New Band Saw Questions

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Good point: as this discussion is unfoldng, I'd like to mention that among other saws I use daily, there are two Tannewicz with 40" wheels and we never use anything bigger than 5/8" blades, carbides or not, and they are fine for re-sawing as long as the guide bearing is close to the work, blade is sharp and un-kinked, and you don't turn it too hard.
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SNIP > the manufacturers know > more about building band saws than Duginske. skip his BS about >coplaner "corrections". > > Dave
BTW, the manual that came with my Griz bandsaw has a section on setup and tuning *before using the bandsaw* and states that after checking the wheels for coplanar the top wheel should be shimmed to make the wheels coplanar. So I guess you're right, the manufacturers know more - but I suspect they don't always tell...
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Sailaway wrote:

Correct, they don't. The Jet only spoke of checking that the motor is coplaner with the pully, not the blade wheels. I don't see a way of adjusting it, and what really confused me now is a previous post regarding the same model saw that arrived coplaner.
Harvey
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Sailaway wrote:
> SNIP > > the manufacturers know > > more about building band saws than Duginske. skip his BS about >coplaner "corrections". > > > > Dave
> BTW, the manual that came with my Griz bandsaw has a section on setup >and tuning *before using the bandsaw* and states that after checking >the wheels for coplanar the top wheel should be shimmed to make the >wheels coplanar. So I guess you're right, the manufacturers know more - >but I suspect they don't always tell...
eclipsme wrote: >Correct, they don't. The Jet only spoke of checking that the motor is >coplaner with the pully, not the blade wheels. I don't see a way of >adjusting it, and what really confused me now is a previous post >regarding the same model saw that arrived coplaner. > >Harvey
One other thing the manufacturers don't tell you is weather or not your chiwanese bandsaw has a thrust spacer between bearings inside the upper wheel (the one you shim). Depending on the way your upper wheel is mounted, if you shim the wheel and you do not have this spacer, you may place undue side-load on the bearings and damage your saw during use. The Grizzly BS (which does not have this thrust sleeve) mounts the wheel on a shouldered bolt, and the mounting nut tightens up on the shoulder rather than on the inside race of the bearing. If you have this type and you shim behind the wheel to bring the wheel out (as was in my case), the bearings will now be pressed tightly against the nut creating side-load on the bearings - then you must have this sleeve in between the bearings to take the load. So I had to pull the bearings and make a sleeve. Doing these easy, relatively minor adjustments has made this into a well behaved saw. YMMV
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"eclipsme" wrote in message

IIRC, the Ittura catalog (most likely Louis, himself) mentions that Jet engineers claim their 14" band saw wheels are designed to NOT be co-planar.
Now, he seems to think that is BS and his argument makes sense, but he also states that if you are going to attempt to shim a Jet co-planar (and he recommends doing it), you need to shim the bottom wheel outward to match the top wheel, unlike with the Delta, where the top wheel is easier to shim.
Point is that anyone who owns a Jet/Delta/Grizzly 14" should definitely call Iturra and have them mail you a copy of their informative "catalog".
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I got obsessed with adjustments when I got my RAS... spent WAY too much time tuning and tweaking...
I realized that when I cut something on my brother's RAS, an old craftsman that I'd envied for years... it was so "untuned" and "untweaked" that it shouldn't of cut paper.. but it still cuts things square and works... it just LOOKS weird.. (I think that his table is way off, but his fence and blade seem square to the table so it works)
With my BS, I took it out of the box, followed the instructions for assembly and setup, and started sawing... if cuts straight and seems to work, so I don't mess with it...
Mac
https://home.comcast.net/~mac.davis https://home.comcast.net/~mac.davis/wood_stuff.htm
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eclipsme wrote:
>> I just got a new Jet 14" closed base band saw. As I was putting it >>together, I was impressed with the fit and finish of the pieces, esp. >>after reading some of the comments others have made concerning their >>new saws, particularly the Delta band saws. >> >> Once I got it all together, I put a straightedge on the 2 wheels that >>the blade goes around, and found that they were approximately 1/4" out >>of coplaner. This results in the blade being a bit beyond centered on >>the upper wheel and a bit before centered on the lower wheel. >> >> The saw seems to cut ok, without excessive noise or vibration - at >>least I think so. I have never owned a band saw before. Is this a >>problem? Do I need to call the dealer on Monday? >> >> Thanks, >> Harvey
>Leave it alone. I've been there, and made the mistake of "correcting" >a BS to coplaner. I had to undo the "correction". the manufacturers >know more about building band saws than Duginske. skip his BS about >coplaner "corrections". > >Dave
The problem as I see it with the majority of these responses is that the experience of each of the responders on this and similar threads is on one type/size/brand of bandsaw, and so their experience (adjust / not adjust) reflects what worked well just for that saw and that operator.
But not all saws and not all operators are made alike...
I shimmed the top wheel on my Griz G0555 about .115" out to make them coplanar and the resaw tracking became perfect. Prior to that the blade was tracking perfectly centered on the wheels, but the saw needed constant tweaking and I had to follow the *drift* to get straight cuts. One of the effects of getting the wheels coplanar and tracked correctly is (again, for some saws) straight, accurate, easy resawing with the wood against the fence, without having to tweak to find or follow the blade "drift". Just throw the wood on the saw and go.
Of course good blades, and good quality, well-adjusted guides are indispensable and that is where IMO Grizzly falls down. The roller guides that come with this saw require way too much time and effort to properly adjust, and also can't be used with small blades. Replaced them - what a difference. Then again, this is all just *my* experience!
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My new Delta is perfect. Too bad for you...
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Toller wrote:

Sometimes it is difficult to restrain oneself from responding to posts with new posts that add nothing to the general discussion.
I guess we both failed here.
Harvey
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No, just you. He said he was impressed with the Jet, since it was so much better than the Deltas; yet he had a problem. I was just pointing out that I avoided his problem by buying a Delta that was just fine.
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No one that ever bought a Delta has had a problem? I didn't know that. Conversely, does everyone that buys a Jet have a problem? I didn't.
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Toller wrote:

I'm sorry. the 'He' that you refer to is me, and I did not say how much better my Jet was than delta, but rather that I was aware of problems reported with other saws, particularly Delta, and was glad that I was finding good fit and finish with the Jet.
You were not "just pointing out" that you avoided this problem by buying a Delta, which would have been fine, but you said "Too bad for you...", which was both insensitive and useless in terms of information conveyed, or rather the lack of information conveyed. You were apparently just stroking your ego at my expense. I don't appreciate that.
Well, I don't normally take the bait, but this time I did. Oh well. You may now have the last word, as I am done with this discussion.
Once again, I thank everyone else for your constructive comments and suggestions.
Harvey
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No, you do not need to call anybody. That is precisely why there are so many adjustments on the saw. Remember that the blade runs on the tires (not the wheels themselves) and they may be very slightly cone-shaped one way or another, just like the tires on a car. Let the tires wear in for a while and keep it i tune and it should be fine.
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Umm, the tires are supposed to be oval and higher in the middle. This high spot is what helps to keep the blade on the wheel. The thinner blades naturally track towards the high spot. Saws that predominately use wider blades tend to work better with tires with less of a high spot but for thinner blades the high spot is what you want. A tire that is "cone-shaped" one way or another??? If there is a low spot, cone shaped in another way,,,,,,, the tire is probably shot.
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The guy said the thing ran well otherwise except it didn't tram out, so let it go until it throws something, if ever. I never saw so many people worrying so much about so little . . ..
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I'd also like to mention that I and 5 score people use a roomful of WW2 era equipment for 20 hrs a day, for decades now, and never seen a tyre replaced on any of them yet.
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So you have seen these saws with a reverse crown on the tires?
I agree most tires last for a very long time but a new one may have a problem. But if the saw works, like you said, enjoy the saw. A few weeks ago another poster was talking about his Ridgid BS loosing a tire and it was basically brand new IIRC. I returned an 18" Rikon and it had a tracking problem with either the tires that seemed to be uneven or with the 4 new Timberwolf blades. Oddly 2 different brand cheap-o blades tracked fine. The 4 different sized Timberwolf blades would not track correctly. Hopefully I will receive a new Laguna tomorrow. I bit the bullet wanting to spend more time with cutting wood than with readjusting and tweaking all the time to get the blade to not move forward and backward "all" of the time.
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Also, remember that the blade may be cone-shaped. I weld my own to length from bulk reel stock and am always able to adjust the wheels, guides and bearings to suit. Don't worry so much, just mount the thing and get to work.
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I have the Jet JWBS-14OS which is the bottom 14" saw in the line up. I had never thought about checking for this alignment. I eyeballed the blade tracking to run in the middle of the top wheel when I assembled the saw and called it good. I just went to the shop and threw a straight edge on the wheels and they are aligned very well, I could not see any gaps with the straight edge touching the top of the top wheel and the bottom of the bottom wheel. I realize that my saw is not exactly like yours, but based off of what I just looked at if your wheels really are 1/4" off coplanar I would think there is a problem with the saw. I know that others have expressed differing opinions and I am not an "expert". But I just don't see how it could be off 1/4" if it is assembled correctly. If you bought the saw locally go and measure the floor model and see if it is like the one you have. Did you have to fully assemble your saw ?? Mine came with the cast iron frame / wheels / blade assembled as a unit so there was no opportunity for me to miss something that could cause a coplanar alignment issue.
Charlie

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Hello Charlie,
Mine is the JWBS-14CS. Seems to be the same saw with a different base. As you don't see how it could be off 1/4", I don't see how this could possibly be adjusted. Most of the saw was preassembled. I had to mount it to the base, but the wheels, frame, etc were factory assembled, just like yours.
I don't know if this is really a problem either, but certainly appreciate hearing that yours is coplaner. I bought mine at Woodcraft, by mail order. I suppose I will give them a call.
Thanks, Harvey
Charlie H. wrote:

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