Re: Grizzly uses back orders as a way to finance operations?

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Fairly normal for who? I've never seen the practice.
Rob Stokes wrote:

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They may not actually charge the card - but they can put a "hold" on that card for the purchase amount to make sure when they *do* charge the card the funds will be available. And, in that case, it has *effectivly* charged the card as the purchasing power of the card is reduced by that amount.
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you
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The point was that they are using this to finance their operations. Putting a hold on the credit card does not finance their operations. It lowers your limit for sure, but doesn't cost you interest. Anything that curbs the ability to buy large amounts of woodworking equipment may actually be a good thing :-)
-Jack
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<snip> Anything that curbs the ability to buy large amounts of woodworking equipment may actually be a good thing :-) <snip>
did my wife pay you to say that?
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Eric Scantlebury wrote:

Nope. Until they actually charge the card, you don't owe the credit card company a penny. You've financed nobody. Unless you're living beyond your means, whatever effect the hold has on your credit limit shouldn't be a big deal.
--
Mortimer Schnerd, RN

snipped-for-privacy@carolina.rr.com.BARF
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Yes. Sorry I've worked in POS pretty much all my life.

your
big
Not true either. I personally have the CC company put a set limit on my card. So an $800 hold definitely can be a "big deal" (or at least an inconvenience) - even without living "beyond your means". In fact, one *could* argue that those that are living beyond their means are the ones that may be least affected.
Now as far as using as a tool for financing - I never made that claim.
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Then you, of all people, *should* understand the difference between a 'hold' and a 'charge'.
The card has _not_ been 'effectively' charged, since *NO*MONEY*CHANGED*HANDS*. You are -not- incurring interest charges, nor are the 'free' days running.
You have made a _commitment_ to pay, those funds _are_ marked as *commited*, that's all.

If the limit is set low _at_your_request_, and you know you're going to have a big 'hold', *you* can ask the CC company to _raise_ the limit on the card, even _temporarily_, by the amount of the 'hold'. Voila! No more problem. All _you_ have to do is 'plan ahead'.
If _you_ are managing your account limit, then you *are* responsible for managing your account limit. You _know_ how the industry works. *USE* your knowledge. <grin>
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I went through the same thing with my bandsaw. I know it is hard to wait after you have made the decition to buy an item like that. However, I kindof understand why it happens. Predicting demand for an item not easy and if they overproduce they get stuck with too much inventory and can run into finacial trouble.
I just weighed the delay against the cost savings and I am happy with my bandsaw.
Rob

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Rob wrote:

Grizzly doesn't produce anything. They are importers. Predicting sales and maintaining an appropriate supply when the items are being shipped by ocean freighter from Asia is difficult.
-- Jack Novak Buffalo, NY - USA
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My experience with Grizzley was quite pleasant. I ordered a bandsaw (G0555) on Monday 7/8/03 and picked it up at the trucking dock on Wednesday 7/10/03. Hard to complain about that. I can and do, however, complain about the service (or lack thereof) from Harbor Freight.
WoodChuck

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Actually a better question would be - Do you bill the credit card at time of order or time of shipment?
Most reputable companies will only bill the cc at time of shipment.
As for the delay - remember they are shipping from Taiwan or China via ocean freight which is around 2 weeks+ depending on the route the ship takes, customs, etc.
BillyBob

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Well, so far, after several weeks, the answers to questions about availability add up to: "No, we don't have any and as of last Friday or so, we sorta might think of dreaming of getting one or two delivered by, say, the end of October, or maybe not, since the manufacturer seems to be having trouble of some sort. Back order list? I don't know about that."
All of which adds up to a story that Grizzly has told before, IMHO. Bluntly, I've not had that problem with, say, Rockler or Woodcraft or any other major mail order dealer.
If they do NOT have something in stock, I don't know that they're reliable about predicting when or if they will ever get any particular widget again. Waste of time. Look over old Grizzly threads. Reports go back years and years.

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When I ordered my bandsaw from them, I was told it was backordered and they gave me an estimate of when it would be delivered.

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You sure? with the authorization on hand, they don't have it on their tab, so no cash flow problem. I thought that was the way all these net merchant drop ship places worked.

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George,
Their catalog states that you won't be charged until a back-ordered item ships. http://www.grizzly.com/catalog/pages/499.cfm?&site=grizzly If they charged me before the item shipped then I would call them and tell them to remove the charge. I might even be mad enough to send a note to that president of theirs who seems to be quite fond of himself. What I wouldn't do is bitch and moan about it until this actually happened.
-Jack

arrives
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http://pages.cthome.net/edhome
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Yep, that's pretty much what I was thinking. The authorizations from the card companies become a sort of line of credit for them with the actual wholesaler/importer. Might even extend to other banking operations, if they are an accounts receivable asset.
Which, Jack, is how they can operate on a scale much larger than their means - there is no cash flow problem. THEY never buy anything, merely take a commission for selling on the others' behalf. When they charge your card is also fairly immaterial, as it's when you actually _pay_ that the game becomes more than an exchange of promises in the largest sense.

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Sure George,
If they can eliminate cost of inventory, so much the better for them and for you. Why pay someone to buy something, store it and then sell it to you? I'd hardly call it operating much larger than their means though. I'd also be pretty certain that whatever terms they have with their supplier are not completely dependent on them putting a hold on your credit card.
-Jack

cash,
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"edfan"

Seems 11 gallons at only 115 PSI is a design flaw, IMO, especially with such a high volume pump on it. This thing is going to cycle on and off like a pogo stick - unless all you run off it is a stapler.
I would find another model. A tank 2-3X the size isn't going to substantially change your footprint.
- Nate
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Hello-
Well I can share some thoughts as an owner of a mail order corporation, maybe that will help.
In my trade (mail order jewelry) it is fairly common practice to require either complete or partial payment for special order items. For example a diamond solitaire. However it is also expected practice to check with ones vendor for availability before accepting the customer's money. I assume that the item you want to get is not special order as they have it listed in their catalog.
If they are collecting and holding customer money for months on end that's called preselling. Its unfortunately common among small mail order outfits as a way to collect enough to make their vendors minimum. Just like Costco or Sam's Club stock is cheaper when bought in bulk and those wholesale discounts are very tempting. Preselling is very frowned upon by folks in the mail order trade. Mostly because the enumerable bad buying experiences that the clients have make all mail order companies look bad. And none needs bad press.
If they are simply encouraging you to place a back order but not charging the card until they actually ship then that's just like a waiting list. One vendor whom I have a 10 yrs relationship with does this occasionally. But they call me when my back order arrives and have me verbally authorize a charge on my card if I still want it and they also waive shipping charges for back orders as a way of thanking me for waiting.
What I find odd though is that Grizzly seems so hazy on when their shipment will arrive. No vendor I have ever worked with has ever not been totally accurate with the expected arrival date of a shipment. Perhaps its a case of their vendors supplier being out of stock? That's my best guess. Of course if my vendor pulled that on me they would no longer be my vendor.
That said I have never ordered from Grizzly's mail order catalog. I live about 3 minutes walk from their main office so I generally nip down to their show room. Perhaps I should walk down and see if they have a compressor on the floor?
Amy
On 23 Jul 2003 09:14:53 -0700, snipped-for-privacy@earthlink.net (edfan) wrote:

====================================================For great deals on fabulous jewlery and gifts check out www.crazycatgifts.com
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