OT: TurboCad Deluxe V12

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Hi all,
I've run TurboCad Pro version 7 for many years now and get along very well with it. I recall versions 8 thru 10 were a little buggy and provided not a lot of great added features so I bypassed those. Now I'm retired I no longer need the full power of the Pro version and so have been considering upgrading to the less expensive Deluxe version. Then, conincidentally, today I received an ad for an upgrade to V12 for $49.50 and I'm very seriously considering going for it at that price. Previously it was $149 for the upgrade version.
My questions: Is there any experience here with version 12? It is buggy, ease of install, that sort of thing. Oh, and is the CD standalone or does it depend on keeping the old version around to install the new? I hate those kinds of updates though I understand why they do it. Guess I'm mostly interested in buggy and ease of installation.
Just thought I'd see if there was any real world experience around before I plop down my money.
TIA,
Pop
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Hello Pop,
From your response to my posting about CAD (for which I am truly grateful!), I would bet that you are years ahead of me in CAD experience and skill, but I'll do the best I can with your question...
I am using TurboCAD v12 Pro and it works great - very, very happy with it. I can't speak to the Deluxe version, but you might consider downloading it and running it for a few weeks before you buy.
You can get the full working copy here for a trial period. http://www.turbocad.com/free_downloads.asp
I didn't install over an old copy, but my install was easy and painless.
Sorry if that wasn't golden information for you, but you are on my shortlist of TurboCAD experts that I plan on pestering....
Regards,
JBD in Denver
Pop wrote:

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I have TurboCAD v12 Deluxe, upgraded from v11 this year. I use it every day and have found that there is little that I need to draw that can't be done with it. Of course the Deluxe version won't do the solid modeling that the Pro version does. But I get along quite well without it. My 3D stuff looks decent without the texturing and solid modeling.
Installation is easy. No additional disk or prior program needed. I made a CD from my installation once it was done, just to keep it around if I need to re-install for some reason. The program isn't any more buggy that most others I've seen. In fact, the 3D and 2D Boolean operations are cleaner than before.
John

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I have V12 Pro. I don't use it. I went back to V11 until they fix it. One patch out so far and it's still to broke to use. This version may be beyond hope. Hit Ebay for V11. 8 was good. 9 had problems. 10 was hopeless. 11 is quite good. 12 sucks. These guys are gaining a pretty bad track record but, it is under new ownership as of recently so who knows what will happen.

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CW,
I'm very new to CAD, so I'm sure that there are many things that escape me using Pro V12... It's the only thing I've used (not counting dabbling w/ DesignCAD on an XT in the mid 80s).
Your post scares me - what problems should I be looking for in V12? Does it crash, is it too hard to use, measurements are bad?? Not looking for a full review - just what could hurt me in the long run - in design and learning the program.
Thanks
jbd in Denver
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JBD in Denver wrote:

AS an admitted newbie, you most likely have little to worry about. The basics are likely to work pretty well - and IMO you're not likely to see many problems for some time to come at your level of expertise. I went ahead and downloaded the trial version and have played with it on drawings created in version 7 with zero problems so far. The only thing that's showed up to date has been a Pro version use of lighting/light sources that Deluxe doesn't do, and which are totally unimportant to me. Haven't played much with the 3D stuff yet, but it's handling every drawing from 7 that I've opened so far. And, I see a lot of fixes and improvements along the way that I like. I'll likely pay for it tomorrow unless something bad shows up in the meantime. Oh, haven't tried the new (to me) extrude functions yet either; hope to this afternoon.
HTH Pop`
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First thing I will say is that you really should go to their user forum. It is more active and more helpful than any cad user group I have seen. There are more than a few people that are not happy with V12. Some of use do not use it due to the problems. We have gone back to V11 which does work quite nicely. I really can't give you a list of what the problems are as I haven't used it much. I ran into a major bug early on that made me go back to version 11. That bug is in the dimension tools. I have (as do most serious users) several dimension styles set up, any of which I may use depending on the drawing. In order for the size of the dimensions to print correctly, there is a size scale setting in the dimension tools. The problem is that changing this setting has no effect. The size can be changed after the dimension is placed (very time consuming) but not before. The alternatives are to set up a new dimension style for each scale (redundant and a huge waste of time) or to dimension at 1:1 scale and then change each one when done. Both are a waste of time and can create errors. This is a feature that I can't do without thus rendering the software unusable for me. Depending on the way you draw and dimension, this may well not effect you. There are other problems that others on that forum could tell you about but the dimscale one is the killer for me. See the forum for further information. Yes, you have to register and log in. No, they do not spam you.

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They are not very consistent in their sales attempts. There are lots of people that get called frequently. Me, they call occasionally, usually to try to sell me a version that I already have. They never seem to know who has what. For this reason, they don't know who is eligible for an upgrade. They will sell an upgrade to anyone. All they have to do is say that they have the previous version. They don't know (probably don't really care either).
<Tom Veatch> wrote in message said:

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Thank you, that's very useful. I do plan to go to the forums but this is the kind of real world thing I hoped to come across; it helps target the relevent forum posts from the chaffe quicker. Forums are negative by nature as that's their purpose; here there's more of a chance of a balanced set of opinions.
Regards,
Pop`
CW wrote:

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You said you don't like it, but why not? What is there about it that you found to be a problem/s? What are you running it on? RAM? Etc?
I can't find an update to it; but then I've only downloaded the trial version. Where is the update on their site so I can read about it? Any hints? Their updates page shows nothing for version 12 and it's been out for quite awhile now.
I've seen 8, 9, and 10 but this is my first look at 12, havng decided to skip 11 altogether just for GPs since it was supposed to hve been a good release version and 12 was simply built upon 11.
Specifics of any kind would be appreciated.
Pop`
CW wrote:

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I upgraded to version 12 from version 11. Haven't used it enough yet to comment on bugs and the like. But ... as far as installation; I don't know if you need the old version installed or not for it to install the upgrade (I don't think so, based upon the install messages, but can't confirm). However, you do have to do the on-line registration thing, or the copy will self-expire after 30 days. I'm not too fond of on-line registration requirements, but had forgotten that detail from the version 11 install.
+--------------------------------------------------------------------------------+ If you're gonna be dumb, you better be tough +--------------------------------------------------------------------------------+
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Mark & Juanita wrote:

Thanks, appreciate the comeback. NBD over needing the prior version other than the nuisance of keeping it around for future installs should they be needed.
If I read correctly, the online registration is to force you to go to them to get one of the install codes needed; authorization or something. Apparently there are two codes; a serial number and an auth code? Not sure.
Question: Does it call home do you know? I don't mean auto update checks; I mean more like data-sending activity at odd times. I've been watching this trial version and it's not calling home, but that doesn't mean much since it's "trial" software. I don't like Call Homes when I have no way of checking to see what's being transmitted and to whom.
Another person mentioned a patch/update for it. Would you mind posting your rev level from Help About? I don't see any patches available for it.
Thanks, & TIA
Pop`
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Yes on both accounts. Serial number is in code you receive, authorization code is what you get when you do the on-line activation.

As far as I can tell, it does not phone home. It will check for updates if you let it, but I have it set to manually check.

I have version 12.1, build 49.1. I think it was an on-line update after I got the initial install disk
+--------------------------------------------------------------------------------+ If you're gonna be dumb, you better be tough +--------------------------------------------------------------------------------+
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Mark & Juanita wrote:

+--------------------------------------------------------------------------------+
+--------------------------------------------------------------------------------+ You've been very helpful; thank you.
Pop
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Pop wrote:
< TurboCad>

a good firewall will tell you when any software is phoning home. there are several good free firewalls out there.
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My thanks to all those who responded. After futzing with the trial version for a bit, I plunked down my money yesterday and downloaded the software.
What a disappointment!
Just a few minutes ago, while I was asking for my refund, all ran successfully and when I got to the final page, the text, just below where it said "Refund Initiated", says:
" (We'll put a whole bunch of stuff here with instructions on what an eLOD is and how to complete it, but no one has given me the text for it. "
Now, THAT's a great bit of professionalism, ain't it? Gee gawrsh, monkee, if somebody don't do it fer me, I shur can't dew it!!
Jeez, I couldn't believe it! How pathetic. Oh, and that missing information was on the preceding page!
I think I'll follow up my refund request with a phone call!
LOL, Pop`
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You might want to take a look at Intellicad from here,
http://www.autodsys.com /
Looks like and works a lot like AutoCAD and LT. I have been using CAD software since 1986 and this is pretty intuitive and cheap. Plus you get a decent free trial.
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What, exactly, is the problem(s) that made you get a refund? No, I don't think 12 is worth using but some do. I went back to 11 early on. You might want to look at EBay for 11. Yes, it's legal to buy it this way (legal for any software but IMSI admits it, some don't).

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Well, there were several issues and annoyances, really, once I started to put it to real work. I never figured out exactly what the sources of the problems were, I only knew they were new and unacceptable due to the number of them.
-- Dimensioning and sometimes dragging littered the screen with interim line draws of whatever you were working on until the area was visibly useless until I did an F5 Redraw. That one I found others commenting on at one of the forums, such as those things are. I have to say, they're in a steep downward spiral in my opinion.
-- Hatching was hit or miss. -- Switching from one tool to another was hit or miss; might or might not switch on the first click. -- I couldn't get some settings to "stick" when set in the Options menues. -- Unpredictable start up times, apparently depending on what else had been going on in memory. -- Somehow, they man aged to make the screen a lot harder to see the tools compared to my old 7. Same size, just a lot harder to see. Everything I had problems with worked fine in version 7.1 Pro. There are some nice additions and useful features, but ... it just didn't work out. Very annoying to use. I will say it never crashed or mucked anything up, but it was certainly a large annoyance for something I paid for. Bad guess on my part. Oh, and no backward compatability was a big issue too. A LOT of people are still using versions 5 and 7.
There were a few other things but that's a short list of it. I tried the uninstall/clean/reinstall with no success.
I'm more likely just stick with 7.1 Pro rather than throw anymore money after it. I simply got sucked in by the $49 price; it seemed like a deal, but then you get what you pay for. Version 7.1, the Pro version, does everything and more than I really need at this stage of my life so I'll stick with it.
IF nothing else, this was a good lesson in getting what you pay for. Now let's see if they really do the promised refund.
Pop`

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I'm not surprised at what you found. It would appear that V12 is a dog. So was 10. 11 though, is a good one. Deluxe version 11 is available in many places for less than $50.00. V7 was quite good though they have come out with new features since then that I wouldn't want to do without. Turbocad has been sold to a company that seems to be looking at selling cad software rather than anything that will sell. Might well pick up and be what it should be.

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