more compressor questions


My monster compressor arrived yesterday. I admit that I haven't totally read the manual yet.
I need a globe valve, dryer, filter, and pressure regulator. Can anyone suggest an all-in-one unit?
I'm a bit concerned with getting the right fittings. The threading in the air outlet looks a little more coarse than what I remember about the threading on regular black pipe.
The manual also shows a short section of flex hose between the compressor and the rest of the air distribution system. Is this sort of thing at home depot? I don't remember seeing it. Maybe you have to make this from compression fittings and a section of hose? What should I be looking for?
Also, it's a 6 horse motor. Is a 20 amp 220 line with 12 gauge wire enough? I'm getting the feeling that I need to go to 30 amp and fatter wire.
brian
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Never mind this one. I looked again, the manual says 30 amps. So #10 it is.
brian
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wrote:

I can't imagine it would be anything other than 1/4" NPT unless it was 3/8" NPT. Gotta be one or the other.

I'm not sure if I remember correctly what they call that--a whip? I don't think it's going to be found at the borg. Didn't you say you lived near Da City? Go out to Berlands and see if they have anything. See if there's anything in wolley segap (anyone remember those ads?) about compressor or air supply stores and check one of them. Is J.C. Whitney still on South State? Might check there, too.

Don't get too excited about that 6HP unless you bought an Ingersoll-Rand. Look at the motor label and see what FLA is. If it's greater than 20A (@240V), then you might need the 30A line. But I doubt it will. As long as it doesn't, your 20A line will be fine.
--
LRod

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I get my hydraulic hoses at a local auto parts store; they might have air hoses too. Welding supply stores might know where to get gas hoses, same place would have air rated hoses too.
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wow, guess we found a big hole in my tool knowledge. what is this? does it describe the thread pitch or something? Is it the same threading that the borg will put on black pipe for you, like for pipe clamps?

It's porter cable which is certainly made by someone else. I heard that devilbiss made their compressors for them. I'd be surprised if it wasn't chinese.
I've seen 6hp "running" and 7.5hp "peek" whatever that means. I found the manual online after I posted. It says 30 amps though so the 6hp number is probably close to reality.
brian
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wrote:

National Pipe Thread.
It's a standard thread (tapered), obviously for pipe. Standard, like SAE or NF (National Fine) and NC (National Coarse) are standard threads.
Yes, if you ask the borg to thread pipe, it will be threaded NPT.
--
LRod

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Thanks. It was a lot clearer when I was looking at all the accessories at the borg.
brian
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You just build this stuff up. You wouldn't want an all in one. Your drains should go at the tank, and at the remote connection points. Your dryer should go at the connection points. Your regulator can go anyplace that's convenient. Do a little internet research and you'll find a ton of drawings showing different layouts for air lines and all of the associated parts. Your owner's manual may even have some drawings in it. It pays to look first.

Standard pipe fitting.

You can find short lengths of pre-made pressure line everywhere. Harbor Freight carrys them, as do most of the places that carry air line.

What does your manual say you need for a line? If it says 20A then 12 guage wire is sufficient. If it calls for a 30A circuit, then you'll need 10 guage wire.
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-Mike-
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I went to the borg last night and picked up a bunch of parts. I'm not really looking to install an entire network of pipes yet. We're likely to move in about a year. My goal is to put whatever I need on the front of the compressor for now and run air hose to wherever I need it.
I bought a regulator, filter, and some fittings. The filter says that it gets water also, but I think when I'm ready for hvlp, i'll add another dryer. I haven't had a chance to hook any of it up yet. That's tonight.

Maybe i'll head over there tomorrow. I still need that flex hose that connects the pipes to the compressor. I need an engine hoist also.
The manual (i read it again, I missed it the first time) says 30 amps so I got the parts for that.
brian
brian
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BTDT. There's nothing wrong with dragging hose around. In fact, my garage is plumbed in black iron (I'd use soldered copper if I were to do it again), but I have a hose reel hung up on the wall that I generally hook to. My water trap is located at the input to the reel. When I paint a car, or spray a finish, or use my air tools, or whatever... I find that I haul out the 35 feet of air line on the reel so that I can easily move around. In fact, it's not uncommon for me to attach another 25 foot length of hose so that I can move more freely, depending on what I have laid out where in the painting process. So - though I have hard plumbing and my trap is located downstream to make water entrapment more efficient, I've still got tons of hose happening. Not so different from your proposed set up. The big difference is that I have water drains built in and my trap - being located down stream more, does collect more of the water because the air has time to cool in the lines. You can overcome that issue with an inline trap on your gun such as I had posted a link to earlier. Hell - I use traps on all of my guns even with my setup.

Dries never hurt, and I would not say they're a waste of money, but they are not completely necessary either. You have enough compressor that you won't be cycling all the time and generating water as badly as someone with a small unit. See how it goes with the traps and remember - drain your tank before *every* spray session. You can drain the water (90+% of it) without draining the air too, by just cracking the drain valve.

I bought my whips at Harbor Freight. They're Goodyear whips and they're just fine. I had to buy 3' lengths because that's all they had on the shelf, so I looped them and then connected them to the compressor/line and the reel/line. Works just fine-n-dandy. BTW - it's just a 3' length of 1/2" hose with NPT couplers factory crimped on each end. Make sure you have the female plumbing for these to attach to. Now that you're getting into the real guy tools this is a good time to remind you that it's always a good idea to have some "female plumbing" around the shop from time to time...

Almost off and running the. Here's one more piece of advice. Likely you also received rubber pads for isolation with your compressor. If not, get some 1/4" rubber about 6"X6" and put them under the legs of your compressor. You'll be amazed at how that quiets down the hammering that transfers through the compressor to the floor and rings within the tank.
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-Mike-
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For now, I wasn't going to put a drain in. The run is so short, like a three feet, that I doubt it will help much. The drain on the gun sounds like the way to go.

Not only did it not include them, the manual has some very specific instructions for bolting it to the floor complete with drawings, type of expansion bolt for the concrete, and torque specs for the lag screws. The manual says that if you don't bolt it to the floor, excessive vibration will cause the tank to weaken and possibly explode. This sort of things frightens and annoys me. It sounds like they took some engineering shortcuts and passed the problem on to the user. Still, the ringing tank sounds like exactly the type of vibration that would cause metal fatigue or whatever weaking they're talking about. Maybe a call to porter cable tech support is in order.
brian
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Water trap on the gun - not drain. You might have just made a slip there - just want to be sure.

Manufacturer's CYA to a large degree there Brian. All compressor manufacturers will tell you to bolt an upright to the floor. Liability laws in our wonderful society being what they are, and all. You won't need to as long as the floor is level, or you can level the compressor. The shock absorbing pads are a very high recommendation of mine though. You'll not regret putting those under the legs. Let your conscience be your guide as you're the guy that has to live with it though. None of mine have ever been bolted down and I would have to bet that the vast majority of those I've seen and been around have not been bolted down. I've never so much as heard of a compressor exploding from this. FWIW.
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Yeah, considering how much mileage we've gotten out of the grounding your dust collection pipes thing, I think the rec would be all over that one.
brian
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As a matter of fact I service air compressors for a living. I can attest to the fact that a compressor bolted to the floor without anti-vibration pads is a warranty voider with all manufactures. Some where at the shop we have pictures of a failed receiver that was bolted to the floor and the weld snapped at the leg. It bowed a concrete block wall out almost 16" and bent the i-beam header almost 9"
We will not service nor will we pressurize a tank with a failing weld in it. By the ay PVC piping is a code violation in all 50 states. It may not be used for pressurised air systems as the oils in the compressor breaks down the PVC and the glue. A severe schrapnel hazard when that stuff goes. It is not pretty either.
I also did warranty work for Champion Air Compressors and Gardner Denver they also void a warranty for no vibration pads
Carl Stigers Northeast Compressor Center Atlas Copco
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You realize that you're directly contradicting what my owner's manual says, right? It says no anti-vibration pads. The only thing the manual shows between the concrete and steel feet is a washer.
brian
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Here are some options starting from most costly to least:

http://www.tptools.com/product.asp?base%5Fno411%2D06&str%5Fbase%5Fno411%2D12%2C3450%2D02%2C3450%2D06%2CPIPE%2DKITS%2C3411%2D06%2C340%2DGAUGES%2C8805%2DDRYER%2C3500%2D60%2C3407%2D00%2C3405%2D60B%2C&header%5Ftitle=&page%5Fname=prod%5Flist%5Fdisplay%2Easp&search%5Ftype=L1%7E110&size1=&size2=&gender=&ShowImages=yes&sq &cont=1&intPgNo=2&mscssid=XURJMXV2MU0K9HN49QAB4H66QUQ02KRF
http://www.tptools.com/product.asp?base%5Fno450%2D06&str%5Fbase%5Fno411%2D12%2C3450%2D02%2C3450%2D06%2CPIPE%2DKITS%2C3411%2D06%2C340%2DGAUGES%2C8805%2DDRYER%2C3500%2D60%2C3407%2D00%2C3405%2D60B%2C&header%5Ftitle=&page%5Fname=prod%5Flist%5Fdisplay%2Easp&search%5Ftype=L1%7E110&size1=&size2=&gender=&ShowImages=yes&sq &cont=1&intPgNo=2&mscssid=XURJMXV2MU0K9HN49QAB4H66QUQ02KRF
http://www.tptools.com/product.asp?base%5Fno411%2D06&str%5Fbase%5Fno411%2D12%2C3450%2D02%2C3450%2D06%2CPIPE%2DKITS%2C3411%2D06%2C340%2DGAUGES%2C8805%2DDRYER%2C3500%2D60%2C3407%2D00%2C3405%2D60B%2C&header%5Ftitle=&page%5Fname=prod%5Flist%5Fdisplay%2Easp&search%5Ftype=L1%7E110&size1=&size2=&gender=&ShowImages=yes&sq &cont=1&intPgNo=2&mscssid=XURJMXV2MU0K9HN49QAB4H66QUQ02KRF
http://www.tptools.com/product.asp?base%5Fno409%2D00&str%5Fbase%5Fno402%2D00%2C3404%2D00%2C3403%2D34%2C3405%2D60%2C3409%2D34%2C3405%2D30%2C3411%2D34%2C3409%2D00%2C3411%2D02%2C3411%2D03%2C3411%2D12%2C3450%2D02%2C3450%2D06%2CPIPE%2DKITS%2C3411%2D06%2C340%2DGAUGES%2C8805%2DDRYER%2C3500%2D60%2C3407%2D00%2C3405%2D60B%2C&header%5Ftitle=&page%5Fname=prod%5Flist%5Fdisplay%2Easp&search%5Ftype=L1%7E110&size1=&size2=&gender=&ShowImages=yes&sq=0&cont=1&intPgNo=1&mscssid=XURJMXV2MU0K9HN49QAB4H66QUQ02KRF And many more combinations, I just ordered the 1/2" coalescing air filter and an extra cartridge.
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The manual should tell you all the "need to know " stuff. you can get the flex line made up anyware hydrilic hoses are made. do yourself a favor and pipe the drain out from under the tank to a ball valve, makes it must eaiser to drain the water out. also see http://www.tptools.com/statictext/airline-piping-diagram.pdf for piping sugestions, you can't go wrong with the info on the TP tools site. I have a true 5hp motor on my AC and it takes a 30 amp circuit and I used 8-2 wire because I had it.
Andrew
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