Sawstop on slashdot

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It is still an option. I can name many people, some in my own family, that have never had a driving license in their lives. I can do the same if I choose to, but jobs in my walking area don't pay what I make so I choose to drive every day, 52 miles. There are people that still choose to live in the city so they do not need a car.
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The way gas prices are going, you may soon find the pay cut to be worth it. Personally, I have a twenty minute rule. If I have to drive more than twenty minutes to get to a place, I don't work there.

that
to
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Someone somewhere wrote: <...snipped...>

People didn't stop buying gasoline but they bought less of it. In the case of gasoline the suppliers are selling less but making _more_ money. In the case of saws with saw stops, the manufacturers will be selling fewer saws and making _less_ money.
While I'm posting, I might as well add...
Air bags do save lives. However, a 6 point safety harness and a crash helmet for each driver and passenger would cost less than equipping a car with air bags and save even more lives. Perhaps the government should require it.
Just think how much safer a motorcycle would be... If it had 2 more wheels! Perhaps the government should require it.
Does anyone know if a sawstop saw can run a dado blade?
Driving at 55mph would save more lives than allowing higher speeds. It would not be difficult with today's electronic engine controls to govern the top speed of a car and limit it to 55. Perhaps the government should require it.
A swimming pool that was, say, 4 feet max depth would no doubt be safer than a pool that had a max depth of 12 feet. The 4 foot pool would save lives. Perhaps the government should require it.
--

Larry Wasserman Baltimore, Maryland
  Click to see the full signature.
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snipped-for-privacy@fellspt.charm.net wrote:

The dado blade requires a separate cartridge http://sawstop.com/products-cabinet-saw-accessories.htm
Can I get a waiver on that 55mph limit? at 57 mph I get better mileage in my Civic hybrid. Joe
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You'd be surprised...
We got a down check once on a safety inspection here for not have a written start-up procedure for a power tool..... a cordless drill.
We also didn't have a published "Hot work" (welding etc) policy... despite not doing any hot work.
IMHO - one of the biggest safety risks is government regulations that turn safety into a joke (which it isn't). Safety is at risk when people lose respect for the rules, or the process. The nature of regulation (and liability) is to cater to the lowest common denominator, and that isn't going to change.
Cheers -
Rob
(working where a band-aid has to be "dispensed" by trained staff)
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Probably true. But if you lived in Houston that would be hard to prove. LOL.. I think more people are speeding since the price of gasoline went up and the stations certainly are still busy.

Maybe, there is the possibility that pricing may deter some from buying however there may be some that were reluctant to switch from a BS because it safer to operate for some cutting operations than a TS. If the TS suddenly removes a lot of risk TS sales may in fact increase. The Minimax instructor told me that he only used the TS when the BS could not make the cut and stated safety reasons. Not that this particular reasoning would play out but it certainly is a posibility.

Perhaps. If you are into organized racing, it is required although not by the government.

Aw, well then it would not technically be a motorcycle any more.

Yes, It can.

Well, in a way the government has been requiring a vehivle to not go over 55 in certain areas for years, are you against driving the speed limit?

Well a person can drown in 6" of water, might as well go for that. Additionally the government does require secure fencing around a pool in some areas regardless of pool depth.
With anything you can take everything to an extreme. IMHO, of all the government regulated situations, many of which I agree with and many I do not, I think that making the SawStop technology mandatory would not be a bad thing. Plain and simple. You may have valid reasons for the opposite position. We disagree, on this subject. NO big deal. Freedom of speech right? I have that right, you have that right, although you may not like that because the government has its nose in protecting our freedom of speech also.
On a different note, the city government in Houston has recently started using traffic cameras to monitor and take pictures of vehicles running red lights. It is about a 50/50 mix as to whether you are for it or whether you are against it. Most against it are claiming, invasion of privacy, that it is just another way of generation more revenue for the city, higher taxes to get the system up and running, some one else may be driving my car when the car runs a red light, and the list goes on. At first I was against it. Now I am all for it considering that if it can help prevent 4 to 5 cars from running the light almost every time the light changes to red in many locations, it will probably save lives. I had to stop thinking about how it would just affect me. While many people are clueless how many TS accidents that there actually are, one test intersection in Houston recorded more than 600 violations the first month that the camera was in operation and those were only the ones that the camera caught. I suspect that it may only be capable of catching 1 at a time and may miss the other 3 or 4 that were behind the lead car.
IMHO the cameras are good as they may very well save my life one day and auto insurance premiums in Harris county may go down as a result of fewer accidents caused by motorists running red lights. There is a reason that Houston has higher auto insurance rates than most anywhere else and even if you do not live in the area, if you use the same auto insurance company you are indeed paying higher rates than necessary because of the amount of accidents every day in Houston. Do you recall people complaining about homeowners insurance rates and flood insurance rates and taxes going up to cover damage caused by Katrina even though they live no where near the coast and have had no claims?
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On Wed, 16 Aug 2006 23:55:45 -0500, snipped-for-privacy@fellspt.charm.net () wrote:

.snip. </lurk>
http://www.cato.org/pubs/pas/pa-346es.html
<lurk>
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Now that is Ironical. ;~)
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On Tue, 15 Aug 2006 12:42:15 -0600, Chris Friesen

Thanks Chris - I looked and could not find this important info. Thats a margin breaker...likely to be something like 30% of the cost breakdown. It would be my opinion that we should not disillusion ourselves that the inventor cares about saving fingers. Its all about the $$. IMO, in his victory he saw money not safety. Thats not to say I blame him but lets call a spade a spade.
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LOL... All manufacturers are in it for the MONEY. This one just happens to be offering additional safety that others feel is not important.
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On Tue, 15 Aug 2006 21:08:55 GMT, "Leon"

Agreed. But if you read this thread thoroughly you'll find some statements that make it seem as though this guy is doing it to save fingers - maybe so, but that is not his primary goal, in my opinion. If it were he could offer the license for a more reasonable price. So to repeat myself its about calling a spade a spade.
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wrote in message

Agreed
BB
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wrote in message

This is onerous since usual royalties for IP are in the .5-2% range. Also in a manufacturing environment that translates into a 16-20% of the manufacturers cost to build. Hardly a commercial viable proposition.
BB
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writes:

So? That why engineers get the big bucks, to make a similar non-infringing version. Or you pay a royalty. Saw Stop did offer the technology to others but was turned down.
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Fein could look into this. They manufacture the Multimaster. It can use a circular blade that cuts through stationary objects but does not spin. Because it does not spin it will not cut your finger. The blade oscillates in a shorter distance than you skin will move. The blade simply vibrates you skin. It would have a long way to go but it has its potential. No kick backs.
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For
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Your arguments about insurance prices dropping do not stand up to scrutiny - when was the last time you had an insurance agent ask you if you use a table saw? Yes it would be a factor for a place like Woodcraft that has classes for folks but for individuals it is not.
I agree that safety is important but you seem intent on removing any responsibility from the user for their stupidity. . . A table saw can be used safely but not by idiots.
I have a 5HP Left Tilt Unisaw in my shop with a Biesmeyer splitter - it is safe to use as long as I follow the rules - if I don't then it is my fault not the governments because they do not mandate that everyone use a SawStop. . .
I refuse to allow the government to tell me what kind of table saw I can buy - there are much more dangerous things they do little about - cancer caused by tobacco kills how many people a year? Roughly 45,000 people die in the US in traffic accidents every year (half of which involve drinking and driving). A few missing digits while not wonderful hardly rates high for things that require government interference. . .
BB
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January 2005 and he saw my damaged thumb. We alos talked about whether I needed extra insurance to occasionally haul manufactured goods to a customer. He ultimately offered me lower home owner and auto rates and this year the rates have come down about 15%.
Yes it would be a factor for a place like Woodcraft that has classes

My personal experience proves otherwise.

Absolutely true and also absolutely ture is the fact that ANYONE including you can have an accident on a TS. I am absolutely not trying ro remove user responsibility. I simply want insurance premiums to resude for everyone and for there to be less injuries.

Blame the tool manufacturers that decided to not make their saws safer for the inevetable mandate. If you believe that using a saw safely will save your butt you are pretty naive.

Did you buy your TS new? If so you bought a guard that the government requires it to have.
It sounds like you simply want to go against the government, period. The government could simply out law tobacco and that would take care of future generations. But people like you would not like the government interfeering with you doing harm to your self. Why not eleminate the problem to start with.
Roughly 45,000 people die in

What's your point?
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this
Actually it is based on your sample of "one" which is not statistically valid. . .

injuries.
Yes I would like insurance premiums to decrease but to do that we need to get rid of all the lawyers. Do you know how much of the price of a ladder is due to the liability insurance the manufacturer has to pay?

is
fault
I do know that using it safely will reduce the chance of injury but not necessarily remove it entirely. But life is full of risks - I could slip in the shower, get hit walking to the mailbox, get struck by lightening, shot is a drive by shooting. . . et al. I refuse to become paranoid about "something that MIGHT happen to me".

The guard was a POS and was removed. Even use of a (good) guard does not remove all danger.

interfeering
I feel that government is too intrusive. I am not a socialist - history shows that it is ultimately unworkable. You seem to have a belief that government can solve all the problems. The recent fiasco with the TSA and operating from fear not logic is getting a bit old.

and
If you cannot get it then doubt it would do much good to explain. . .
BB
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Actually it is based on your sample of "one" which is not statistically

Say what you want. It is a real statistic compared to all of your assumbtions.

The cost if every thing is affect by something. You either agree to pay or you don't.

So you own absolutely no health home or auto insurance?

Did you chang you mind? First you refuse to allow the government to tell you what kind of saw to buy, next you let some things through as acknowledged by the fact that you bought a saw with a required guard. I agree that nothing is going to cover all instances regarding safety.

I do not seem to think that government can solve all things. I simply think that of all the things that the government gets involved in, this particular situation is a good one.

Well certainly you are not suggesting that the government get involved with practicing medicine.
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Did you ever study statistics? A sample size of one is statistically not valid when compared to the millions of saws out there. . .

to
ladder
or
There seems to be an inabilty to link cause and effect here. . .

shot
I have insurance but insurance to to protect against losses you cannot afford to pay for yourself - it is not to make one "whole".

You logic is slipping here - All new tablesaws come with guards. I needed a table saw so I bought one. My decision to buy was not based on the type of guard it had on it nor the fact that the government required it have one.

and
think
particular
You fail to connect the dots here. Your idea of a nanny government is not workable. It is impossible to reduce the possibility of injury to 0% even with a Sawstop since statistics indicate that at some point in time it will fail to operate properly. As I stated previously intelligent proper use of a TS will minimize risk to acceptable levels.

drinking
with
Do you read English? What does practicing medicine have to do with traffic accidents and drinking and driving?
BB
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