This is so cool! A 'safety' table saw that detects your finger.

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Sorry, there's a reason there is safety equipment. The above is like saying you don't need to use the saw guard or the splitter or push sticks, your finger fits between the fence and the blade... sort of...
The safety equipment we have now works just fine, we don't need another piece of mandatory, expensive equipment, that isn't demonstrated to be any better than what we have, any more than I'm sure rollerbladers would be terribly happy to be told they have to wear full-body baloon-suits, just in case.
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I bet a bunch of people said that then the common POS guard, that comes on almost every saw, was mandated also. Perhaps you do not see the need for more safety equipment but enough people did to warrant SawStop making the commitment to see this through.
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We have yet to see the evidence of this. Did you buy one yet Leon?
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I think the fact that they went into production and are selling is enough evidence. Just in this small group there have been responses from 3 different owners of the SawStop. One is getting ready to buy another, and Robin Lee has indicated that he is replacing all the TS's in his stores with Saw Stops. No, I have not bought one yet. I simply think it is a great idea and if I do ever replace my cabinet saw I will consider it. By then there may be something better out on the market. Powermatic has a new model that I would place between the SawStop and the other American style saws as far as added safety features. The trend is starting to shift in that direction. If you are going to be the only operator of the saw and have no need to purchase a new saw I would say wait. If you are in the market for a saw I would say strongly consider the SawStop if you can afford it.
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On Fri, 03 Mar 2006 00:43:36 GMT, "Leon"

You mean the same people who are removing the guards and having accidents? What makes you think for a second that even if the Sawstop became standard equipment, people wouldn't disable it?

The only thing Sawstop cares about is making money. If they force the industry to use their technology, they make a bundle. Come on, let's be honest, they're in it for the paycheck.
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wrote:

No I mean every one that removes the guard and having accidents or not. Why would prople that bought a saw in particular for its safety feature disable it? It certainly does not get in the way or block you view when being used like the standard guard does? Why did you remove yours and replace it with an overhead guard?

Please. That is the primary reason that they and or any other business in business, to make mone first and formost.
If they force the

Yeah, and you work for free, right?
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On Sat, 04 Mar 2006 00:09:25 GMT, "Leon"

Because we're not talking about people who go out and purposely buy SawStops, we're talking about people who are forced to pay extra for a piece of technology that they neither want, nor need. The fact that every time the thing goes off, you're out $200. You don't think people are going to disable that?

Yup, and they want an entire industry to use *THEIR* technology. It isn't a matter of them campaigning for *SOME* safety equipment, they want everyone to be forced to use *THEIR* equipment.
This has nothing to do with safety, it has to do with making a buck.
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wrote:

Well so far no one has been forced to do anything. So if they buy the SawStop it is their own decision. No, I do not think a person will disable the SawStop and IIRC there has been no mention by the owners of the SawStop of purposely defeating the system as a permanent cure.

Well, wouldn't you, if you were in their shoes? Seriousely wouldn't it be nice if you were legally getting a percentage of every TS being sold?

That is not entirely true. They could just as easily be marketing something else unique for the TS and try to have it mandated also. They did however realize that a better safety devise would cut down drastically on severe injuries. Suppose they decided that every TS should have a laser cutter that only cut wood and only cut as deep a the thickness of the wood. The technology is here as most WW shows have a vendor selling laser engravers and some are less than $10k. That could easily be around the corner and would give SawStop and every one else a run for the money. You can sit back and watch other countries continue to out manufacture the US but I think the SawStop company is a breath of fresh air in contrast to the some ole some ole. And again, it is for the buck like every other company in the U.S.
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No, I wouldn't. There are still a few of us in the US that see ethics as more important than money. We're getting damned rare though.

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On Mon, 06 Mar 2006 00:54:10 GMT, "Leon"

That may not hold forever, if SawStop gets their way.

Well, if they ever did mandate it and I was forced to buy a saw with their technology, I'll be the first one to disable it.

If I had to force everyone to buy my product, nope. That's why we have this thing called the FREE MARKET. It means people have a choice whether or not to buy. If they have no choice, they have no freedom.
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That's kind of an idiotic statement don't you think? Why would anyone disable the safety feature? If you're forced to have the technology as you claim, then it's only to your advantage to use keep that safety active. It's not like disabling it is going to make you any safer. And even if your worry about a false activation is your motivation for making that statement, you could wait for it to happen and then disable the safety feature and all you'd be out would be the blade.
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Still don't get it here. Mandating a safety DOES NOT prevent you from buying a saw with out that feature. There are thousands of used saws if you have to have on with out the feature.
You simply choose to buy a saw with the feature or not.
This thing you think is a free market unfortunately has no effect on auto insurance or new cars. Most everywhere you have to have auto insurance and you have to have air bags.
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"mywebaccts (at) PLUGcomcast.net" <"mywebaccts (at) PLUGcomcast.net"> wrote in message

Where have you been?
--
Stoutman
http://www.garagewoodworks.com
  Click to see the full signature.
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Well, for the past 18 months, I've been in NM. Before that, I was in NJ. And before that, we lived in Ohio for a couple year. And up until I was about 10, I was in upstate NY.
Why do you ask?
Jack
stoutman wrote:

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"mywebaccts (at) PLUGcomcast.net" <"mywebaccts (at) PLUGcomcast.net"> wrote in message

watched the TV woodworking shows. The Sawstop folks have been demonstrating their device for quite some time without much success. Jim
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While not successful in getting other companies to license their product they seem to be pretty successful in bringing the saw to market and having happy owners. There have been a few complaints of misfires but IIRC the situations were resolved. Imagine buying an automobile that has no problems. LOL
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You know, this is why people don't like newsgroups. ALL I was saying is that I found this saw to be amazing. Okay, SHOOT ME! I'm sorry!!!!
Damn, what is it with people? I didn't know this was "common" knowledge and I thought I'd share it.
I apologize for trying to be nice.
Jack
Jim wrote:

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"mywebaccts (at) PLUGcomcast.net" <"mywebaccts (at) PLUGcomcast.net"> wrote in message

No big deal. It is just that it has been a long drawn out argument around here and another thread just makes people pick up where they left off. Anyone who gets irritated with you for posting this and couldn't tell exactly what your post was from your subject line without reading it can go piss up a rope.
Frank
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"mywebaccts (at) PLUGcomcast.net" <"mywebaccts (at) PLUGcomcast.net"> wrote in message

Jack the saw is amazing, and the post here are also. I posted a question a few month ago when I had a misfire the thread went on for days. But the saw is great will be ordering a second one soon. Joe
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So, Joe...what I'm really wondering is when it misfires, does it kill the saw blade? And if so, did the SawStop folk offer to replace it for you?
Mike
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