Linear Ft. Vs Board Ft at Lumber Yard.. did I get ripped off?

[Larry Bud]

Went to a new lumber yard (for me) that quoted me $6.20/bd ft over the phone for Cherry. I picked out 4 boards, the guy meausured them, wrote down the sizes which I handed to the clerks. After he gave me the total, I questioned the total because it didn't quite seem right to me. He again said $6.20/bd ft. Not having my calculator handy, I accepted it...

Well, it turned out I was robbed of about $14 on what should have been $103 order (I paid $117 + tax).

When I got back to work I looked more closely at the receipt, and he charged me per linear foot, where he rounded the 5.5" widths to 6" and the 6.75" width to 7", which commanded an even higher price / LF than the 6" boards. Total turned out to be $3.38/LF for the 6" and $3.94/LF for the 7".

It's not worth it to me to drive back there for $14 or for a couple of extra board feet, but is this typical practice or did they just see a wood novice/sucker?

These guys were still 1/2 price of other ripoff lumber yards in the Detroit Area (I went to Public Lumber Co on 7-Mile and I-75, FWIW) so I would probably go back there, unless of course, this was a total con job.

What would you do and what's typical practice?

[John A. Voss]

The main source of rough lumber that I use is in Phoenix, AZ and they very accurately measure the width and length and charge by the bdft regardless of the piece being 2" wide or 12" wide. This should be the common practice if they are stating that their wood is being sold by the bdft.

[Ron Short]

How thick were the boards? It sounds like you bought 4/4 lumber and they just took the width and length for the calculations. Assuming the thickness was 4/4 or 1", you don't need to add it to your calculations.

They should not have rounded up to the next 1/4", in my opinion. My lumberyard is very good when they measure. at $6.20/bft the 5.5" board should have been $2.84/linear ft. ((5.5 * 12)/144)*6.20. At 6" the per linear foot should be $3.10/ linear foot ((6 * 12)/144) * 6.20

Same goes with the larger board. $3.49/linear foot for 6.75" and $3.62/linear foot for 7" boards.

Seems to me you paid a little more than what you were told.

[George]

The operative word is "nominal." Your 5.5" board ran through the ripsaw at, or close to 6" in width, green. And so it is charged as a nominal 6" from there out. He probably paid for it the same way, if he got it from a wholesaler rather than a kiln.

I prefer shopping at the source, where they jam the boards between the wheel wells of the pickup, measure the distance, and multiply by layers. Your guy had to pay a couple of other stages.

When you come to the UP to snowmobile, leave room on the trailer to get your S&B cherry for ~2.00.

[Doug Winterburn]

What's your Phoenix source? I found Chandler Hardwoods about a year and a half ago and have been happy with the selection and pricing.

-Doug

[Australopithecus scobis]

Is that lumberyard still across the street from Ortega's? Is Ortega's still there?

[Doug Winterburn]

Where is/was Ortega's? Chandler Hardwoods is at the south end of the Chandler airport on a dirt road (Adams).

-Doug

[ns]

Doug, I have never heard of them. Do they do retail or are they wholesale? I buy most of my wood at Woodworkers Source or when all I need is sheet Timber on Southern. But I'm always looking for a new place to shop. Ed

[Doug Winterburn]

The one man supplier doesn't advertise, even in the phone book, as he says he says he has all the biz he wants. I think he lives behind the warehouse/barn. He sells to anyone, and always asks if I have a tax number or not (not). Go east from Arizona Ave on Queen Creek past McQueen. Turn right on Adams, a dirt road. Chandler Hardwoods is a few hundred yards down the road on the left.

He also carries sheet goods with hardwood veneers such as cherry, oak, mahogany, walnut, maple, birch,... as well as exotics.

-Doug

[rcook5]

If it is that's another reason for the trip.

--RC Sleep? Isn't that a totally inadequate substitute for caffine?

[loutent]

Hi Larry,

If the wood you got was S2S or better, then you got what you paid for. If it was rough (i.e., you have to plane & joint the sides to get it workable, then you were overcharged somewhat). There is about 10% waste in getting the rough stuff to the fine stuff.

At my local orange Borg, red oak is about $6+ / sq ft (board ft in the rough), so your cherry seems like a pretty fair price to me.

Personally, I would take this as a (cheap) lesson in wood purchasing so that the next time you go there, you know up-front exactly what you are paying for. Don't write off a convenient source of quality wood for a few $ and a one time purchase.

Lou

[Jim]

His measurements agree with the standards of the American Hardwood Association. So, no you were not cheated. Jim

[Prometheus]

Couple of thoughts here- first, it's always possible that the guy who did the pricing was a newer employee that didn't know what in the heck he was doing yet- it could have been a perfectly honest mistake. Second thought is that sometimes it's better to keep quiet about it- at least once. When I first started buying lumber from my local hardwood dealer, I was a little suspicious of the measurements and pricing, but after buying there for a couple of months and getting to know the employees a little (and helped one of them build his shop) I started to get some really nice deals- a couple of free bf here and there, a friendly eye pealed for nicely figured wood at the bottom of the stack, etc. I don't know that it's a "common" practice for lumber yards to skew the prices, but if they'll skew them one way, odds are you can get them to skew them the other way with a little patience. Obviously, it's not worth it if they're severely overcharging you on a regular basis, but it's worth a shot- especially since you said they're 1/2 the price of the other yards.

Aut inveniam viam aut faciam

[Australopithecus scobis]

Restaurant a coupla blocks off the square, iirc. Lumberyard mighta been "Fox." Chandler Airport? When did that happen? They didn't convert Willie, did they? OK, so 1972 was a couple of months ago...

[Doug Miller]

The measurements might agree with the AHA, but what he was charged doesn't match the quoted price of $6.20 / BF: $3.38 per foot for 6" lumber is $6.76 per BF, and $3.94 per foot for 7" lumber is $6.75 per BF.

One possible explanation for the discrepancy, though, is that lumber priced at $6.20 per BF in the rough might very well be $6.75 S4S.

-- Regards, Doug Miller (alphageek-at-milmac-dot-com)

Get a copy of my NEW AND IMPROVED TrollFilter for NewsProxy/Nfilter by sending email to autoresponder at filterinfo-at-milmac-dot-com You must use your REAL email address to get a response.

[Andy Dingley]

It's reasonable to round up on the measurement, but not on the price break. You pay a premium price because you can get a _usable_ width from it, not because it's a whisker over the smaller size.

[Roy Smith]

I've found it pays to compute the BF yourself and verify that the number the yard comes up with matches your calculations before you pay for it. I've had orders come out almost double the price I calculated because they mis-measured (calling something 8/4 instead of 6/4 not only gives you 1/3 more BF, but at a premium price per BF as well).

[RemodGuy]

Larry, where are you in SE mich? I'm in West Bloomfield and get all our hardwood from Armstrong Millworks on in Highland on Highland Rd [phone].

They are a great family owned business with some of the friendliest people you could ever meet. their selection is superior to any i've found in southern michigan. their prices are great. they also offer milling services if you are not set up to do it yourself. they get next to nothing to mill the rough lumber for you. My shop has everything to surface our lumber, but i have them do it most of the time now because they do in 1o minutes what takes me a couple hours and might cost be $12 to surface 100bf or so. it may be a long way for you, but give it a try sometime, you wont be disappointed.

You could also try general hardwood. it's down your way but the people that work there will treat you like a second class citizen, you dont get to pick your own boards, they have a $300 minimum order, and you have to call your order in ahead of time (usually a full day).

i get to Armstong once or twice a week. if you ever need something small and dont want to drive, shoot me an email. i could probably pick it up for you and meet you half way between w bloomfield and detroit.

finally, in answer to your actual question, these guys are fair to a fault. i stopped checking there measurments years ago. they always adjust footage if you pull a board that has a section that wont be useable

-sean

[RemodGuy]

where in the UP. have a place in Luce County.

[John McCoy]

[e-mail] (Larry Bud) wrote in news: [e-mail]:

I don't think you were cheated per se, but that's an unfriendly practice by a company that's not looking for repeat business.

One of the local places measures to the 1/8" in width and to the inch in length when figuring bd ft, and they don't allow much for wane or splitting if present. Most everyone else figures to the inch (rounding down) for width, and the half foot (rounding down again) on length. They don't have to do it that way, but allowing something for irregular boards is just being sensible. I don't go to the first place much, it's not worth the aggravation. (btw, this is all rough lumber...figuring to the exact half inch might make more sense for S4S).

BTW, having a table of conversion between bd ft and linear feet isn't that uncommon, altho 6.20/bd ft should have been 3.10/LF for 6", not 3.38, so they were playing you a bit sharp there, too.

John