Pattern makers vice

In selecting a front vice for my work bench, I am intrigued by the pattern maker's vice such as the Tucker vice sold by Lee Valley at http://tinyurl.com/4hvrd . My local dealer has Taiwanese clone of this style that sells for $190. It appears to be quite well made and works smoothly.
I'd appreciate any comments from someone who owns or has used a similar vice.
Bob
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I bought the Taiwanese model from a Woodcraft dealer. It is a bit crude, but quite well made. They told me Lie Nielsen bought a bunch for their use.
I also considered the Tucker, but at $700, I am pretty confident it is not 3 plus times better than the Taiwanese vise, which is an Emmert knockoff. It's heavy, and seems to do everything the Tucker does, except it does not have the smaller carving jaws on the bottom (I don't carve), and it does not ahve the chain, which lets you open the vise with a foot pedal. I assume the fit and finish is better with the Tucker as well, but for $700, well......
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wrote:

I've not used that one, but I do use a friend's bench with Axminster's Emmett pattern
To quote past posts of mine: http://groups.google.com/groups?hl=en&lr=&ie=UTF-8&threadm=q6e37058n3rnfqi9sdljokq1cgpa1t49fb%404ax.com&rnum=1&prev=/groups%3Fhl%3Den%26lr%3D%26ie%3DUTF-8%26scoring%3Dd%26q%3Ddingbat%2Bgroup%253Arec.woodworking%2Bpattern%2Bvice%26btnG%3DSearch
An Emmett pattern patternmaker's vice is handy, and quite affordable for the modern Taiwanese repros. A great second vice, they're not so good as an only vice. They're always on the skew, so they're less rapid to clamp up square things, which is after all what you do most of the time. They're also difficult to mount rigidly on some types of bench.
and http://groups.google.com/groups?hl=en&lr=&ie=UTF-8&threadm 600a57%240%2422466%2444c9b20d%40news3.asahi-net.or.jp&rnum=2&prev=/groups%3Fhl%3Den%26lr%3D%26ie%3DUTF-8%26scoring%3Dd%26q%3Ddingbat%2Bgroup%253Arec.woodworking%2Bpattern%2Bvice%26btnG%3DSearch
You may also notice that tilting the vice jaw needs two Allens on the Lee Valley, and a simple handle on the Axminster. Although the Axminster is much easier here, for most uses I'd prefer the Lee Valley. The trouble is that most things we clamp are square (unless you really are a pattern maker) and it's all too easy for the jaw to swivel under its own weight. In fact, I find the Axminster to be a damned nuisance to use. I like it, and I'd like one as a second vice, but I wouldn't want to have a workshop where this was the only or main vice.
So, as I posted - I'd go with the biggest English non-tilting cast iron face vice I could find, with narrow-set guide bars for best access, a quick-release nut and hard maple faces at least 1/2" bigger than the cast iron.
--
Smert' spamionam

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I will generally agree with Andy. I have an Emmert turtle back with the add in tilt plate. Nice vice, but .....
What I like about the Tucker is the quick release of the jaws. If I need to go from holding a single board on edge to 12" open, its a lot of turns. Quick release is nice. Also the jaws in the Emmert are wide, that's good and bad. If I stand a board vertical in the right side of the jaws, I have to put a spacer block on the left side to compensate for the flex.
Bernie

http://groups.google.com/groups?hl=en&lr=&ie=UTF-8&threadm=q6e37058n3rnfqi9sdljokq1cgpa1t49fb%404ax.com&rnum=1&prev=/groups%3Fhl%3Den%26lr%3D%26ie%3DUTF-8%26scoring%3Dd%26q%3Ddingbat%2Bgroup%253Arec.woodworking%2Bpattern%2Bvice%26btnG%3DSearch
http://groups.google.com/groups?hl=en&lr=&ie=UTF-8&threadm 600a57%240%2422466%2444c9b20d%40news3.asahi-net.or.jp&rnum=2&prev=/groups%3Fhl%3Den%26lr%3D%26ie%3DUTF-8%26scoring%3Dd%26q%3Ddingbat%2Bgroup%253Arec.woodworking%2Bpattern%2Bvice%26btnG%3DSearch
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Andy Dingley wrote:

http://groups.google.com/groups?hl=en&lr=&ie=UTF-8&threadm=q6e37058n3rnfqi9sdljokq1cgpa1t49fb%404ax.com&rnum=1&prev=/groups%3Fhl%3Den%26lr%3D%26ie%3DUTF-8%26scoring%3Dd%26q%3Ddingbat%2Bgroup%253Arec.woodworking%2Bpattern%2Bvice%26btnG%3DSearch
My solution to many (not all) of the problems a pattern makers vise can solve is this:
http://www.geocities.com/plybench/tour.html#vise_stick
If you need to hold non-rectangular items, you can use a jaw insert, similar to the emmert design.
BugBear
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I have a bunch of Emmert's, turtles and newer. None of the later clones have the mass of the Emmert, but some have other good attributes. It takes a substantial bench to hold a large Emmert.
--
Ross
www.myoldtools.com
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    Greetings and Salutations...
wrote:

    Well, last year, in a moment when enthusiasm overcame wisdom I picked up a real Emmert turtleback off Ebay. It was actually a pretty good deal, as, including shipping, it was about $465...and it does cost a bit to ship 100+ lbs of iron and steel halfway across the country.     I had to do some work on it, and spent another $50 on parts but, still have a decent deal, I think.     Now...how do I like it? I like it A LOT! It was called the "Iron Hand" when it was produced, because of its strength and flexibility. I have already used its ability to hold heavy objects at odd angles several times. While it would have been possible to do the work without the vise, it made it a LOT easier. For example, I am working on carving a "story stick" for a friend. Before I had the Emmert, it was kind of a pain to hold this thing. It is about 7' long, and, roughly octagonal. I was clamping a 2x4 in my regular vise and using "F" clamps and such to stabilize it. Now...I just swing the vise up, and clamp the pole in it. when I finish an area, it is trivial to readjust it.     Also, I built a Biesemeyer fence for my table saw this Spring. Having the Emmert made that go a LOT easier both from the flexibility aspect and the strength. That vise is ONE solid support!     Now...as for the $200 clones available. I have laid hands on them, and, frankly, was just on the verge of getting one of them when this opportunity came up. They are fairly well made, and, quite strong. They are slightly smaller than the Tucker and Emmert vises (either patterned after the #2 Emmert, or made from patterns taken directly from the vise... without accounting for shrinkage). I would say that while they are expensive, they seem to be pretty good values for the money.     Having said all this, I should also note that I got by quite well for 30 years or so without the patternmaker's vise. Actually, at first, all I had was a small machinist's vise bolted to one end of the bench. It was only about ten or 15 years ago that I picked up a "real" woodworker's vise (from Grizzly Industrial, actually...) and was way impressed by how much easier it made so many tasks. If you are serious about woodworking (or metalworking, for that matter) the patternmaker's vise is a great addition. If you only get into the shop once or twice a year to make a box... probably not worth it, except as a cool toy.     Regards     Dave Mundt
    
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