New Grizzly G0444Z TS

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Hi all,
Just finished the assembly of my new table saw. I haven't even run it yet because I have to set up the 220V wiring, but I am fired up!!
During the assembly process, I was pleased with several things, and displeased with some others. Overall, I'm very happy...but then I haven't made a cut with it yet.
I'll post details if anyone is interested.
Tom
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Tom Do post your thoughts on the saw. I am very interested in getting one.

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Please do post your thoughts on it.
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I'm interested in hearing your impressions of the saw. It looks like a good one and had they been available when I ordered a few months ago, I may very well have gotten one. Looks like they made some great improvements from the 1022 series which was my first contractor saw and other then the shortcomings of the fence, it worked great. Sold it to a friend who built a house and two garages and it's still humming along.
Don

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On 1/9/04 23:28, in article snipped-for-privacy@comcast.com, "Tom"

PLEASE do post. I am sure that a lot of people are wondering about this saw. I know that I am. I was able to go to the Grizz store in Springfield in December, but the people working there hadn't even seen the saw (actually, I wasn't too impressed by the level of knowledge of the three different people that I spoke with about their equipment.) But I feel pretty good about getting one of these and their 6" jointer.
One of the guys I spoke with there about their jointers said that really all of their 6" jointers are the same except for cabinet and whether you want levers or hand wheels. He told be that other than those two things, all 1 hp jointers are the same. That being said, why spend $500, when the $325 on is the same, just not as "snazzy",
Dave
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I am new to this type of forum, but am a woodworking enthusiast. I have have had my new GO444Z for about a week now and I am totally thrilled. Have been a carpenter for 25 years and I have seen a lot of different TS's, but for the money this one is a hit. Everthing is heavy duty. The CI tables are flat and true and polished like a mirror.I even screwed up a little when I was cleaning off the gunk, by using a scour pad on a little spot.I do not have a dial indicator, but checking the runout and slot alignment the neaderthal way, every thing was right on out of the box.My biggest concern about buying this new model was the new ShopFox Alumaclassic fence. Grizzly called it "rock solid" in their ad, and I'm here to tell you that it is. Biesmeyer clone, and of very good quality.The only thing that was not of good quality was the guard over the belt, so I just took it off, not a big deal.The 2HP motor pulls 12 amps at 220V and didn't even think about slowing down ripping 2" oak.Overall I would buy this saw again in a minute. Hope this helps answer a few questions. I hope I am posting this right as I have never posted to a newsgroup before.
"Trust in the Lord"
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Tom, Thanks for your reply. I am looking forward to getting one soon. I have never had a tool that ran on 220 before. I have 3 questions to ask: What size breakers and wire do you use to the outlet, and how long is the saw cord? Is there a heavy extension cord I can buy for this saw?

yet
haven't
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<snip>
Hi Ace,
There are a number of people in the group who can anwer your questions better than me, but I'll tell you what I know.
I had a 220V outlet put in my garage when the house was built, and I didn't specify any details, but they used 40AMP breakers. I'm not sure what size wiring is in the wall, but the outlet is only a few feet from the breaker panel.
The cord on the saw is 12 AWG and it's about 11 feet long. The problem with extension cords is voltage drop, which is a function of the resistance of the wire (which for our purposes means the guage) and the length. Most readily available extension cords are NOT ADEQUATE. That's why everyone generally frowns on extension cords for this type of equiment. It's possible that an industrial supply shop would have a heavy duty extension chord, but I think they tend to avoid them because of possible mis-use and liability.
Now, a suitable extension chord could easily be MADE out of heavier guage wire. The longer the run, the heavier it must be. I will be addressing this issue because I got a mobile based for my saw specifically so I can wheel it onto the driveway and use "nature's dust collection" which is very effective here in breezy north Texas. My outlet is about 10' from the door so I'll need to add 10- 15 feet to the saw's existing 11' to get comfortably clear.
Hopefully some of the electricians in the goup will weigh in with some guidelines on wire guage, length and current capacity.
Tom
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The important thing to remember when wiring is the amp draw. A 20 amp double pole breaker wired with 12/3 w/ground, should be plenty. The saw comes with a 10' cord, but does not have a plug on the end of it. You should match that up with the receptacle that you use. If you are unsure which one, the saw's owner's manual spells out what to use. I would try to not use an extension cord as you will start to experience voltage drop which will not help your motor torque.If you do need to use an extension cord, keep it as short as possible and try to make it a 12 wire cord, as this will lessen your voltage drop. Hope this helps.

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I think the manual will tell you that a 30A breaker is recommended and that means 10ga wiring, but you can read it and make sure. If it is like my 1023, the cord is long enough to reach the floor and lie there for a couple of feet. I replaced it.
You can make an extension cord out of some heavy duty cord. I made mine from this: http://www.grainger.com/Grainger/productdetail.jsp?xi=xi&ItemId11767516 Stranded 10 gauge 3 conductor rubber coated cord.
A10ga cord has the same capacity as whatever wiring you have in the wall, so voltage drop shouldn't be a big deal unless the cord and the wiring together are really long.
-Jack

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Dennis,
I saw the aluma-classic in the catalog. Is it just the same as the traditional biesmeyer clone with aluminum faces instead of HDPE?
Montyhp

yet
haven't
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"Montyhp" <montyhp at yahoo.com> wrote in message

Yes Monty, typical Biesmeyer clone with aluminum faces. The nice thing is they can be removed to add different type of face. Also, the aluminum faces have T-slots for accessories, i.e. featherboards, etc. The rear of the fence rides on an angle via a pin with a nylon foot that is adjustable. I will probably remove this pin and add a piece of HDPE to bottom of fence so that I can add a folding outfeed table to the rear of the saw. Hopefully the fence will ride on the table ok.

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Dennis,
I'll post a picture of my outfeed table on ABPW.
Montyhp

it
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Okay, here's the rundown on this saw from my perspective. I'm not at all skilled with precision woodworking, but as an engineer I have a pretty good sense about how things should be built.
I had initially ordered the G0444 with 1/2 HP motor and stamped wings, which was on backorder and expected to ship early February. During the wait, I decided to cough up the extra $90 for the upgrade. The G0444Z has a 2HP motor and cast iron wings. I called Grizzly to change the order to the "Z", and lo and behold, they had one in stock. WOOHOO!! I had the boxes in my garage in less than 48 hours from that call! Amazing! I was prepared to go fetch the saw from the freight terminal because I live on a Cul de Sac and a semi couldn't turn around, but when I called the trucking company they volunteered to send it out on a bobtail with a tailgate lift. The driver was very nice and dollied everything into the garage for me. He says he delivers a lot of Grizzy gear to homes.
The saw went together pretty easily, and the instructions are very good, with one or two small exceptions. Anyone who has assembled any kind of equipment before will catch the errors, like where to put the lock washers etc. The finish and paint on the internal parts could be better. The edges of the casting still had burrs and sharp edges and the flat black paint was not evenly applied. The outside finish was much better, but there are some minor imperfections that you wouldn't notice unless you're really looking, and those will soon be covered with sawdust <G>.
My saw arrived with one of the strain relief grommets (where the wire feeds through the case) broken. A replacement is already on the way and it will be easy to install.
The top of the saw and wings fit together perfectly without any shiimming and the flatness seems perfect, but I did not use any sophisticated method to measure it. I laid a straight edge on it and didn't see any gaps. The finish of the top is excellent, but the wings are a mess. On one, it seems that the "earwax" somehow stained the metal and no amount of scrubbing will clean it up. Both wings have a bunch of overspray on the work surface from when the edges were painted. I'm going to ask Grizzly what I should use to remove that so if it messes up the surface, they'll be responsible.
Measuring with a machinists ruler with 1/64" gradations, the blade was perfectly parallel out of the box. I am really tickled about this because I have never adjusted a table saw and was not looking forward to it.
The fence is worlds better than those on the $600 Deltas and Ridgids that I looked at at HD & Lowe's. I was amazed that it could be so simple to install, and be so precise. It was dead on out of the box,with the 1/64" "heel" that the instructions recommended. It's a front clamping fence which will go off alignment as you slide it along the rail, but this can be avoided if you apply a small amount of pressure towards the operator as you move it. The motion is silky smooth and it clamps consistently right on the money. It has longitudinal slots down both sides for attaching featherboards or sacrificail material. The finish is perfect as well. There's no micro adjust, however.
There's some slop in the way the handwheels attach to the shafts. There's a slot in the handwheel that fits over a roll pin which protrudes from both sides of the shaft, and the slot in the handwheel is too big. This won't affect the accuracy of the saw, it just "feels" a little imprecise when you reverse directions. This could probably be fixed with some ingenuity.
My biggest concern is the motion of the carriage when raising and lowering the blade. As it comes up, the carriage rocks forward and backward slightly. Once set, it seems rock solid. I've grabbed onto the carriage from underneath and given it a good shake and can't discern any slop. This may be a characteristic of the mechanism, but it seems strange. If there's slop, I'm sure it will show up when I start cutting, and I'm sure that would be BAD.
The Mitre guage is a piece of crap. I may be able to tweak it to make it usable, but in it's current state it will gouge the table if I use it.
I don't think it's clear from the catalog, but the motor CAN be wired for 110V according to the instructions, but it draws 25A. It comes pre-wired for 220V, but does not come with a plug. You'll have to install the type that you need.
Overall, I thinks it's an excellent machine, and the fit of the parts indicates good engineering. It's made of economical, but solid and quality materials. It's interesting to note that the hardware kit includes the exact number of parts required for the assembly. Most manufacturers would include extra nuts, bolts, washers etc. as a low cost way to avoid customer service calls. This indicates that the factory has good process and quality control, which reflects well on the entire product.
For those of you who are still reading, I have a couple of questions:
1. Is the straightedge measurement for flatness adequate, or should I do something different before "accepting" the saw? 2. Any comments about the odd motion of the carriage as the blade is being raised? 3. The manual suggested a citrus based solvent to remove the earwax, so I used Goo-Gone. Any suggestion on how to get rid of that "stain" on the wing?
So, I'm off to get the plug so I can fire this baby up!
Tom
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<snip to avoid reapeating my own drivel>
Regarding my long post about this saw, there was INDEED a large amount of slop in the mechanism that turns the worm gear which raises the blade. By grabbing the arbor (blade is off now) I could move it at least 1/8 inch along its travel. Correct me if I'm wrong, but this is BAD, right? The slop was in the end of the shaft away from the worm gear, and the gears were definitely NOT moving relative to each other. However...
I followed the instructions to adjust the play in the worm, AND added a washer to the other end of the shaft near the hand wheel and the slack is gone. The washer was one of those scary left over parts that was clearly not addressed in the manual, but its' the same style (fiber) that is similarly applied on the blade angle shaft, which is perfect right from the factory. The slop is gone and the raising action and travel is silky smooth now.
Now I am truly happy without reservations! I'll be making sawdust this evening!
Tom
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I needed to do the same with my G1022 when I had it - as soon as it was done, it worked perfectly as long as I owned it.
Don

slop
not
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[...snip...]

Do you have a precise straightedge? If so, and you put a light on the other side and can't see any light peeking through, then it is flat enough. Most cheapo straightedges probably aren't precise enough to give you the real scoop.
Even if you can see light peeking through, you can check the gap with a feeler gauge. As for what is acceptable, I have never heard of a definitive spec, and each manufacturer probably has their own tolerance.

One thing a lot of people do to clean rust off, is to stick a scotchbrite type pad to their random orbital sander, spray WD-40 on the table, and have at it.
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<snip>
The straightedge I used is a Johnson metal yardstick. It might not be the best reference for this type of measurement. Any suggestions on a good straightedge that won't cost a fortune? Boy, my "newbie-ness" is really showing now...
Thanks, Tom
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Tom. How is the dust port on the 444z working for you. Does your dust collector or shop vac get it all or is there still some left to clean up?

do
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<snip>
Well, darn it, I just don't know yet. As mentioned in my earlier post, I had a 220V outlet installed in the garage when the house was built about a year ago. After returning from the hardware store yesterday afternoon with a 220V plug and stars in my eyes, I promptly discovered that I had positioned a large set of industrial shelves just perfectly to block the outlet. Between work today and evening obligations, I won't get to unload the shelves and move them until tomorrow. D'OH!!!!
I have my doubts about that dust port because the entire back of the saw is wide open, so we're relying on gravity rather than suction to get the dust down to the intake of the port. It still might be enough though because the air will be moving into the port. I'll be using a shop vac. I'll let you know when I finally get to make some cuts (growl).
A question for everyone: Is there any problem with making a panel that closes up the back of a contractor saw? Even with the leakage required by leaving clearances for the belt and motor support movement, you'd get a good negative pressure around the blade and through any gaps.
Tom
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