OT: Motorheads. (Leon?)

Not once it's running, vs. magnetos and plugs on the gas engine.

Gasoline powered piston aircraft typically have multiple electric systems.

The "airframe" electrical system (possibly one of several) includes alternators or generators, batteries, electric items like radios, lights, ice protection, and electric fuel boost pumps, and the engine starter. This can all be shut off with a master switch independent of propulsion. If you turn the key to start the engine with the master off, the starter won't crank, but you'll look like an idiot.

The "propulsion" electrical system includes the mags and plugs. You can actually shut off the master electrics off in flight with no effect on a manually controlled engine. It'll keep cranking along, and you can still operate the throttle(s) mixture, and carb heat controls. There are usually two magnetos powering one plug in each cylinder for two plugs per. This is actually for performance reasons, not reliability. Running the engine on one of the two magnetos will result in ~75-125 RPM drop. This doesn't sound significant to car guys, but it can make a difference during level flight near max gross weight and a big one during climb.

I'd put glow plugs and starters on a diesel into the "airframe" category, because it's no longer needed once the engine starts. The diesel powered craft that Frank mentioned in regards to a crash had FADEC, Full Authority Digital Engine Control, which allows a computer to maintain mixture and other engine settings (kinda' like a modern car), and facilitates throttle control with an autopilot. When FADEC fails hard, so often does the propulsion, but this isn't a diesel only issue, as it can happen with gasoline pistons or turbines that employ it.

In reliability speak, failing to start is very minor compared to failing in flight, as it's easier to "not fly" if you're already on the ground. The guys in the crash jump started a dead twin-engine airplane only to have the airframe electrics quit in flight, taking the digitally controlled engines out as well.

Reply to
B A R R Y
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Actually, there tough on that here, as well! My BIL owns a farm and my buddy is a heating oil dealer. Both get sticked on a regular basis. In the case of the fuel oil guy, he's had DMV people stop his trucks, and they've visited his truck yard in person. The farmer has been sticked at agricultural auctions and fairs, but never on the road or at the farm.

Our DMV has also been known to stop trailered construction equipment to stick the tow vehicle.

Bio-diesel has no dye, so... But the car does smell like fries!

Reply to
B A R R Y

Actually there are several ways to start a diesel, including wind up spring and pneumatic, especially larger diesels such as those found on ore boats in the Great Lakes and sea going ships which usually use pneumatic.

Once you get a diesel running, there are only two (2) ways to stop it.

You either cut off the fuel supply or the air supply or both.

Don't do it right and that puppy can consume it's own lube oil which usually yields very expensive results.

Lew

Reply to
Lew Hodgett

Easily offset by adding a little oil of primrose or raspberry nectar. Salt and vinegar are optional.

Somehow, I can't get my head around feeding a 50,000 dollar Benz vegetable oil. Next thing we know, PETA is wanting to replace the seats with wicker. It is smart to mind the environment, but I like twin turbos and Sunoco 94 with octane booster. IOW.. stay the hell out of my car. I still think diesels are cool. I'd like a diesel Harley. WTF not? They're having some serious image problems already.

Reply to
Robatoy

Sun, May 20, 2007, 10:34pm (EDT+4) snipped-for-privacy@yahoo.com (B=A0A=A0R=A0R=A0Y) doth sayeth: Not once it's running, vs. magnetos and plugs on the gas engine.

I wasn't counting "after" it was runnng, but to "get" it runing. You normally need electric to get those plugs glowing, and an electric starter to turn the thing over.

JOAT What is life without challenge and a constant stream of new humiliations?

- Peter Egan

Reply to
J T

Sun, May 20, 2007, 10:45pm (EDT+4) snipped-for-privacy@earthlink.net (Lew=A0Hodgett) doth sayeth: Actually there are several ways to start a diesel,

Well, actually, I knew there "were" other ways, just not sure what. Which was why I weasld and said "pretty much of a given", instead of saying "a given". Hehehe Pneumatic I did know. But to nit pick I know that at least one of those "other" systems call for electric.

JOAT What is life without challenge and a constant stream of new humiliations?

- Peter Egan

Reply to
J T

Pretty common in rural parts of the UK or Ireland. They catch a fair few too. Remember that we pay nearly $2 / litre for road fuel.

About 10 years ago they stopped selling red petrol, supposedly because of lack of demand, but actually because of pressure to avoid this tax dodging.

Reply to
Andy Dingley

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