Shop lighting

For those of you who use 4-foot T8 bulbs, I just saw T8s with LEDs. Much b righter, whiter light. The guy who handles them at my lighting supply stor e was off today, so I don't know the price (next stop Google). First impre ssion -- a big improvement, especially for this old guy's eyes.
Larry
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On Saturday, April 13, 2013 7:13:54 PM UTC-5, Gramp's shop wrote:

brighter, whiter light. The guy who handles them at my lighting supply st ore was off today, so I don't know the price (next stop Google). First imp ression -- a big improvement, especially for this old guy's eyes.

Postscript from Google search: Ouch. $30 to $50 per unit depending on the w attage. I can think of better things to do with that level of investment.
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They'll come down to reasonable levels in about 10 years... I've noted LED bulbs in the $15-20 range on sale/clearance lately, where they're normally about $30-40.
FWIW, sometimes color temperature makes a big difference. One room seems very bright now with 6500K bulbs instead of the old 3000K bulbs. It might be worth trying a "daylight" bulb (or tube) and seeing how you like it.
Puckdropper
--
Make it to fit, don't make it fit.

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On 4/13/2013 9:10 PM, Puckdropper wrote:

That would be my suggestion. LEDs are great for longevity and low wattage cost but lighting brightness and K values have wider range within fluorescent.
We use daylight bulbs throughout the house and in my garage, usually 5500K or 6500K. It makes a world of difference compared to the warmer yellow hue colors.
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On Sun, 14 Apr 2013 01:10:09 +0000, Puckdropper wrote:

I liked the result I got when I combined a cool white bulb with a GE kitchen & bath bulb in the same fixture. But that's a subjective judgement.
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On 4/13/2013 7:21 PM, Gramp's shop wrote:

brighter, whiter light. The guy who handles them at my lighting supply store was off today, so I don't know the price (next stop Google). First impression -- a big improvement, especially for this old guy's eyes.

Yeah, me too. I'll just keep using the cool white t-12's.
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Steve Barker
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Gramp's shop wrote:

brighter, whiter light. The guy who handles them at my lighting supply store was off today, so I don't know the price (next stop Google). First impression -- a big improvement, especially for this old guy's eyes.

I just finished changing out my 8' T12's to T8 in the unheated half of my shop. I got tired of the buzzing and flickering in the winter. Also changed out the one in the un-walled shed. On the coldest nights (Georgia) the come on instantly.
I also need a lot of light. Probably will get my cataracts changed out in the next year. LED's are nice in a good flashlight, but to light the whole shop-- not ready for that yet.
--
 GW Ross 

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I wouldn't like these to be my sole source of light in a shop. LEDs I can see getting at some time, but the little curly bulbs do fine with enough size and wattage.
I have a hard time with folks when I do a kitchen or bathroom and we get to lights. Cooking and food prep under the really white, high Kelvin LEDs can yield some pretty strange results as they distort the color band so badly. Makeup application isn't very good as the skin tones take on a definite whitish/blue tint.
Folks want the light the higher Kelvin bulbs bring as they don't want to pay for a couple more cans in the ceiling. For me, I don't want my cabinets, tops, and floors to look washed out. Nor do I want them to see the color distortions that could make them unhappy with their new room.
And in a shop, I can't even imagine how ticked off I would be if I didn't know that and I was doing staining/coloring/finishing in my shop with that heavy dose of chromatic blue instead of something in a more normal color range. Imagine finishing something in your brilliantly lit shop with the hot white bulbs and then putting that piece into a more warmly lit environment. *ouch*
Robert
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On Sun, 14 Apr 2013 01:14:13 -0700 (PDT), " snipped-for-privacy@aol.com"

In another life we did a lot of commercial/industrial lighting retrofits. We alway did some demo areas first so they could see how the different Kelvin temperature lamps effected how wood, carpet, and paints appearance not to mention people. We let them make the choice.
Mike M
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------------------------------------------------------------------------ Life goes on.
As I read Robert's post above, I'm reminded of my experiences in the High Intensity Discharge lighting business.
Incandescent lamps provide good color rendition, but are horribly inefficient (approximately 18 lumens/watt), and less than 1,000 hour lamp life.
Around 1940, fluorescent lighting was introduced at a Worlds Fair. These lamps offered improved efficiency (approximately 60 lumens/watt, longer life, but at a price, lousy color rendition.
Everything looked "washed out".
This resulted in lamps with names like "daylight", "cool white" and "warm white" to name a few.
Next came the High Intensity Discharge lamp sources, Mercury, Multi-Vapor (Metal Halide), low pressure sodium, and finally high pressure sodium (Lucalox).
Mercury had the same color rendition problems as fluorescent, but with a 24,000 hour lamp life, found a home in street lighting and high bay industrial applications.
Multi-Vapor provides higher output (80 lumens/watt), good color rendition, but has relatively short life.
It has found a home in sports stadium and car dealership lighting applications.
Anyplace where good color rendition is required and short life is acceptable.
Low pressure sodium does not provide a complete color spectrum and had limited success in Europe and the USA for roadway lighting applications, but has basically become non-existent in the last 15-20 years.
Which brings us to high pressure sodium (Lucalox).
High pressure sodium (Lucalox) offers high output (100 lumens/watt), long life (20,000 hours), and high lamp efficiency.
High pressure sodium (Lucalox) does provide a complete color spectrum; however, there is and abundance of red and yellow hues which is very close to natural sun light, but some people find unacceptable.
Again, most of the applications are industrial, parking lot and roadway.
And now we have LEDs entering the market facing the same color rendition acceptance problems faced by all the preceding lamp sources.
It's a case of what comes around goes around.
It will be interesting to see where LED lamp sources will go.
Lew
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On Sat, 13 Apr 2013 21:39:57 -0400, G. Ross wrote:

I had cataract surgery last year. I didn't notice any increase in light levels, but as the old jingle goes "You'll wonder where the yellow went ...".
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On 4/14/2013 12:42 PM, Larry Blanchard wrote:

I had cataract surgery last year too. I did notice things were a lot less dark. I only did one eye. Still holding on to what I have for the other.
I had added all these articulated arm lights because I couldn't see, now I don't need them as much.
My T8's take a while to warm up to full light, wondering how some of your lights are almost instant on... Even in the basement, around 56 most winter...
--
Jeff

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*snip*

Much of the magic's in the ballast. I replaced 6 of them some time ago with electronic instant-on ballasts and they work great. The old ones would buzz and after a while I could feel a strain on my eyes. The new ones completely eliminated this. (I also changed to 6500K lights at the same time.)
Some CFLs are instant on, but the majority are not. This makes them useless for closets or other places where the light is needed immediately for only a minute or two.
Puckdropper
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Larry Blanchard wrote:

My mom had hers done about 6 years ago (age 95) and for the first time in memory she asked for sunglasses. She is 101 now and no longer drives.
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 GW Ross 

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When I googled "T8s with LEDs" the hits said that LEDs were much less efficient than T8 fluorescents ... So I don't know ...
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Best regards
Han
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