OT: painting


Greetings all,
In addition to building the furniture for my new house, I've been doing a lot of assorted remodeling, and I've recently rediscovered my hatred of painter's tape. Last weekend I painted my bathroom in a sort of Mondriaan style to keep myself busy (blocks of primary colors divided by bold black lines set onto a white background) It turned out pretty good, but I had a problem with some of the paint coming right up with the tape along the edges when I pulled it off. I can (and already have) touch it up by hand, but this is an irritating problem I've had both with my current projects, and back when I was doing remodeling for a living.
This is no doubt going to come up again for me, so I was just wondering if anyone here has come up with a good way to make sure that the tape comes off a freshly painted wall cleanly. I was thinking that I *could* score along the edge of the tape with a utility knife before pulling it off, but one slip, and it's going to look like crap. I saw one of those home-destruction shows on TLC a while back where they were using painter's caulk on the tape somehow to make clean lines on a wall, but I wasn't really paying attention at the time and don't care to have to sand and reprime a wall at some future point because I thought I *maybe* remembered how to do it.
Other useful information here is that I always either skim-coat and prime walls before painting, or wash with TSP to degloss existing paint that is in good condition. I pretty much always use water-based semi-gloss or satin, and it seems like the semi-gloss gives me more trouble than the satin. (I can't seem to get flat paint to *work* at all- it takes 6 or 7 coats and still looks blotchy)
Any thoughts?
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Using the low-tack blue stuff? Seems to work best for me.
Satin or semi shows every plaster fault with glancing light, in my experience. Washability does not seem the problem it once was, and that's what they were touted for.
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On Tue, 03 May 2005 06:34:28 -0500, the inscrutable Prometheus

See a shrink. Really. ;)

If the peeling paint is UNDER the tape, are you letting the paint dry thoroughly before trying to mask for a second or subsequent color? Give it 72 hours, at least, if not. If the peeling paint is NEXT TO the tape, are you pulling the tape fast enough, before it dries enough to form a tough film? I always pull fresh masking off at a 45-90ฐ angle away from the line it was laid, especially if it's had a bit too long to dry. The quicker you pull it, the better it levels at the edge to form a cleaner transition.

I've always had best luck with satins and eggshells. Cleaning and deglossing semi- or gloss is absolutely critical. DAMHIKT. <sigh>
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On Tue, 03 May 2005 06:55:08 -0700, Larry Jaques

I like it! What are they going to tell me- my house is too colorful? As it stands, the kitchen is mandarin orange with white appliances and counters, the dining room is newport blue (blue-grey) with cobalt blue lighting and oak dining set, the living room is burgundy with bamboo shades and black curtains (they're only 10" wide though- accents to make the windows match the ebonized ash and natural maple furniture) and the bedroom is spinner blue (think navy or midnight blue) with butternut furnishings and white Sumi-e panels. The rest of the rooms are still in process. And I still haven't gotten around to making the shop safety yellow :)
Though it was interesting that when I searched for examples of Mondriaan used in archetecture, the only thing I found was a reference to a prison cell in Attica designed by him that was considered unusable because it caused hallucinations in the guards and inmates. But then I realized that I don't spend that much time in the bathroom, so I'm sure it'll be ok. :)

The peeling paint is at the edge of the tape, not underneith it. It's forming a film. I tried pulling at an angle, but it still likes to pull up the edges a bit. Maybe I just need to do all the cut-in coats before getting the walls themselves, and pull up the tape right away. I was pulling it kind of slow, though- so I'll try giving it a little gas next time.

Yep... I've got that same DAMHIKT in my file, too.
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<snip>

<snip>
Hi Prometheus,
I have always had pretty good results by pulling the tape within 5-10 minutes of application - while it is still wet. I pull the tape at an angle back over itself, i.e. by pulling it in the reverse direction and order of how I applied it.
I have not done any kind of checkerboard paint over paint scheme tho. My experience is mainly trim type painting.
Lou
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loutent wrote:

Same here, the sooner I pull the tape the better even though I end up with wet paint on my hands, this seems to work best. I think he is saying he has to apply more than one coat which means the first coat has to dry so he is stuck.
Maybe a thicker coat of paint with a different roller (or thicker paint?) would give coverage so the tape could be pulled wet after one coat?
If I were going to do this kind of block-color painting on a wall, I'd use the 2 ounce bottles of Delta or like "craft" acrylic. They go on with a 3" roller, dry in minutes, and give good coverage in 1-3 coats. Add the black lines a few days later, use lots of tape!
Josie
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On Thu, 5 May 2005 09:29:17 -0400, "firstjois"

I thought about that, but I was afraid that the acrylics wouldn't hold up in a bathroom, where there is so much moisture from the shower. As far as the black lines went, I just used the tape for layout, then traced either side of the tape with a pencil, and painted them freehand. It was fussy work, and took a while, but I was nervous about using the tape after the sides of the blocks peeled up the way they did.
I think I might try out the acrylics in the kitchen, though... I was thinking of trying my hand at freehanding one of Gockel's paintings on one wall, just to see if I can pull it off.
Something like this would be slick... http://www.globalgallery.com/enlarge/001-12031 / :)
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Prometheus wrote:

The acrylics should hold up to bathroom moisture.

Hey, you go, guy!
Josie
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On Wed, 04 May 2005 06:42:05 -0500, the inscrutable Prometheus

<g>
Make sure it has flashing red lights, too. That way it's prepared for any epileptics who wander in from time to time.

Do it in one coat and immediately pull the adjacent tape, before it has time to dry. Alternatively/additionally, some Floetrol might help. I haven't used it yet, but the specs look interesting.

I repainted the inside of my house a couple years back and still haven't gotten around to scrubbing and repainting the trim work.
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On Wed, 04 May 2005 06:40:29 -0700, Larry Jaques

Good idea.... I wonder if I can find some red flashers for those two-wire supsended track light systems.... :)

The problem with that is that when you're painting with reds or darker blues, they always seem to need at least three coats or they look crappy. Could be I just need to learn the same lesson I needed about woodworking, and be patient enough to peel the tape right away, wait a day, and then remask and do the second coat.

TSP makes pretty quick work of it, FWIW.
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darker
a
What I do is double tape the first time. Paint first coat, peel, paint second coat, peel. Like falling off a log.
-Phil Crow
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On 8 May 2005 06:17:05 -0700, snipped-for-privacy@yahoo.com wrote:

That's not a bad idea at all- thanks, I'll give that a try next time.
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If the paint comes off with the tape, try removing the tape before the paint dries. Also, use the Blue masking tape.

Assuming you are talking about walls and not trim, use a better brand paint. I repainted my whole house summer before last and found a big black spot on the wall under my sons desk. He put his feet on the wall and the black from the soles rubbed off on the wall. I could not believe how dirty it was. Any way, Sears "Best" Easy Living Flat Latex wall paint absolutely covered the spot with one coat. But the best paint and you will be much happier with the results.
For trim I always recommend an Alkyd Oil Based Enamel. Sherwin Williams, they make Sears paint, makes a top of the line trim paint. 1 gallon did all the trim and doors in my house with 1 coat. Again, I bought the best.
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I'll admit, I did cheat myself a little and got cheap stuff this time. I did the job a couple of weeks before I had planned to because I needed to keep myself occupied, and the budget wasn't quite what it should have been. *sigh* As far as trim goes, it is a mortal sin to paint trim in my house... I've got the original hard maple trim and doors in spotless condition right now, and they're going to stay that way! You can always repaint a wall, but stripping and restaining is a whole different story.
Sherwin Williams has got my buck for the exterior once things warm up a little, though. They do make good paint!
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3M makes the traditional beige tape, blue tape,and green tape.
The green is made for what your are trying. Latex takes days to dry and weeks to cure. Oil actually cures quicker. You may not be letting the first color set up and cure well enough.
(top posted for your convenience) ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ Keep the whole world singing . . . . DanG (remove the sevens) snipped-for-privacy@7cox.net

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The green tape, eh? I actually haven't seen that, but I'm going to check when I go to get the exterior paint- thanks for the tip. Aut inveniam viam aut faciam
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On Sun, 08 May 2005 06:44:29 -0500, the inscrutable Prometheus

I've had better luck with the 1.5" Frost King masking tape lately. It's much smoother and less sticky than standard masking tape, and is thinner and has a smooth adhesive which gives smoother edging. It's more like a painter's tape than 3M's blue at less than half the price. Check it out at Dollar Tree stores, etc.
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My understanding the green tape is designed for lacquer. Don't know if waterborne or solvent.
On Sun, 08 May 2005 06:44:29 -0500, Prometheus

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I bought mine at the auto body & paint supplier locally. Those folks are a really good info resource, as well as the best place to get really fine abrasives.
It seems to give a crisper edge.
Patriarch
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