Screwdriver bits for brace

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Rugh-Roh, that wasn't my intent. I was enjoying the dialog and understanding why people use what they use, compared to why I use what I use. Something of an academic exercise to make usenet both useful to me and enjoyable.

I just have a 3/8 DeWalt variable speed drill motor. I think mine is a 6A motor. I retrofitted a 1/2" chuck to it a long time ago just to handle a couple of bigger things that I put in it. It has plenty of power to handle the things I use it for so putting the 1/2" chuck on never concerned me. Like you, I don't want to be hauling out the wheel barrel just to move my drill around, so big enough to do what I need, is big enough for me. I chuck up pretty much what ever I need to do the job. I've got things like ground down 3/8" socket wrench extensions that I can chuck into it for running nuts and bolts as might be required. Beats grabbing an impact gun sometimes and is much faster than an air ratchet. Of course I have #2 and #3 Phillips tips. What I like about it over my cordless gun is that for jobs that might be similar to what the OP posted that got this thread going, it has the power to lay into it and very slowly try to work a screw. You don't have to hit the trigger and develop too much speed right off the bat, only to eat up a screw head.
But I will say this John - I was a long time getting into grabbing a hand plane, tuning it up and putting it seriously to a piece of work. I don't get into it like some of the guys here, but once I got my plane tuned up and sharp, I was so impressed with every aspect of using it that I haven't grabbed my power planer since. It works extremely well, is easier to grab and "setup" than my power planer (don't have to move crap away from the outlet to plug it in), and most important - it's so much more fun to use. I still get a thrill out of watching a curl grow out of it, and love the sound of it moving across a piece of wood. Simple minds, simple pleasures. All that to say that so many of the old tools are indeed much cooler to use. I wouldn't want to dissuade anyone from going that route - even if being cooler was the only reason, and sometimes there's other reasons to stick with them.
As for drill motors, I believe in small tools with lots of power. Big tools are hard to maneuver, sometimes hard to use accurately. I like a 3/8" motor with a rating like mine (6A) or thereabouts, and a good trigger. I like to be able to creep the motor up from a dead stop to just barely trying to turn. And of course - it just wouldn't be right unless it really whizzed too. For me, the DeWalt has served that well. But... don't you go putting that brace and bit up in the attic.
--

-Mike-
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Mike Marlow wrote:

I took a look at those drills, Mike, and noticed that they don't have side handles. How do you handle the torque that they produce? That short pistol grip handle wouldn't seem to give you much leverage.
John Martin
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I just hold it firmly John. Sometimes I'll hold it sideways so the grip is off to a side instead of straight down and I can get a bit more feel of control that way. I've never had the need for a side handle. I have grabbed right around the body of the motor before, again - to get the feel of more control. Don't know if it actually provided much more control, or was just a feel thing. I guess I just don't find a drill motor to be very unsteady feeling in my hand, so as to need something like the side handle.
I usually don't just squeeze the trigger to full speed either, and that helps with the torque thing. Running a speed bore into a floor joist is one thing - I'll just hog right into that, but for most other things I generally attack the work with less torque. I'm one of those guys that you'll never see running a drill motor up to high speed with a metal cutting bit in it, or with a tech adapter chucked in, so again - the torque thing isn't as big a problem as you might think.
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... which shows that such drills are limited in torque: If it had the necessary torque for example to tighten (or loosen) a cars wheel nut (above 100 Nm) you could not hold it without a long side handle.
[...]

Do not confuse torque with speed. Unfortunately most (all?) the cordless screw drivers with a torque control arre uncalibrated, in other words they just show some numbers without any unit.
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Dr. Juergen Hannappel http://lisa2.physik.uni-bonn.de/~hannappe
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is
Correct. The discussion is about drill motors for light weight work, not impact guns. Even with a limited torque device like a 6A drill motor one can encounter situations where the gun escapes their grip. Anyone who has ever drilled holes through floor joists with a speed bore has experienced this when the speed bore breaks through.

one
generally
never
it,
big
No confusion. However we experience the torque of the tool in direct proportion to the speed as we ease into or wail on the trigger.
--

-Mike-
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Mike Marlow wrote:

Thanks, Mike. Knowing your concern about being able to apply enough torque with a bit brace, I wondered how a drill motor without a great big side handle would do.
John Martin
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John Martin wrote:

heck, I even have a #4 phillips insert tip. I've even used it once...

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Mike Marlow wrote:

In my case, it was out of experience. I owned a sizeable sailboat for a number of years and the brace was my buddy :)
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dadiOH
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John Martin wrote:

Haven't tried #24 into hardwood, but I've used a basic corded drill with a socket adapter to put large lag bolts into 4x4 lumber without predrilling.
I bet a low-rpm 1/2" power drill would do even better. And if you wanted to really go nuts, try one of these:
http://www.milwaukeeconnect.com/webapp/wcs/stores/servlet/product3_27_40027_-1_284311_281138_189333_362 #
Chris
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Chris Friesen wrote:

http://www.milwaukeeconnect.com/webapp/wcs/stores/servlet/product3_27_40027_-1_284311_281138_189333_362 #
What would you chuck into that drill to drive the screws? Remember, he's talking about wood screws, not lags.
You could also use an impact wrench. Same question, though.
John Martin
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The point is to feel what you are doing. Brace is it.

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Mike Marlow wrote:

brace is still better for tricky applications. it's the exact one-to-one relationship of the turns of the brace to the turns of the screw thing.
get a good quality holder for 1/4" hex screwdriver tips. the tips are available in almost any size/type you'll ever find. the brace will grab the holder just fine.
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Hello, here is your catagory for eBay, in England: http://www.ebay.co.uk / Collectables> Tools & Hardware> Tools> Carpentry/ Woodworking
There, you can see your catagory links on your left, and you can select "UK only" in a drop down.
Braces are usually two jawed (98% of them), and the bits have a tapered square head. Just search through all the pages until you find screwdriver bits and a brace you want, the best ever made are Yankee Bell system by North Bros., and later the same by Stanley, as long as it is a Yankee. The model Nos. are 2101 and the better 2100, 10" swing (5" depth) size is most common. As I see it, you have braces available there, and drill bits.
The two jawed chuck will also accept shanks that do not have the tapered square head, as long as it is set in deep enough, so you could cut the handles off a couple of old screwdrivers, not skinny ones. For drill bits you will need a bit sharpening file if you buy them used. Only that file is properly designed for the job, made by Nicholson and available at Lee Valley, or needle files and small sharpening stones.
Here is an adapter you can get from the US, http://www.leevalley.com/wood/page.aspx?c=3&cat=1,180&pB337 It will take 1/4" hex bits that are common, adapted to the brace chuck.
http://axminster.co.uk has a brace and the best bits that are new, but those prices are beyond, I wouldn't do it.
If you can get someting like Craftsman "screw outs", they could probably work in a brace as well: http://www.sears.com/sr/javasr/product.do?BV_UseBVCookie=Yes&vertical=TOOL&pid952154000 I don't know if Craftsman is sold over there, check axminster for them.
Good luck,
--
Alex - "newbie_neander" woodworker
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the
of
"UK
bits
model
common.
handles
will need

designed
files
those
http://www.sears.com/sr/javasr/product.do?BV_UseBVCookie=Yes&vertical=TOOL&p id952154000
Excellent, many thanks. I didn't make it clear I already have the brace. I hadn't thought of cutting the tip off a screwdriver. That is what I will do, except I will use a cheapy new one instead of a worn out old one.
Tim W
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Yes, make sure you have two inches that will go into the chuck, and then the length you need that comes out from the chuck. A full 5" total length is good. And when mounted, that chuck must be as tight as possible without being impossible to loosen.
--
Alex - "newbie_neander" woodworker
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I
do,
the
good.
Actually having experimented the chuck of my brace will hold an ordinary hexagonal magnetic driver bit-holder perfectly fast, so there is no neeed for a special bit and no need for cutting tips off of screwdrivers.I shouldn't even have posted the question here without checking this first.
tim W
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On Thu, 23 Mar 2006 15:28:19 +0000, Tim W opined:

As long as you have the metal tools out, go ahead and file or grind a couple of flats on the end of the shank. That way you won't need a death grip to keep it from turning in the chuck.
Regarding the notion of chucking a hex tip: You might want to use one of the longer tips. The large brace chuck will obscure your view if it's too close to the surface.
(I'm waiting for someone to market dedicated Robertson tips for Yankee screwdrivers, instead of hex-adaptor + tip.)
--
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Tim W wrote:

You *don't* want a cranked hand drill for that, you want a brace. Screwdriver bits for same can be found at most any marine supplier such as Jamestown Distributors. Wouldn't surprise me if Vermont American and/or Irwin still makes them, should find things made by them at most any hardware store which should be able to order. No real need though, you can chuck most any shape in a brace.
--
dadiOH
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This is also pretty good. http://woodworker.com/cgi-bin/FULLPRES.exe?PARTNUM 1-581
Seems I saw an adapter for hex to brace somewhere, but can't turn it.
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Sorry to piggyback, but it appears that this will do at a reasonable price. http://www.garrettwade.com/shopping/product/detailmain.jsp?itemID 6391&itemType=PRODUCT&iMainCat=0&iSubCat=0&iProductID6391
Garrett Wade reasonable? I suppose.
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