OT: What good are the random searches in NY?

[barry]

Who wrote the song "Glad to be Unhappy"? Was that Cole Porter?

Kinda sums up David. As does "boca grande, cabeza chiquita."

Maybe a hearing-impaired neo-con? Relax, David. Chill out.

TTFN, J

[Doug Kanter]

I told you I was not trying to offend you, but asked your age because it was (and still is) germane to this discussion. Go back and read it again. You're hearing what you want to hear. Is it possible you're not familiar with the word "germane", and that somehow causing you problems?

[fredfighter]

Questioning people for reading books is just plain wrong.

[Doug Kanter]

Sympathizers? We're talking about using people who have no idea their luggage is being utilized to carry bombs. That's not a "sympathizer".

[fredfighter]

Can you show that it is really being done to 'good effect'?

I am reminded of the LA paid police informant who admitted he was giving police random addresses. He was considered 'reliable' because police found illegal drugs or unregistered guns at more than a quarter of the locations he gave them.

Makes you sort of wonder if there aren't multiple motives on the part of officials who want to search commuters.

One of the problems noted with the racist 'drug courier' profile used by the NJ State Police was that it included African American as part of the profile despite the actual statistics that showed African Americans to be under represented (less common that amoung the general population) amoung drug couriers.

It seems the authors of the profile hadn't relied on any factual information they just wrote the profile up based on what they _knew_.

[David]

I know, I know! That was clearly unacceptable, but in today's world we have more pressing matters that require some broadening of the government's ability to ferret out the murdering bastards. To worry that they will focus on Joe Sixpack is just more paranoia in my book. the authorities have their hands full with potential real terrorists to be wasting time railroading innocent Americans. I can't believe that you really think that would be the result of the Patriot Act or similar future legislation that may be required as things heat up further.

Dave

[David]

point taken. THEN you follow with a snide comment that I may not understand the word germane. My, my. Can we stay on topic?

Dave

[Doug Kanter]

Keep in mind that legislation is harder to get rid of than it is to put in place. Most of the legislators who spoke out against the renewal of the Patriot Act (without modifying it a bit) ended up voting to keep it, just as it is. So, saying "we need it now" sounds innocent enough until you find that it's impossible to get rid of.

By the way, my definition of paranoia involves fear of things that are imaginary. The abuses you've been told about have already happened, and they will happen again. Bank on it.

[Doug Kanter]

Everyone misunderstands words sometimes. Even me.

"Some of these people have even been trained to disassemble. That means to not tell the truth".

-George W. Bush

[David]

Ever heard of a bomb sniffing machine such as the one I watched my luggage go through at the airport last week??? No need for profiling. The young European Woman didn't bring down the plane; the bomb did. That's what technology is for: locating the bombs. Police frisking people at random and then letting those who refuse is a total waste of time. IF the police would detain anyone who refused, that would be a different story.

Dave

[Charlie Self]

Not all that bad an idea. Shall we try---gasp!--woodworking?

[David]

So what's the solution? Laissez-faire? You gotta break a few eggs to make an omelet. The stakes are so high, that civil rights (to some extent) will take a deserved back seat to the methods needed to thwart the terrorists. It's NECESSARY, or there won't be any more "us" to debate this issue.

Dave

[David]

We "wood", but this topic has been clearly labeled as "OT", Charlie. so as long as we are OT, we are not allowed to discuss woodworking. :)

Dave

[Doug Kanter]

OK then. You go first.

[Doug Kanter]

Here? :-)

[David]

I'm going for a bike ride in a minute. If I see any Young European Women along the way, I'll be sure they are thoroughly frisked. :)

Dave

[fredfighter]

So why not sniff the passengers for bombs?

Agreed. If police are allowed to detain people for refusing to be searched then the story is that we are no longer a free people.

[David]

I'm not concerned about being scrutinized or abused by the government due to thier additional new powers. (The've already been there and done that and I survived and it had nothing to do with extradodinary powers granted by the Patriot Act).

Dave

[David]

Me thinks you are oversimplifying when you say "no longer a free people". There are plenty of rules and regs to keep one from feeling footloose and fancy free, without the inclusion of rules aimed at terrorism per se.

Dave

[Doug Kanter]

You're right, I guess. History previous to 1980 has hereby been erased.