O/T: Nuclear Reactor Problems

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"dpb" wrote:

-------------------------- Ancient history. --------------------------

------------------------------ More ancient history.
Even if Yucca had been allowed, it isn't big enough to handle all of today's spent fuel rods. -------------------------------------

-------------------------- Until the basic safety issues can be answered, NIMBY seems pretty reasonable.
Look at the poor bastards who have the fly ash pits in their back yards in TN and OK for starters.
Lew .
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On 3/29/2011 9:16 PM, Lew Hodgett wrote:

Not really, since it led to the current situation.

See above...

Not so sure about that; point was it was to be expanded; that it never happened but was the plan means we're where we are now which is current condition, not history...

Which basic safety issue is that, precisely?

Which has what, precisely, to do w/ spent nuclear fuel????
--
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"dpb" wrote:

------------------------- With what is going on right now in Japan, you have to ask?

------------------------ It is simply indicative of the total arrogance of the utility industry.
"Daddy knows what's best" seems to permeate the industry, even the one with this mess on their hands in Japan.
IMHO, based on 50+ years of on and off dealings with the utility industry, their approach seems to be the bottom line at any price.
At this point in my life, I take most statements made by the utility industry with a grain of salt.
Lew
Lew
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On 3/30/2011 12:41 AM, Lew Hodgett wrote:

I thought we were talking of long-term storage of spent fuel and the US impasse wrt to that issue. I was asking what technical/safety problems were extant at Yucca Mtn that were/are worse or even close to equal to those currently existant by leaving it in increasingly crowded spent fuel pools at the operating reactor sites.

Balderdash...
...
But you flip the light switch and expect nearly 100%-reliable power at rock-bottom rates, ...
--
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"dpb" wrote:

---------------------------- I also expect them to clean up their own mess in the process and not pass off their garbage for others to do the job.
After all, utilities are unique, they are guaranteed to make a profit as a part of their rate structure, it's not like they have to compete in the market place to make a profit.
Lew
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On 3/30/2011 7:42 PM, Lew Hodgett wrote:

Well, when their hands are tied by law, makes it tough...

That ain't necessarily so everywhere any more, either...
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I wrote:

--------------------------- "dpb" wrote:

---------------------------- Go back about 40 years when I was in Cleveland and Congressman Dennis Kucinich (D-OH), was the mayor of Cleveland.
The Cleveland Electric Illuminating company, lead by their legal council, Lee Howley, tried every trick in the book, legal and not so much, to put the Cleveland Municipal Lighting out of business since they competed with CEI.
Kucinich almost single handedly fought of CEI.
To the best of my knowledge is still in business as a distribution utility buying power from CEI and reselling it.
About the same time CEI wanted to run new 345KV distribution lines on federal park lands between Cleveland and Akron.
They went to court to gain access rights to the park land but lost.
Screw the courts, CEI ignored the courts and tried to start construction anyway, not once, but several times.
Took a federal judge to finally stop CEI.
There are other examples, but those above make the point.
Lew
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On 3/30/2011 1:41 AM, Lew Hodgett wrote:

As with most things nuclear, it is not the chemistry or physics that causes the problems, but the public, and their agents, the politicians. Much of the cost of building a nuclear plant is the paperwork that has to be completed.
We developed the initial purification process for nuclear fuel in about 4 years, (about 1941 to 1945) Where would we be today in handling nuclear fuel and spent fuel rods, if in the last 60 years, the industry had been allowed to do the research to solve the current problems, and not had to fight regulations designed to destroy the industry.
When introduced, some predicted that all new technology, would destroy the world. (Read your history, and the old newspapers.)
Millions of people get minor electric shocks every day, but we still use electricity in every part of our activities.
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I have to laugh at all you geniuses. You think man can handle every situation. Money, money money. I went to school for engineering. Aerospace major, nuclear minor. I found that the Aerospace guys were just as corrupt as others. While interning at an aerospace company I watched the numbers that came off our wind tunnel tests were manipulated to make sure funding continued.
I got so frustrated with the BS that I bailed on both. You guys that believe that Nuclear is a good choice are funny. The half life of these is almost 10 times longer than man has been on the earth for. Just think about that.
It could never happen here these idiots claim. But then something else happens and low and behold its just all BULL SHIT.
I don't trust big business, politicians, the NR,utilities... or CEO's
I tried buying a home near a reservoir in NJ... our well tests were off the charts with TCE... later it was found that a large company was dumping their used chemicals in the reservoir and in the mountains... Fortunately I did a well test first.
Yea I believe. I believe man can't be trusted, and is very short sighted.
On 3/30/2011 11:14 AM, k-nuttle wrote:

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On Wed, 30 Mar 2011 20:26:52 -0400, tiredofspam <nospam.nospam.com> wrote:

You excepted of course.

Couldn't take the pressure.

If you were such a genius, you'd know that the longer the half-life the *less* radioactive a material is.
<snipped more moronic, self-serving drivel>
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Nope, I was an idiot for originally believing that there were good people making good decisions.
On 3/30/2011 9:40 PM, snipped-for-privacy@att.bizzzzzzzzzzzz wrote:

So I vote to put this *LESS* radioactive spent rods in your home, its really safe... 8>)

Your right. I like when good companies dump HAZ waste in drinking supplies... It's good for us.
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On Wed, 30 Mar 2011 21:52:19 -0400, tiredofspam <nospam.nospam.com> wrote:

You really are a dumbass.

Yes, I am. You are moronic.
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You are the type of guy that after something does happen will be wondering why something wasn't done to prevent that type of failure. But it will be too late.
I believe in change for the good, but somethings the risks outweigh the benefits. If this were just your backyard I wouldn't care. But when this becomes my backyard well if it comes to that I want you to suffer you pecker head.
I suppose what happened in Russia and Japan can't happen here according to you. Or aren't that serious. When the shit hits the fan here, I hope it is in your backyard, and I hope you don't ruin mine.
On 3/30/2011 11:28 PM, snipped-for-privacy@att.bizzzzzzzzzzzz wrote:

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On Tuesday, March 29, 2011 10:41:54 PM UTC-7, Lew Hodgett wrote:

...
Well, yes, that is a natural consequence of electric utilities operating as regulated monopolies; they are required by law not to spend any 'extra' money and call it expenses, because their prices are set as cost-plus-a-few-percent.
In many areas, fly ash isn't 'dumped', but becomes a component of cement mix (where it doesn't hurt the final product, and is a benefit to the cement plant because they don't have to pay to get this part of their raw material shipped in). Cinderblock used to be a way to recycle clinker from ironworks...
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"whit3rd" wrote:

------------------------------------------ A rather small percentage of the total generated fly ash gets reused as a raw material for other products such as cement as you suggest; however, tremendous amounts are shipped to open pit storage facilities.
Since fly ash contains carcinogens known to cause cancer, disposing of it in such a careless manner (open pit) is not indicative of good corporate citizenship, IMHO.
Man has been mucking up the planet with his waste probably for as long as he has been standing upright.
The present energy industry is simply the latest form of it's manifestation.
Lew
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Looks like Germany is taking the lead.
http://tinyurl.com/3pcx2jh
Lew
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Yes, the lead in hysterical over-reaction. Well, sooner or later someone had to surpass California in that respect.
--
There is always an easy solution to every human problem -- neat,
plausible, and wrong." (H L Mencken)
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Larry W wrote:

So, what is Germany to use to power electrical generation plants?
I know! Oil and natural gas!
There goes the demand curve - and the price.
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And the Russkies operating many of the natural gas spigots. . . . ...or COAL! (The ads say it is nice and clean.)
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wrote:

Germany is actually pretty big on renewables. Often wind. It was stated that the "emergency" shutdown of some 7 big nuclear plants hadn't caused any problems with electricity supply, so they thought they could handle the mothballing of the remaining plants fairly easily.
Of course the customer will pay for any costs ...
--
Best regards
Han
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