Ridgid, Grizzly, or other 6" Jointer?

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Suction strength is manually regulated. If you are sanding something like face frames or the edge of a board you want to increase suction as the sander pad extends over the edge of the work and dust can fall over the edge and there will be a big suction leak.
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On 02/22/2016 9:23 AM, Leon wrote:
...

...

I figured as much or would be balleyhooed feature... :)
"Inquiring minds..." :)
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On 2/22/2016 10:05 AM, dpb wrote:

LOL
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On 02/20/2016 10:56 AM, Jack wrote:

Not really they don't, no...they're two toally different class of machines besides the premium for the
Rigid Festool Drum Size 6 Gallons (US) 6.9 (6.3 filter bag capacity) Peak HP 3.5 Nonsense spec Air Watts 124 Voltage 120 120 CFM 62 137 CFM (Over double note) Amps 5.8 2.9-10 Filter 1-Layer Standard HEPA(*) pleated paper
(*) US DOE HEPA Definition--Must capture 99.997% of all particulates >=0.3 microns.
Plus, the Festool has automatic switching of the associated tools plugged into it and many other amenities/features. Just not the same beasties at all to compare to each other.
...
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On 2/20/2016 2:06 PM, dpb wrote:

My $99 Ridged is 14 gallon, not 6, and it's HP is rated at 6, not 3.5. It may not have hepa, but personally I don't care a lick, I see no dust coming out of it and it sucks plenty hard.
Standard 2.5" hoses fit it, along with their attachments, so my old shop vac stuff works fine. It doesn't go on automatically when I plug a tool into it, but I don't care there either, because all my tools are on a dust collector system. I have no problem flicking the switch on my Long Ranger.
My main reason for getting rid of the shop vac, which I've had for 40 years, and it still works same as it did the day I got it, was noise.(damn things you want to break never do)
The ridged sucks harder, a plus, but mainly it is quiet enough it doesn't bother me in the least. The old Shop Vac was the only tool I needed ear muffs with, and that includes chainsaws and routers, although routers are nasty noise wise. That shop vac made my ears bleed.
The only way I'd spend all the cash on a Festool vac is if a Texas oil well sprung up in my yard. Otherwise, I'd happily spend the cash on a spiral cutter head, or towards purchase of a Domino, or if I already owned those, maybe a ROTEX, just to see if it would make sanding fun, as Leon contends:-)
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On 02/21/2016 12:34 PM, Jack wrote:

OK, but immaterial...the comparison would show the same thing relatively.

It's what you _don't_ see that is typically the most most dangerous from a health standpoint.
Again, HEPA and Festool's meet a certain market; in large part driven by the (relatively) new EPA RPP lead rules that mandate same under harsh penalty if not complied to by those who are subject to it. Ridgid won't cut it in that environment.
...

W/ <$30 oil, not likely to be any new wells popping up any time soon so you'd best not be waiting... :)
I'm not likely to bite either as I have central dust collection for the big stuff and really just was too old and set in my ways to get concerned much about the little.
But, the point is that there's a very definite reason the two aren't comparable in price and that is in what they do...and there is, of course, at least some that is the Festool premium simply because it is pea-green and white.
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On 2/21/2016 1:40 PM, dpb wrote:

I prefer to think regular green and black. No white. LOL
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On 2/21/2016 2:40 PM, dpb wrote:

Yeah, I hear/read that all the time. I've done woodwork with no dust collection or dust masks for going on 60 years. When younger, I've done a ton of body work, sanding tons of body filler, not to mention dry wall w/o dust masks, (usually with a smoke hanging from my lips) and painting numerous cars and trucks with just a dust mask. If my lungs could talk they would be mostly cursing. Not recommending anyone do that, but I'm closing in on the end of my run and my lungs still work fine.
A side note, we bought a new sweeper a few years ago, and it has a HEPA filter on it. Absolutely worthless imo. Just another filter to clean. 70 years of sweeping rugs w/o one and no ill effects convinces me a lot of this stuff is salesman hype.
For me, I can use my shop vac and immediately stain/varnish with no effects, so whatever invisible fine particles are spewing forth means about nothing to me.

The EPA can kiss my dusty little butt. Too many little people with big government power forcing people to do things their way. I'm glad I'm not beginning my life where these little tyrants are controlling everything you do.
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On 02/22/2016 8:03 AM, Jack wrote:

...
What one individual gets lucky getting by with, many others get and die early from lung cancer or other ailments...
<Other diatribes snipped for brevity...>
While I'm no fan of the RPP, that wasn't the point so much as that the comparison drawn was to two markedly different product specifications and target markets explains much of the significant price differential; not that one is simply the same product as the other but over-priced.
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6HP??? <giggle>

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Home Depot offers a HEPA filter for the WD1450, I think it was VF5000 or VF6000. There may still be a bit of blow-by, but it does seem like the vacuum seals pretty well.
Puckdropper
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Puckdropper <puckdropper(at)yahoo(dot)com> wrote:

If the vac is not HEPA certified the filter is not guaranteed to prevent the particles that you are wanting to capture from escaping. The HEPA filters in my vac remain almost spotless, even after 8 years of use. The vast majority of the fine particles are captured by the primary disposable filter bag. As a result I never have to clean those final HEPA filters, or any filters. I take that back, about 9 months ago one of the bags broke and the HEPA filters did all of the work and and yo be cleaned that 1 time.
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On 2/22/2016 10:18 AM, Leon wrote:

Finally a reason I'd want a Festool vac, never having to clean the filters. For the extra $500 though, I don't mind occasionally cleaning the filter. I usually do it each time I empty the 14 Gallon tank. My vac is also quiet enough I never consider not using it because of the noise, and no ear muffs needed. My 40 year old Shop Vac I hated to use because it required ear muffs or your ears would bleed. The main thing with the old shop vac was the high pitched scream. That is completely gone with the Ridged, so whatever noise it makes, it's simply not a problem at all.
The only small tool I attach a vac is my sander. The small hose to my sander has an air port that I can open if the vac works too hard, so two speeds isn't needed. I can't recall ever wanting to slow down a vac.
My recommendation remains spend the extra money on the spiral cutterhead planer or jointer rather than a Festool shop vac. I guess if your prime reason for buying a shop vac is keeping dust over 1 micron out of your lungs, get a Festool vac, or even better, look for work in a silicon valley clean room making computer chips or hard drives. Woodwork might be a little too risky for you.
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*Snip*
Would you spend an extra $5? That's about what generic filter bags for the WD1450 run. It keeps that filter nice and clean, and you only have to mess with them once in a while. They're not totally clean, as removing the bag leaves about 1/2 cup of dust scattered about but you don't have to clean the big filter.
I did put the dust diffuser/muffler on mine, and while it does help it's only a marginal muffling. The diffuser is more important, as that vacuum is set up with a marketing checkbox "can be used as leaf blower".
Puckdropper
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On 2/23/2016 2:11 PM, Puckdropper wrote:

I might consider that. Do you have a link to the bags you use? They seem to be all over the place price wise. My old shop vac had only a paper bag filter, and a sponge filter for water pickup. Is that how these things work?
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These went up in price since I ordered... um I guess it was 3 years ago. Still, at $6.50 a bag it's still not bad.
http://www.vacuumbags.com/rihiefwdmian.html
These attach to the suction inlet and trap the dust in the bag. It's not like the shop vac paper filter that goes over the foam. The original filter stays in place.
Puckdropper
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Puckdropper wrote:

I'd say that depends on what you are using them for. I pretty much stopped using my canister vac because the corrugated paper filter clogs up almoat immediately if you are sucking fine dust. The ones like you linked work well but my drum sander fills them in a very short time, at least one, maybe two per hour. Shame they can't be (easily) emptied and reused. Since they can't, I'll stick with my dust collector.
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I use the Ridgid brand filter bags from my local Home Depot. They end up costing about $9 a piece, but each bag lasts a long time:
http://www.homedepot.com/p/RIDGID-High-Efficiency-Dust-Bags-for-RIDGID-12- Gal-16-Gal-Vacuum-VF3502/100390230
Since I started using the filter bags I haven't changed the pleated filter in years. The filter bags work great for fine dust like that from a sander, drywall dust, and even COLD ash from the wood stove.
If you change the bag before it gets completely full, you can usually get the bag out without spilling the dust all over. If you wait too long it gets too big to remove from the tank without tearing. Don't ask me how I know. :)
Anthony Watson www.watsondiy.com www.mountainsoftware.com
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On 2/19/2016 10:27 AM, dpb wrote:

So you can joint against the grain, wild grain, knots, even plywood with zero tear out? You spend zero time setting your knives for a perfect cut? You don't risk going deaf with out wearing ear muffs when face jointing/planing a hard chunk of tiger maple? You don't have to sharpen your blades 4 times more often than with segmented knives, (which are simply replaced with no touchy set up)
BTW, I've read that segmented knives leave knife marks, but I don't see them. My long blade jointer doesn't either, although I've read they do, and are harder to sand out than the segmented knives. I'm sure they both do if you look with a magnifying glass, but they are of no consequence, ie, a non issue to me.
What is an issue to me is I should have replaced my flat bladed jointer with a spiral cutter head a long time ago. Now, I'm too old, and don't do enough woodwork to justify it. I thought about getting a replacement cutter head years ago but didn't, now I still think about it every time I use it, can't justify it. They say it's not what you did that you regret, but what you didn't do... That's what I'm talking about, and why I say spend the extra on this.
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On 02/19/2016 10:59 AM, Jack wrote: ...

...
A) Well eonough to satisfy me, yes... B) Not "zero" but it's quick-enough with a gauge and done infrequently enough as to not bother me... C) Eh? D) No, they're also solid carbide so last at least as long being more solid...I've sets of HSS that are extremely finely honed for work like A) when it arises...
I'm not saying there's no reason; only that I'd certainly never tell somebody to stop on that account from going forward; particularly when they've commented they're on a budget.
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