Kitchen Cabinets - Toe Kick or No Toe Kick

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I am starting on a major kitchen cabinet project for our old, stone house and we want to have all the modern conveniences but want it to look traditional, country-style. One of the looks we are seriously considering includes a furniture-type base board on the cabinets without a toe-kick.
I know the idea of a toe-kick is to improve the comfort for those working in the kitchen, especially the lower back but I'm not really convinced one way or the other.
Any comments or suggestions are appreciated. Any references would be helpful as well. Thanks in advance.
Glen Duff
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Glen Duff wrote:

Easy to decide. Go stand at the kitchen sink for a few minutes. Rinse some dishes, wipe out the sink, then look where your eet are. If you are standing close and your feet are under the lip, it shows you need a toe kick. Without it, you end up with back problems.
You could try laying a 2 x 4 on the floor to block the openings of hte toe kick. See how many times you kick it when trying to reak for something in the upper cabinet. See how much you strain your back because you are standing out a few more inches.
If looks are more important than your health, go for the looks. If you value you lower back, go for the toe kick.
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posts before in some of the cooking groups.
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Edwin Pawlowski wrote:

If your eet are under something while you reak for something, you need to lay off the booze and get out of the kitchen before you burn yourself. ;)
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Hay, our yew making fun of the whey I tiped that? The spell chequer is supposed to be auto-matic. Ed
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You know when you set up a new computer with Windows, part of that set up is to tell the computer that you live in such and such time zone, what type keyboard so that the letters look correct? Why is there not a preference for the spell checker? Like Texan... Or Boston, or North Dakota or..
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On Sun, 29 Feb 2004 07:33:56 -0500, Glen Duff

What I like to do is use a furniture base, with an arched cutout to provide a toe space. This gives the look of the furniture base, while maintaining the functionality of the toe kick.
Thomas J. Watson-Cabinetmaker (ret) Real Email is: tjwatson1ATcomcastDOTnet Website: http://home.comcast.net/~tjwatson1
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Tom Watson wrote:

Along the same lines, I'm currently working with an English (UKer) arch-ee-tekt and his "scheme" is to have some more traditional looking casework fronts in the kitchen, larder (pantry Tom) and butler's pantry. To achieve this we're making face frame fronts and applying them to our "normal" Euro constructed cabinets. The stiles on the face frames run to the floor and are filled in to give a very solid looking appearance.
Also, on the kitchen island we're setting the toe boards back 8"-12" to give the appearance of freestanding units.
Also, it doesn't hurt to have the cabinets at different depths with the work tops following suit (suite Luigi). It give the appearance of furniture collected together and used for the kitchen cabinets.
UA100
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General question - how would one adapt this methid of installation to a Shaker style cabinet (assuming someone reading this has experience with Shaker furniture)?
Jon E
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Unisaw A100 wrote Tom Watson wrote:
snippage:
Jon Endres, PE

Not sure what adaptation you're looking at Jon. Got a URL of something Shakerish that you had in mind?
I'm also not sure it's Tom (Thom Luigi) or I who the question is directed to.
UA100
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Either. The Shaker style as I see it is predominately flat panel inset doors and drawer fronts. No elaborate moldings or ornamentation. I would say, given the limitations of modern kitchen design, that an Arts-and-Crafts style would be somewhat similar.
I think I've solved my problem anyway. The intent will be to make the island in the center of the kitchen look like a large piece of furniture, and not a block of modular cabinets.
Jon
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On Mon, 1 Mar 2004 12:56:38 -0500, "Jon Endres, PE"

Most of the islands that I've done have an overhang on the side that is most easily viewed. Something that goes well with Shakerish elements is a small base with a small bead and quirk, or possibly a chamfer, or stopped chamfer.
If there is a stovetop on the side that faces the sink, I run the base over a kickspace and usually cut it out to within about an inch of the bead and quirk/chamfer, with a curved cut on either end of the opening.
Even if there is no overhang on the sides, I usually run base there, unless there is a sink or some such, in which case I do the same as I would at the stovetop.
Thomas J. Watson - Cabinetmaker (ret.) (Real Email is tjwatson1ATcomcastDOTnet) http://home.comcast.net/~tjwatson1 /
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wrote:

I'm going to make the island look like a large chest of drawers with a granite top and four feet. The island will have a small sink in it, so there will be a "chase" of sorts in the center to run the piping. From any angle other than at floor level (where the cat is) you won't be able to tell it's not sitting only on four feet.
Jon
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How will you keep it clean with the cutout as you describe? At least wtih furniture, you can move it around the take care of it. Just my thought!
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On 29 Feb 2004 14:17:39 GMT, snipped-for-privacy@aol.com (ToolMiser) wrote:

There's a regular toe kick behind the overlay.
Thomas J. Watson-Cabinetmaker (ret) Real Email is: tjwatson1ATcomcastDOTnet Website: http://home.comcast.net/~tjwatson1
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it's really easy to figure: if you and the missus are toeless, go without the toe-kick. Otherwise...
dave
Glen Duff wrote:

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Otherwise extended the counter top out. . .<s>
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wrote:

a deep overhang can make up for no toe kick, but it makes it hard to use the full depth of the top drawers.
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good point, I try to overhang counters just enough to keep drips from running down the cabinet fronts.
dave
Bridger wrote:

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You can also over extend the drawers. There is nothing cast in stone here save maybe tradition. You could design the top drawer wedge shaped and pivot out to clear the overhang, exercise imagination and see where it goes. Lets have a real, std rule, brainstorming to revolutionize the base cabinet industry. <s> -- SwampBug - - - - - - - - - - - -

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