OT: What good are the random searches in NY?

[CW]

To a great degree, they already have.

[Todd Fatheree]

Nice soundbite. GMAFB. If the status quo is defined as terrorist victory, I'd agree to cease hostility on both sides right now and concede defeat.

todd

[David]

You don't negotiate with murderous terrorists, so why would you "concede" defeat?? do you think their campaigns of terror would stop suddenly?? They are hell bent on destroying us, regardless of the price they individually pay. They certainly don't care what a black mark their actions place upon their "fellow" Muslims. With all that's going on the world right now, I'm ashamed to be a member of the human race, so I can scarcely imagine the embarrassment and dismay of law abiding Muslims. I seriously doubt that ALL of them have murder in their hearts! It's too bad that the non-terrorist Muslims can't locate and turn in the ringleaders for prosecution.

Dave

[Upscale]

Sorry, but you're deluded if you think that would come close to solving problems. Conceding defeat means that you're capitulating to their way of life, whatever they decide it should be. Gone would be every luxury in life you've ever known. Medicine, viable health care, enough food to live on. Poof, all gone! In effect, you're saying that by conceding defeat, you're willing to become a virtual slave.

I'd prefer to die now fighting back than endure the limited life span I'd have at the hands of terrorist gatekeepers.

[Todd Fatheree]

Apparently following a thread isn't the strong suit of some people. My point was that, contrary to the CW's assertion that the terrorists have already won, I don't believe they've won much of anything. I don't believe, as I suspect he does, that the Constitution has been flushed down the toilet and our civil liberties are significantly curtailed by the dreaded Patriot Act. The bottom line is that I think life is pretty good in the US at the moment, so if this is what it feels like to lose, I'll call it a day if the terrorists will. Let me ask you...if all hostilities ended today between us and the terrorists, would you feel bad about our current position? I don't, which was my point.

todd

[Upscale]

If I misread you're part in the thread, then you have my apologies.

No I wouldn't feel bad about our current position. It's a nice thought, but entirely outside the bounds of reality. I'm sure that terrorists view continuing with their ideology in the same way that the USA views it's activities in Iraq. If the USA was to quit now, all the effort (and loss) sustained so far will have been a complete waste.

There's only one way to deal with terrorists whose thinking is so diametrically opposed to ours and that's to wipe them out completely as I'm sure, they think the same way about us. My only middling regret about all of this so far is that our Canadian government did not more directly support the USA in Iraq.

[Doug Kanter]

Why would the Canadians want to get behind a list of reasons, all (but one) of which have turned out to be nonsense? I'm not aware of any international treaty which requires other countries to do stupid things.

[Upscale]

international

Obviously, there's far fewer reasons now (such as not finding any WMDs) than there were just before the war in Iraq began. Nevertheless, I'm of the mind that a country should support its neighbour since much of the commerce and lifestyle between our countries is so inexorably linked. That doesn't mean that it should follow it into some completely ridiculous situation, just that Canada shouldn't have adopted such complete hands off policy. Just because Canada doesn't have a significant military presence, doesn't mean that we can't contribute in other areas.

Don't forget, the war in Iraq (forgetting about oil for the moment) was at least partially considered a humanitarian war. Sadam was a proven dictator subjugating much of his people to incredible hardship at will. Just because the war in Iraq hasn't turned out so far as hoped, doesn't mean that there wasn't some merit behind going there in the first place.

One of these days, there's going to be a terrorist situation originating from an out of country source in Canada. It's not a question of it might happen, it's just a matter of when. If it's serious enough and on the off chance that Canada decides to go to war over it, I know that the USA will be there to support us in almost every respect. I believe this with everything I know. How can I feel any different with the roles reversed?

[Todd Fatheree]

Does anybody friggin' read anything? Of course if we unilaterally stopped our efforts, it would be chaos. My point is pretty simple. I support my stance that the terrorists haven't "already won" by stating that *if* hostilities ended now on both sides, I believe most people would not feel as though we had lost. I don't advocate a cessation of hostilities on our part, because it, of course, would not be reciprocated.

todd

[Doug Miller]

I don't think so. Not the same ISP, not the same browser, not the same OS.

[Doug Kanter]

I guess this is where we differ. It sounds like you're taking an "OK....we were wrong" stance. I, on the other hand, am focused on evidence that President Rove knew even before 9/11 that we'd be going to Iraq, and that any reason he provided to the public were a complete crock, except for the "Saddam's a bad man" thing, which was true, but a red herring.

[CW]

Since you seem to be such an expert mind reader, tell me what I'm thinking about you right now. After you're done with that, go back a read what I said. What is the point of terrorism? To instill fear and paranoia? Yes. Have they done that? Yes, to great effect egged on by an administration who finds it suits their purposes quite nicely.

[CW]

Yes, I do believe you're right.

[Todd Fatheree]

I predict you're thinking that if you keep top-posting, I'll be really annoyed about having to keep fixing it. You're right.

of terrorism? To instill fear and paranoia? Yes.

Well, it isn't paranoia if they're really out to get us, is it, genius?

I can see it's installed paranoia in at least one person.

todd

[CW]

You're wrong, as usual. Care to try again.

[John B]

I agree, that to some point they already have, by making the "Free" world nations alter their laws, and placing apprehension, if not fear in there citizens' hearts. Unfortunately with our country's fighting terrorists it's like playing a game of monopoly with us following the rules and the opponent not having any. There's a better than even chance that we will lose the game or give up and go home. At least if we loose we can all feel good about playing by the rules and not cheating. As my Dad says " It's better being wrong and alive than right and dead"

These are broad statements and just a few of my thoughts. To clarify I would have to write a bloody book and and I ain't doin' that. Toss political correctness out the window and Give the bastards what they deserve.

Oh well, another bucket of fuel on the fire :)

All the best to one and all in these troubled times John

[Todd Fatheree]

Sorry, I just can't compete with that. I mean, you know you've been had when someone busts out "you're wrong". For a second, I thought my points had merit, but then you said "you're wrong". I guess you really showed me.

todd

[Upscale]

What? You mean there's people out there who don't like seeing the thong a plumber is wearing when he's fixing your sink?

[John B]

Any plumber not wearing overalls and/or braces should be declared a public menace :)