Question on cutting with Compount miter saw

[Bill]

I was looking at pictures of DEWALT DW713 10-Inch Compound Miter Saw at Amazon.

don't have a miter saw, but I've been looking for a while. In the 3rd picture they show crown molding being cut with it lying diagonally. That doesn't seem very "supportive" to me, compared to the horizontal base or the vertical fence. The picture preceding that one is interesting too (it shows a 3" molding being cut resting on it's 1/2" edge--in that one I'm assuming the the molding is being supported by the side of the fence that you can't see (as well as the base).

It appears that the base is really the superior cutting surface of the saw, so I'm not sure if one would make a mostly-vertical cut against the fence. An explanation for the first picture I mentioned would be helpful. I hope the answer is not "just to make the piece fit in the saw"!

Thank you, Bill

[-MIKE-]

>> I don't have a miter saw, but I've been looking for a while.

Most people figure out a way to cut crown molding that works best for them and stick with it. There are many ways and you have to find what you like, because another guy may hate that approach. Some use blocks on the fence and table. Some use a jig. Some lay it flat and use the angles conversion table that comes with most high end miter saws.

I've tried many ways and I settled on the Bench Dog Crown Cut jig. I like it because it's not "attached" to the saw, it's very visual with diagrams showing you exactly how to position the piece of molding for the proper cut. It works very well, works for *me* and it's very portable.

BTW, the way the crown is positioned on the saw in that picture works fine as long as your trim is good quality. That 1/2" or less on each edge is plenty enough surface for the trim to sit at the proper angle, securely, when you're holding it. Sometimes you get trim with a really sloppy factory primer job that leave glops and drops and bubbles on the edges that can make it hard to "sit.' But a little sand paper or card scraper can take care of that.

[Swingman]

>> I don't have a miter saw, but I've been looking for a while.

As Mike said, everyone has a different approach that is comfortable for them. I prefer cutting crown in a shop made jig, thusly:

that for this to work, the crown is cut upside down:

also has a reasonable priced jig that works the same way, which also has some suggestions for uses which may help your understanding:

[Bill]

>>>>>>> I don't have a miter saw, but I've been looking for a while.

Mike, Thank you for your reply. I downloaded a copy of the Crown Cut jig manual and it is furthering the explanation. It doesn't not take long to see the value a jig like that! In the DeWalt reviews, many complain that a DeWalt hold down clamp is $50, is not at all easy to track down, and that it should come with the saw!

Thanks, Bill

[krw]

>>>>>>>>>>> I don't have a miter saw, but I've been looking for a while.

Don't be hung up on the DeWalt. There are other fish out there. Play with them so see which one you think is best. The lack of a hold-down would be a black mark but you'll probably want to add your own anyway.

[Larry Jaques]

I get by with a HF 12" slider. If you want precision, go with the Bosch or a Festool. Prices are $180, an arm and a leg, and both legs + your firstborn, respectively.

It is resting on both flats, top and back, so it's stable. No worries.

Huh? Look at the pics more closely. The flats on the back of the crown moulding give it a pretty good stability to cut against. If you're careful, there is relatively little pressure by the saw blade, which has super sharp teeth spinning really fast, on the piece.

-- Truth loves to go naked. --Dr. Thomas Fuller, Gnomologia, 1732

[Bill]

>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> I don't have a miter saw, but I've been looking for a while.

On my path of learning about these things, I have learned that bigger does not necessarily mean better (especially regarding accuracy). One thing I like about the 10" one I linked to (DW713) is that it's vertical height enables it to cut 4by4s, whereas Hitachi's less expensive unit for intance, does not.

Which one or two do you think are best? I'm the guy who bought a DeWalt 10-Amp drill, when he should have bought an impact driver! %-)

I think the right answer is that ya need a couple of these things to have ones bases covered, but I'm not going there yet!

Cheers, Bill

The lack of a hold-down would be a

[krw]

>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> I don't have a miter saw, but I've been looking for a while.

I don't know what you're looking to spend but I too was almost set on a 10", until I started really thinking about the cuts I wanted to make. I needed to cut a bunch of pieces of 2x to match a 15:12 pitch hip roof. The 12" saw came in quite handy. ;-)

Dunno, I bought a Bosch. I like it a lot but the dust collection could be a

*lot* better. Basically, it doesn't pick up anywhere nearly close enough to the blade, so most of the chips blow right on by the dust pick-up. Putting a dust collector on it is almost useless. I bought a "tent" sorta thingy to go around it to at least try to keep the dust local. I'd sure be leery about this if I were to replace it.

I bought three DeWalt drills; gave two of them to the kid. They were too heavy for the power. I kept the third, largest one. It has the second handle for big jobs (but that's what I have the hammer drill for). It doesn't get much use. ;-)

Drills/drivers? You betcha! I lost count of them. ;-) ...but my favorites are the Bosch 12V. They're light and powerful enough for anything short of a

10x4" screw (and the driver will set a couple of dozen of those).

[krw]

Good description. ;-) I also have the HF 10" slider (>In the 3rd picture they show crown molding being cut

...and a simple jig will give it all that much more stability.

[-MIKE-]

>>>>>>>>>>>>>> I don't have a miter saw, but I've been looking for a while.

IME, miter saw hold down clamps are only beneficial to one-armed users. :-) BTW, if you're just doing one job with a bunch of the same crown molding, five minutes with some scrap and super glue and you could have a great jig. These adjustable ones are worth the extra money if you're doing lots of different sized crown.

[krw]

>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> I don't have a miter saw, but I've been looking for a while.

Or your walls aren't square (are any?).

[DanG]

>> I don't have a miter saw, but I've been looking for a while.

Compound miter saws are a fairly recent development. Crown molding has been cut for years by setting it upside down in a miter box (hand or power) set at the "spring angle" of the molding and then cutting an inside coping angle or an outside miter.

Any good miter box, even a homemade wooden saw guide allows laying the molding up on the back edge or down on the bottom. It is the whole reason for having the tool. I guess I do not understand your dilemma.

[Bill]

>>>>>>> I don't have a miter saw, but I've been looking for a while.

Thank you Dan. I was just trying to understand how to use the tool properly. Two previous posters got me passed the "bumps" I was stuck on earlier. Thank you for your offer of assistance!

I actually have more (3") baseboard molding I might replace, than anything. Do you think that the saw doing a better job cutting it standing up, lying down, or doesn't it make any difference?

Bill

[Swingman]

NO ...

It is a simple process, put the 3" baseboard standing up against the back fence, and cut it at the appropriate angle, usually ~45.

~ Baseboard goes flat against a vertical wall, so cut it flat against the vertical fence.

~ Single piece crown molding generally installs at an angle against a wall and the ceiling ... it is this angle the complicates things, if you let it.

Fastest and easiest way to cut crown molding is upside down, at the same angle it will interface with the wall and ceiling, using both the vertical fence, and saw table.

That is all there is to it.

This is not rocket science, but it turns into it when you start doing the calculations, or using the formulas, to cut molding using the compound feature.

It is a good bet that less than 1% of those who buy a "compound" miter saw ever use the "compound" feature.

AAMOF, it is rare that a professional trim carpenter will ever use the compound feature. In years of building houses, I've never seen one used on a job site, even for the most complicated, ornate, two part crown, never.

Throw your money at something else more useful.

[Leon]

>>>>>>>>>>>>>> I don't have a miter saw, but I've been looking for a while.

Base board molding tends to be non symmetrical and because it appears that your CMS only tilts in one direction you are pretty much locked in to cutting the molding in the standing up position. You will be switching the angle from one 45 degree setting to the other 45 degree setting to do the other end for near 45 degree corners.

If you lay the molding on its back and make a 45 degree bevel cut for one end you will have to turn the molding over to the face to cut the other end and if the molding is not symmetrical this will not work. So your best bet is to have the bottom of the molding setting on the saw table.

With all that said you will find that probably no corner in your house will have a perfect 45 degree corner and they all will be different. If you are painting the moldings get close and calk or cope the ends to fit better. If staining use stainable or like colored putty or cope for a better fit.

[Leon]

>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>

I should have also mentioned in the second paragraph that if you lay the molding with the back on the CMS table you can keep it laying on its back and cutting the other end by flipping ends however again if the molding is not symmetrical and the top is tapered, which most are, it cold slip under the fence.

Basically less problematic with the base board standing and making angle cuts.

[-MIKE-]

>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> I don't have a miter saw, but I've been looking for a while.

Do out-of-square walls affect the angle at which the trim is held against the fence when cut?

[-MIKE-]

Baseboard is best cut with the top and front towards you, so it is the first part to be cut by the blade. This is so any tear-out will be avoided on the front of the trim. The top/narrow section of baseboard is very easy to tear out, even with a very sharp blade.

[dpb]

On 7/9/2012 9:35 AM, -MIKE- wrote: ...

Better to adjust the angle of the dangle of the cutting arm/head rather than try to fiddle w/ the work.

W/o a solid stop for it it's much more likely to grab and move thus ruining a sizable chunk of material (and if that was the second-end cut, your day just got a whole lot less pleasant... :( )

Not to say I haven't and don't do it on occasion ( :) )--but it's not the better way, no...

--

[krw]

>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> I don't have a miter saw, but I've been looking for a while.

Sure. If the walls aren't plum it's going to have an affect, no?