stoutman responds:
Uh, yeah, but I tend to read and respond to these things in order, not ass-end first.
Charlie Self "If you want to know what God thinks of money, just look at the people he gave it to. " Dorothy Parker
Apparently I am not the only one who has thought about the one sided ban of ephedra and not tobacco.
Do a google search using keywords: Tobacco and Ephedra.
here are a couple I found. Some people explain this ridiculous situation better than I do.
goto: Here is an FDA link. Read the whole thing:
Here is another good link:
Me too. New from RJR, Camel Complete, with all the vitamins, tar, and nicotine a growing boy needs from A to Z.
A lot of the dangers are in the method of delivery, not necessarily the plant itself. Try sticking a cactus in your rectum...I'll bet that would make a cactus more dangerous than tobacco. :)
(snip) A lot of the dangers are in the method of delivery, not necessarily the plant itself.
Sure dangers be exacerbated by changing the route of administration. If you are implying that Tobacco is only dangerous when smoked you are mistaken. Tobacco dip causes moth cancer. Tobacco snuff throat cancer. How else is tobacco administered? Is there a route of administration for tobacco that I am unaware of that doesn't cause cancer?
They are banning ephedra and not giving us the choice of route of administration. They are simply telling us "this stuff is bad for you, it kills people, you can no longer use it". If they can do that for ephedra (another plant, just like tobacco) why can't they do that for tobacco?
It's one sided.
Your NOT thinking David.
.. snip
... snip
... and you don't see *that* as chipping away at freedom? What would occur in that 2 years? Seems like a perfect opportunity to instill a little "discipline" and acceptance of government control of one's personal life.
Better for 3) would be to re-institute the study of civics as a required course in all high schools where: a) All students were fully educated on the formulation of the US government as a republic and what that means in a practical sense in terms of limiting the strength of the federal government, b) That the constitution was intended to be a document limiting the powers and scope of the federal government, not a document to describe its powers, and, most importantly: c) Exactly how our government is structured, with three branches of government and the prescribed scope of each branch. Surveys of high school and college students with questions regarding this topic show them to be woefully ignorant of how our government is supposed to work and the very basic details of its structure. That this is such a widespread phenomena indicates it isn't that these kids are stupid, they are just not being taught something that is a fundamental part of why they have the freedom they do.
Mark & Juanita responds:
I don't think so. It may be that a working lifetime (23 years now) in the military gets someone to accept doctrine without question, though I'm inclined to doubt even that. Most lifers I've known are ultimate cynics. But AFAICT, almost all short-termers in the military reject most of the acceptance of control, while maintaining a reasonably strong self discipline, after a couple years on the outside." Some don't take that long. I do think doctrinaire thinking is more prevalent in the officer corps of the various services than in the enlisted ranks, but even that is a long, long ways from 100%.
But I can't argue at all with your idea that a good civics course with an accurate presentation of the Constitution and the rationales used in forming our government is sorely needed. Whether or not it will do any good, it should be tried.
Charlie Self "If you want to know what God thinks of money, just look at the people he gave it to. " Dorothy Parker
On Wed, 31 Dec 2003 14:31:23 GMT, "stoutman" Crawled out of the shop and said. . .: snip
snip
CNN? no thanks...dont like my news spoon fed to me
hehe
on the other note, seems when i have time i'll need to do a bit more reading on this subject..
You might want to consider it since you think pseudoephedrine is fake ephedrine. he he.
Haven't you been reading the news in the last few years? EVERYTHING causes cancer. Soon the government is going to ban food and sunlight...we better stop them NOW with this Ephedra thing if we ever want to eat or get a tan again. Then what...WOOD...*gulp*...that's when I cross over to the Dark Side.
Others have answered this for you. Big business and money ensures tobacco's survival.
Nor is David jumping on the fanatical bandwagon.
David P states:
Check it out. The ONLY cause of death is conception. What is the government doing to help prevent that?
Charlie Self "If you want to know what God thinks of money, just look at the people he gave it to. " Dorothy Parker
(snip)
Ok dave, you can pull that cactus out of your rectum now. I thought we were having a discussion?
(snip)
I read what others have posted, I agree it has to do with money. You were trying to explain it by discussing "methods of delivery" ?? Remember what you wrote? (method of delivery, not necessarily the plant itself). Do you really believe that? Hold on, I know what your answer is gonna be judging from your unintelligible responses such as:"Go roll up some Ephedra in a papers, smoke 10 or more of them a day," or my favorite: "Try sticking a cactus in your rectum"
You also said I wasn't making a "proper comparison". I and others say YOUR WRONG. Its an excellent comparison. Read what others have said:
Relax, stoutman. Just because someone is not convinced by your ravings to join in your beliefs is no reason to get upset. I'm glad you liked my responses and hopefully you found a little humor in them as well. Flattery will get you everywhere, my dear. Cheers!
I need to Relax?
I'm Fanatical?
I am all this because you don't understand and your confused.
Cheers right back at ya! :)
That's what's being substituted for civics courses, kids don't know what the Speaker of the House does, or what the Supreme Court does, but they can put a condom on a cucumber in 2 seconds flat.
Jeez, I hope that's as far as the hands on training goes!
Charlie Self "If you want to know what God thinks of money, just look at the people he gave it to. " Dorothy Parker
No and no.
Stop and think. The _least_ profit goes to the manufacturer. Distribution takes more than he, and those who tax it at all levels make the most money. That's the real profit, and what you preach is moonshine.
Which, by the way, produces more money per unit for the government than the "big companies," as does gasoline....
The current administration would never reinstate the draft for fear of getting beat about the head and shoulders of the opposition, and the opposition would never reinstate the draft as the 4 or 5 or 10 fold increase in personnel and the facilities and equipment required would consume way too much moolah that could be used for social programs.
-Doug
That has been my thought too. I suspect that the folks that are going to get 'brainwashed' into buying the party line would do so whether or not they HAD the military experience.
Hear, Hear! I agree completely that the schools probably SHOULD get back to a more basic focus on their job, and, that more Americans should be exposed to the principles that founded the country. And...spending a bit of time in the military might well help that. Regards Dave Mundt
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