Sorby bevel angle

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Hi All,
Does anyone know what the stock bevel angle is on Sorby bevel chisels? I bought two and they aren't machined at an angle that matches anything in my new Veritas sharpening angle jig. Looks like about 22 degrees or something like that? Also, how sharp should I expect to be able to get with 1000 and 2000 grit sandpaper? Should I be able to shave armhair after using the 2000 grit or do I need to use 4000 or maybe 8000 to get there? I assume that I'll need a stone or strapping compound to get to that point. Correct?
Thanks!
-Chris
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You can shave arm hair after 600.

my
something
and
2000
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Yep. There has been a lot of bull spread around here about having to work your way through a billion grit and having to say a chant and do the proper ceremony. Fact is, a combination stone, a fine India and a piece of leather will do the job. It won't look as good under a microscope as something sharpened to a billion grit but your wood won't care. Now, if you want to be with the "in" crowd around here, lay in your supply of microfinishing papers, get your incense burner tuned up and practice your chanting techniques.

I
in
that
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leather
I spent the last two hours going back and starting from scratch with 320 grit paper and lapping the back to remove the grinding marks. I then used 400, 600 1000 and 2000. I honestly could count my nose hairs with the back of the chisel as in the scary sharp description. I then did the bevel starting with 400 and working my way up using the Veritas honing jig. I can shave arm hair very effectively with it now put it still seems to kind of tug on them as I go. If you really do get a razor sharp edge, how long will it actually shave you once it's been used on wood? My guess is once you tap it with a mallet a few times that razor edge is gone but I've never owned a quality chisel before and certainly never sharpened one this well so I just don't know. I guess it's time to go practice those dovetails in the pine I just brought home for learning to cut them!
-Chris
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Thanks to all for the replies here. One thing I'm still not sure about is how my 1000 and 2000 grit paper compares to 4000 and 8000 grit stones. I know the unit of measure must be different between sandpaper and stones but don't know how much difference. Is the paste used for stropping much finer than my 2000 paper?
Thanks!
-Chris
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Not a lot. Don't use paste.

but
finer
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On Sun, 17 Aug 2003 13:04:43 -0500, D K Woods

Correct.
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In the 80's, we were making and shipping DDT and 2,4,5-T to Africa for their use. It was illegal here. Question is does the ends justify the means? I have not been able to come up with an answer that satisfies me. When the US had Yellow Fever, DDT helped to wipe it out. Also malaria. The South had MANY deaths because of insects. I agree that we do need to take care of our people- we also need to stop the illegal inflow of immigrants and quit wasting money on people other than our citiens. And as far as destroying the health of the Iraqi people, we aren't-they are. We are trying to set up an infrastructure that was pitiful at best. They keep blowing it up. THEY will have to stand up for themselves and kill these idiots themselves because we can't. We have laws we have to go by. But terrorist don't (have to) go by ANYTHING. But we are NOT destroyingtheir health.

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wrote:

What I was doing with my one-word comment was basically support the notion that we _do_ have money for defense and not for some other things. Kucinich was saying something intended to get a reaction of "How could this be?" I think defense comes first -- done correctly. IMO, Iraq was something we had to do. I agree with you, and predicted back in April, that agents provocateurs would try to do what the Red Brigades tried to do in Italy -- destroy things, get the people angry, thereby inspire them to rise up against the powers that be -- in this case, the US, UK, etc.. Also, I think that 100% of the highway trust fund money should go to transportation infrastructure, and if we did that there would be enough money for roads and bridges and even mass transit. Now, back to your regularly scheduled programming ...
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wrote:

No problemo.
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Hi Chris,
Think about adding Leonard Lee's book, "The Complete Guide To Sharpening", to your library. There are so many different types of chisels that there isn't just one answer to you question about which angle to use. Bench chisels generally come from the factory with a 25 deg. bevel. Set your jig to the tool, not the other way 'round or you may remove metal unnecessarilly. Hone the factory bevel to whatever grit satisfies you. Nose hairs or whatever. That mirrored surface you are looking at is usually referred to as the 'Primary Bevel'. Some folks, including Lee, are great proponents of honing a secondary bevel of about 5 deg. Benefits include faster, easier re-honing and and edge that will probably hold up longer. There's really too much involved to cover in an email. The book covers it all. By the by, the author Leonard Lee, is the Lee in Lee Valley....the guy who made your jig.
I guess various sharpening techniques can be compared to the ocean....some folks find wading completely satisfactory while others are only satisfied exploring the deeper darker regions ;>)

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Thanks for the advice Frank. I picked up The Complete Guide to Sharpening Friday, after spending a bunch of time researching chisels and sharpening from Google archives of this group. I've read from the beginning through the chapter on chisels now and do have a far greater understanding of bevels and micro bevels and why having the back of the chisel as flat as possible is so important. Your advice on setting the jig angle to the chisel came a little late though since I already made my chisel match the Veritas angle guide. I did it by hand so there wasn't much heat and there wasn't - that - much material to remove but it did take a while. I haven't used a protractor on it but I think it's probably about 28 degrees or so now with maybe a 30 degree micro bevel. That's within the guidelines in the sharpening book so I'm not too worried about it right now.
I just worry that even though I'm following what is said in a highly recommended book I'm doing something wrong to my new expensive chisels. I tried top find some of that stropping/honing paste he talks about in his book today but they didn't have it at Home Depot or Lowe's, which was no big surprise. Since I've started researching and trying to buy some nice tools, I've realized how low end the stuff they carry actually is. I mean real low end. At least I live in a big city with a Woodcraft and a Rockler so I can go in and actually lay my hands on some of the stuff in their catalogs. Too bad I have to drive past 147 huge home improvement stores to get to either one of them though. Oh well, I got a bit carried away with the typing here and didn't mean to go all over the place like I have in this post. Thanks again.
-Chris
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Anyone who uses abrasive paste on a leather strop needs to be beaten with said strop. The reason leather is used is that it is mildly abrasive. by putting an abrasive on it, you have defeated the purpose. You might as well use a stone. Smooth, dry leather is what you want. It is nothing more than a final finish. There is an exception to this but it is more applicable to carving tools, particularly knives.
I

big
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wrote:

Why ? Although there are times when stropping with plain leather is approriate, there are also times when you want to use a compound and leather is still an appropriate strop material.
Some strops are canvas, but these are more prone to rounding edges than leather, as their surface is more easily compressed.
There are also leather wheels like the "Powerstrop", where they're deliberately intended for use with compounds. They'd be pretty useles without it.
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You can also use pasteboard (non-corrugated cardboard) if you're not "into" leather. With or without compound, though with is certainly a faster strop.

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MDF works quite well too.

"into"
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Go back and read the whole post. these questions of yours were addresed.

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I haven't seen that article yet, but find it funny you refer to the author as a 'hack'. Mainly because Garrett Hack, author of 'The Handplane Book' that so many cite as a definitive reference, mentiones using a piece of plate glass, silicon carbide powder, and kerosene to flaten the sole on a cast iron plane. He does mention that eventually it does wear down the plate glass, but suggests just flipping it over, using it some more, and then getting another piece of glass.
I've seen it mentioned (the using glass or granite plates w/ abrasive powder and some kind of liquid) a few other places, and since I'm getting some of the planes I have (and other old planes I'm picking up) tuned up a little bit as I go, I have a *keen* interest in hearing if you have a better method for flattening the soles on planes?
TIA,
nuk
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and not nearly enough to do very many useful things.
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At the risk of getting flamed I will just say c'mon lapping is lapping.
That is basically what you are doing when you sharpen something. The keys are the flat surface and the abrasive. Whether it is a slurry of abrasive powder or sandpaper etc shouldn't matter much and if your surface is glass or granite or a lapping plate don't matter.
The guy suggested a granite tile. I wasn't certain that they were always that flat?
It should be considered that any time your lapping surface is in direct contact with the abrasive, unless it has a hardness higher than the abrasive it self, it's flatness will be diminished as you are both lapping the blade and the lapping surface. If one uses the "Scary Sharp(R)" system, using the emery paper and glass then the abrasive is not in contact with the lapping surface. Seems like glass or granite as long as it is flat will work fine for this system.
My only concern with the powders and plate concept is that it is not too difficult unless you are very careful to get a few grains of lower grit into the slurry of the higher grit and well you know how that goes if you have ever switched from 80 to 120 on a piece of wood with an orbital sander and didn't dust the piece off ... lovely little circles. :S
Sharpening does get religious doesn't it....
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What works for me:
For bringing old Stanleys back to the land of the flat, a couple of blue AlZr belts from the Borg, cut and glued to 1/2" plate glass or other flat surface (granite surface plate is fine). A salvaged plate glass table top or a small 24" x 36" table top from a home store works fine and is cheap, but I walked into a glass store and asked for 1/2" scraps (2 - 6" x 30" were about $10, IIRC)
Run through grits and take care not to rock the plane. Use dry, and vac the swarf when it gets thick. Finish up on some dry 220 or 320 if you want the polished look.
I have surfaced with SC on both granite and glass - neither stay flat for long, and the 12" x 12" granite floor tiles are way too small for doing something like a smooth plane, as well as seldom very flat.
Lee Valley used to sell an adhesive mylar sheet that was supposed to hold the grit when applied to glass or other surface, but cast iron or mild steel work better, per what Steve said.
Re: granite and silicon carbide: IMO, the method is messy, mixes large grit with small (not what you want when going for a finished surface), and is way too time consuming unless you get into the Zen of sharpening.
Just because something is in FWW does not mean it's a good idea for anyone other than the author.
nuk wrote:

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