timeline

Related Threads

    HomeOwnersHub.com is a website for homeowners and building and maintenance pros. It is not affiliated with any of the manufacturers or service providers discussed here. All logos and trade names are the property of their respective owners.