OT us soldiers re-enlisting at a high rate?

Page 3 of 5  


no, i am arguing that people are claiming i said something i didnt. if you think im arguing anything else you have missed the point. but hey. you're not alone.
randy
Add pictures here
<% if( /^image/.test(type) ){ %>
<% } %>
<%-name%>
Add image file
Upload
wrote:

If that's what you're arguing, then you need to go back and re-read the posts as many times as needed, until you understand what the argument is about.

entire thread.
-- Regards, Doug Miller (alphageek-at-milmac-dot-com)
Get a copy of my NEW AND IMPROVED TrollFilter for NewsProxy/Nfilter by sending email to autoresponder at filterinfo-at-milmac-dot-com You must use your REAL email address to get a response.
Add pictures here
<% if( /^image/.test(type) ){ %>
<% } %>
<%-name%>
Add image file
Upload
wrote:

i knew i would lose you on this one.

the term 'so what' implies that you agree. the only claim i made was that the percent is falling.
here is where your logic breaks down.
what did i ever claim it meant? please quote me and tell me where i ever drew a conclusion that said something like 'because the % is falling this must be true...."
randy
Add pictures here
<% if( /^image/.test(type) ){ %>
<% } %>
<%-name%>
Add image file
Upload
wrote:

No, Randy, you're the one that got lost. If you truly don't see that your paraphrase omitted a significant aspect of the situation, then there is no point in discussing this any further, because you simply don't grasp principles of logic well enough to debate the point.

*Here* is where you lose me: I must confess I don't see the purpose in your continuing to cite a figure that you now appear to agree is meaningless.

Huh?
think it means _something_. Now I'm wondering why you keep repeating something that you know doesn't mean anything.
-- Regards, Doug Miller (alphageek-at-milmac-dot-com)
Get a copy of my NEW AND IMPROVED TrollFilter for NewsProxy/Nfilter by sending email to autoresponder at filterinfo-at-milmac-dot-com You must use your REAL email address to get a response.
Add pictures here
<% if( /^image/.test(type) ){ %>
<% } %>
<%-name%>
Add image file
Upload
(Doug Miller) wrote:

apples are the same variety or size as last year's apples, and by that omission implies that they are the same. They may be, they may not be, but if this is not known the comparison is meaningless, and thus, to most people, pointless as well.
-- Regards, Doug Miller (alphageek-at-milmac-dot-com)
Get a copy of my NEW AND IMPROVED TrollFilter for NewsProxy/Nfilter by sending email to autoresponder at filterinfo-at-milmac-dot-com You must use your REAL email address to get a response.
Add pictures here
<% if( /^image/.test(type) ){ %>
<% } %>
<%-name%>
Add image file
Upload

jeez you wonder why i keep repeating myself.
hint: this is what i said in the original post:
the article makes no mention of what the actual number of troops the 106% represented nor does it provide any numbers for the rate during other wars/situations so no further comparasson can be made.
although i did spell comparison wrong i think i made it pretty clear.
randy
Add pictures here
<% if( /^image/.test(type) ){ %>
<% } %>
<%-name%>
Add image file
Upload
wrote:

which leaves one wondering why you keep repeating it.
-- Regards, Doug Miller (alphageek-at-milmac-dot-com)
Get a copy of my NEW AND IMPROVED TrollFilter for NewsProxy/Nfilter by sending email to autoresponder at filterinfo-at-milmac-dot-com You must use your REAL email address to get a response.
Add pictures here
<% if( /^image/.test(type) ){ %>
<% } %>
<%-name%>
Add image file
Upload
(Doug Miller) wrote:

and you accuse me of not having logic... the apple is the % of their goal. you are the one who keeps trying to toss the orange in there and saying im drawing some other conclusion based on it. my analogy stands quite well.
what comparison am i making (please quote me) except to say that the % of their goal fell? where is the orange?
randy
Add pictures here
<% if( /^image/.test(type) ){ %>
<% } %>
<%-name%>
Add image file
Upload
wrote:

But it's not the same "apple" from one year to the next. So any comparison between them is meaningless.

*You* are the one who tossed the orange in here, by making a comparison between two different things. I never said you were trying to draw any kind of conclusion from the comparison, I only pointed out that the comparison is utterly meaningless.
And your analogy is fatally flawed, as I have pointed out, because it uses the same name for things being compared, which are *not* the same. If you are unable to see this, there is no point in further discussion.

That *is* the comparison: saying "that the % of their goal fell" implies a comparison to whatever it fell from. The orange is that the goal one year, and the goal the next year, may or may not be the same, and thus comparisons of the percentages of the (possibly different) goals are without meaning.
-- Regards, Doug Miller (alphageek-at-milmac-dot-com)
Get a copy of my NEW AND IMPROVED TrollFilter for NewsProxy/Nfilter by sending email to autoresponder at filterinfo-at-milmac-dot-com You must use your REAL email address to get a response.
Add pictures here
<% if( /^image/.test(type) ){ %>
<% } %>
<%-name%>
Add image file
Upload
(Doug Miller) wrote:

which is why im not drawing any comparasion except to say the % of their goal has fallen. you have already conceded this point.

of course it is.

no it doesnt. i think ive made this clear. this is the leap you are all making that i do not agree with. it doesnt imply anything except that if you compare the percentages, one is lower than the other, hence has fallen.

the comparason of the percentages is meaningless except to say one is lower than the other. i thought we were past this. this has been my point all along. i NEVER claimed otherwise. others claimed i did and that is what i have taken exception to.
todd had made the claim he used the article to provide the proof of his claim that enlistment is high. that was todd. not me. i have specifically stated several times that while the statement "the percent of their goal is falling" is true, you cannot make any further assumptions. the irony here is that you are using the same agruments i have made to show why todd couldnt prove re-enlistment is up, to show that i cant prove its something else. i never ever claimed it meant anything except that the percentages of their goal were falling.
so in short, it sounds like we agree.
randy
Add pictures here
<% if( /^image/.test(type) ){ %>
<% } %>
<%-name%>
Add image file
Upload
wrote:

Conceded what? It's a meaningless comparison.

Then why do you insist on repeating it?

I'm afraid the discussion must end for me at this point. I see no purpose in continuing a debate with a person who is unable or unwilling to see the comparison implicit in that statement.

I'll try one last time: since you do not know what the raw numbers are, comparing the percentages is of no value, and any statements about the differences in those percentages have no meaning.

You still haven't caught on, have you? It's not "meaningless except...", it's meaningless, period. "To say one is lower than the other" is meaningless, because you don't know what you're comparing.

You can't even make *that* assumption. It's meaningless, because the goals may have changed, and you don't know what they are.

It doesn't even mean that. It doesn't mean anything at all.

I don't think so... You seem to think there's some meaning in that comparison.
-- Regards, Doug Miller (alphageek-at-milmac-dot-com)
Get a copy of my NEW AND IMPROVED TrollFilter for NewsProxy/Nfilter by sending email to autoresponder at filterinfo-at-milmac-dot-com You must use your REAL email address to get a response.
Add pictures here
<% if( /^image/.test(type) ){ %>
<% } %>
<%-name%>
Add image file
Upload

I danced the same dance with him last week, Doug. He'll keep going until you stop. Just another line (4, actually, but who's counting) in the killfile now.
Add pictures here
<% if( /^image/.test(type) ){ %>
<% } %>
<%-name%>
Add image file
Upload
wrote:

you know this isnt true. you've just jumped in a hole defending your position and cant get out gracefully. its ok. i understand. stick to your guns.

why did you/people keep accusing me of assigning meaning to it? ive been wondering that for like 4 days now...
if that stops, i will stop. if it continues, i will continue. im not driving this thing, im just stopping you guys from assigning false statements to me.
randy
Add pictures here
<% if( /^image/.test(type) ){ %>
<% } %>
<%-name%>
Add image file
Upload
wrote:

I've already explained the fatal flaws in your analogy at least twice, and I won't repeat them here.
-- Regards, Doug Miller (alphageek-at-milmac-dot-com)
Get a copy of my NEW AND IMPROVED TrollFilter for NewsProxy/Nfilter by sending email to autoresponder at filterinfo-at-milmac-dot-com You must use your REAL email address to get a response.
Add pictures here
<% if( /^image/.test(type) ){ %>
<% } %>
<%-name%>
Add image file
Upload

I NEVER SAID THIS!! show me where i said re-enlistment was going down.
lets get this straight. here is what i said:
but lets move on. the 96% number is not a pure number. it doesnt mean 96% of the soldiers re-signed their papers, it means only 96% of their goal was met. as compared to 106% the year before. so when compared to their re-enlistment goal, its falling. the article makes no mention of what the actual number of troops the 106% represented nor does it provide any numbers for the rate during other wars/situations so no further comparasson can be made.
i specifically qualified it and said compared to their enlistment goal. are you saying thats not true? probably...
randy
Add pictures here
<% if( /^image/.test(type) ){ %>
<% } %>
<%-name%>
Add image file
Upload

When the topic is number of re-enlistments and you throw in a "it's falling" comment, yeah, it's irrelevant at best and disingenous at worst.
Add pictures here
<% if( /^image/.test(type) ){ %>
<% } %>
<%-name%>
Add image file
Upload

so my statement isnt false. in fact its absolutely true according to the article.. is it irrelevant? considering the article was used to show troop re-enlistment is high, i think it is completely relevant. at best the ONLY information you can get from the article at all is that its falling compared to last years goal (which is exactly what i said, and considering the title of the article and the numbers provided, it was clearly the point of the article, do you hate the writer too?), and at worse, no information at all. clearly there is no proof there that re-enlistment is high.
come on dave... the article was titled "iraq duty deters re-enlistment'
let's get your position clear. do you think the article provided proves that troop re-enlistment is high? let down your guard for 1 minute and answer honestly.
randy
Add pictures here
<% if( /^image/.test(type) ){ %>
<% } %>
<%-name%>
Add image file
Upload
for the record, im sure you are all fine people and in real life we would all have a gas. hell i'd even cook todd up a nice rib steak and some fresh aspharagas from the garden. and we wouldnt talk about politics <g>
peace.
randy
Add pictures here
<% if( /^image/.test(type) ){ %>
<% } %>
<%-name%>
Add image file
Upload

Can we skip the asparagus? I don't suppose there is any broccoli in that garden? If you get the charcoal going, I'll bring the steaks. ;-)
todd
Add pictures here
<% if( /^image/.test(type) ){ %>
<% } %>
<%-name%>
Add image file
Upload

ill put little green wigs on the asparagas. you wont notice the difference <g>
but seriously. its easy to get caught up in internet arguments, but the forum isnt very good for extended discussion, and what takes 10 pages to try and make clear so nobody is misunderstanding each other would probably take 1 minute in real life. i dont hate you, and i hope you dont hate me. we just dont agree about iraq. and we arent alone... i certainly dont have all the answers.
ok ok. ill get the brocoli, but it will have to be from the store!
ttyl randy
Add pictures here
<% if( /^image/.test(type) ){ %>
<% } %>
<%-name%>
Add image file
Upload

Related Threads

    HomeOwnersHub.com is a website for homeowners and building and maintenance pros. It is not affiliated with any of the manufacturers or service providers discussed here. All logos and trade names are the property of their respective owners.