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See, you keep trying to make my point for me, and you're still not qualified to do so. Based on all available information, it is justified. Hell, it was justified just because he didn't comply with each of the UN resolutions, which were conditions of the _cease fire_ of Gulf War the First.

Could they have killed more people had they not been found?

Personally, I'm all for a "OK, look. SH was out of hand, we removed him. If your next head honcho gets too big for is britches, we'll remove him too if he starts making hostile noises to us and claiming he has all of the WMDs that SH hid. Behave, or we'll be back. Maybe next time we won't rebuild all of your infrastructure for you while you shoot at us."

Neither of us knows the internals of the intelligence organizations. It's not all James Bond, though.

Odd that even your boy Flipper (wups, I mean Kerry) said he needed to be stopped, if he was so constrained.

I'm sure he knows exactly where they went, as do his friends. Somehow this is our fault?

Maybe we know what we know about him because of a covert source we're not willing to lose? I don't know, and you don't either.

People who know more about the situation than either of us weighed the relative risks of advertizing how we know what he did, or in letting him go. Would you rather we, oh, I don't know, keep him as an enemy combatant without any representation or charges?

1. We sold them to him. 2. He said he had them. 3. Clinton, Bush, and Kerry said he had them. 4. We're now finding them.

Know? Why don't you ask Kerry, he "knew" also.

Red herring, and you show the weakness of your point of view by resorting to a tactic such as this.
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On Tue, 08 Jun 2004 02:03:28 +0000, Dave Hinz wrote:

One *good* thing about letting this guy loose - there's no bag limit on him in the wild.
-Doug
--
"A government that robs Peter to pay Paul can always
depend on the support of Paul." - George Bernard Shaw
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I apologize - I was attempting to drive my point but resorted to poor methods. We're not going to see eye-to-eye on this. I don't trust the current administration to make decisions that will help ensure long term peace for the country or the world; you do. I feel the country was fed a load of falsehoods and misinformation; you feel it was truthful and actionable. Such differing views on the same issue makes life interesting. Take care and if the purported wmd's are out there I certainly hope we find them as well as bring individuals intent on harming world peace to justice with as little bloodshed and alienation of the world's people as possible.
--
Owen Lowe and his Fly-by-Night Copper Company
Offering a shim for the Porter-Cable 557 type 2 fence design.
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Noted and appreciated.

Yes.
Ah, but you seem to think it was W doing the misleading, rather than being misled along with the rest of the world. _if_, as you postulate, there are no more WMDs, which I doubt. Personally, I think he just had a lot of time to hide 'em and has done so.

I contend that you will continue to fail to acknowledge them once more of them are found. Hopefully the next troublemaker in that hotspot will be as noisy about things as SH was, so we know when to drop the hammer on him.
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says...

stockpiles" we claimed he had, I'll post a "mea culpa" in every newsgroup that's seen my sig line.
How long do we have to not find those stockpiles before you do the same?
On another subject entirely (but still off topic), I see the Mexican trucks are on the verge of getting driving rights on US highways, courtesy of NAFTA. Sure glad I live up near Canada (although I do have a few nasty comments about Canadian cattle trucks).
--
Where ARE those Iraqi WMDs?

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One is enough to be a WMD, given the number of people it's designed to kill.

I'll happily say right now we've only found 2 or 3 9/11's worth of WMDs today; no hesitancy at all.

Do they have to pass the same safety checks as here? If not, why not?
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says...

and, IIRC, the answer was no - that's what the problem was. As well as the minimal or nonexistent training required to drive a Mexican big rig. If truck and driver standards were the same, I don't think the access would have been delayed for four years. But if someone knows different, let me know. I am working from memory.
While it doesn't apply to the Mexicans, the problem with the Canadians is that they all come down our street to miss the Washington weigh stations. Besides the traffic, noise, and smell, our street isn't designed for the (over)weight and is deteriorating.
But after the mad cow, they've been restricted so things have been peaceful - I dread the day the restrictions are lifted.
BTW, the locals won't do anything about the problem for two reasons. The street east of us used to be the one they used and they had to rebuild a bridge. They put weight restrictions on that street to protect the new bridge.
The next street west of us leads past a big new shopping center and they don't want to restrict our street because they don't want the trucks on that street. So we're the stuckees.
--
Where ARE those Iraqi WMDs?

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On Tue, 8 Jun 2004 16:06:19 -0700, Larry Blanchard

Seems as if this violates state laws regarding deliberately bypassing weigh stations.

While the locals may not, the state troopers should, as this is reducing your state's revenues. In most states, deliberately bypassing these stations is illegal and subject to some pretty severe fines.

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<snip>

Some links found on Google News search for "mexican truck access nafta court"
http://www.dailynews.com/Stories/0,1413,200~20950~2198594,00.html (this sucker opens a flood of popups!)
http://www.upi.com/view.cfm?StoryID 040607-120252-3758r
Tom Veatch Wichita, KS USA
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wrote:

An entirely false argument. We're discussing intent here, not risk.
Any number of _old_ shells would still fail to worry me at a political level (obviously they're a hazard for those dealing with them). A small indication of an _ongoing_ program is much more serious, even if it hadn't yet achieved much.
If I go within walking distance of my own house, I can excavate more evidence of abandoned chemical weapons than have so far been found in Iraq. And I don't even live in New Jersey, or Hanford, or Nancekuke.
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snipped-for-privacy@codesmiths.com says...

anybodys mind either, mores the pity.
--
Where ARE those Iraqi WMDs?

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wrote:

I'm sure you don't appreciate the irony in the above remark. You seem to keep chanting the mantra that the WMD's were the sole reason for attacking Iraq. Failure to abide by 17 resolutions over 10 years, continued beligerence in threatening to unleash weapons that he apparently did not yet have, unearthing the mass graves of well over 100,000 of his own citizens, support for terrorists (Abu Nidal *was* killed in Baghdad (or committed suicide by shooting himself multiple times)) all serve as justification. Was our intelligence faulty? Yes. But the other irony here is that Bush is being accused of being a liar and manipulating the country in pre-empting a threat. Was Saddam a threat? There is sufficient evidence and testimony from former Hussein associates that even if an active WMD program was not present in the country when we attacked, Hussein had every intention of restarting those programs once the sanctions were lifted. So, in the case of Iraq, Bush was manipulative in pursuing pre-emption, yet the same people making this accusation are the same people accusing the administration of failing to act and pre-empt 9/11. So what if the intelligence had been correct? Would you have rather had the administration take a tentative approach and been proven wrong?
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That's a false meme. Do you have reliable documentation to back it up?
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wrote:

Unlabelled leftover that was *not* supposed to be in existance. The question of the day was not that insurgents didn't know what they had, but the question that *anybody* could have found a shell (actually to date 3 shells) that didn't exist. Remember, Saddam didn't have have *any* more WMD's (zero, zip, zilch, nada). The insurgents weren't in power before the conflict, Saddam was. So either Saddam and his troops were incredibly careless, or somebody better start worrying where the rest of those "unlabeled, forgotten" shells are before the insurgents do figure out what they have and really start hurting people.

At least they mentioned the fact that the sarin gas shell was found. CNN didn't find it newsworthy enough to mention for several days after it was found.
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So no comment on the taliban slimers? It really was one of the lowest periods in modern history. Believe it or not there are still people who believe that Gore said he invented the internet... really.

Not so. You can get into an arcane discussion on the evolution of the DARPA project, the http standard etcetera, but the internet as we are using it now was created throught the High Speed Computing Act.
The co-author of http agrees with me.
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wrote:

I have no idea what you're talking about here.

web" are synonymous. They are not. The internet supports many protocols besides http, some of which are a bit older.
The internet "as we are using it now" is not the same thing that we were using yesterday, last week, or last year. It's continually evolving, and it's been around since Al Gore was in diapers.
-- Regards, Doug Miller (alphageek-at-milmac-dot-com)
For a copy of my TrollFilter for NewsProxy/Nfilter, send email to autoresponder at filterinfo-at-milmac-dot-com You must use your REAL email address to get a response.
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Its a nice reflection on you really, don't you think? Sort of like repeating RNC slime.
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On Tue, 1 Jun 2004 21:13:05 -0500, p snipped-for-privacy@postzzzmark.net (p_j) wrote:

p_j you really have no clue. ...
Ah, it's not worth it (gotta remember Tom Watson's pledge).
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-- Regards, Doug Miller (alphageek-at-milmac-dot-com)
For a copy of my TrollFilter for NewsProxy/Nfilter, send email to autoresponder at filterinfo-at-milmac-dot-com You must use your REAL email address to get a response.
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On Wed, 02 Jun 2004 12:05:14 +0000, Doug Miller wrote:

I dumped all the non wooddorking contributors and Micheal Moore wanna-bees a few months ago. Lost one or two posters I didn't want to, but the tone of what's left is so much more civil that it's darned near a nice place again.
-Doug
--
"A government that robs Peter to pay Paul can always
depend on the support of Paul." - George Bernard Shaw
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