Is crack a common drug for ebay bidders?

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Probably because most people don't know how much something is really worth when they bid on it?
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wrote:

Close, but wrong. IOW, the person bidding by proxy defines his upper limit, the person bidding by sniping defines his as "50 cents more than the other guy". If it's not done to reduce what the sniper pays, then what is it for?
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Dave,
Will you refer me to the software package or whatever that allows such a bid to be placed. All I've seen merely permit the "sniper" to specify a maximum, fixed amount.
I would never use one that works as you describe. It would be far too dangerous for me to even consider using.
Tom Veatch Wichita, KS USA
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That isn't logical, as it would have no difference compared to using proxy bidding. It's all about timing, and unfair advantage, isn't it.
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wrote:

That is exactly how sniping works. It just submits your maximum bid at the last minute. There is no difference between it and proxy bidding except that your presence in the auction is not advertised. This reduces the bid fever, but does not change anything else about the auction. I don't know why you think it is such an evil thing. There is no unfair advantage.
-J
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In other words, it bypasses the proxy bidding system, yes.

...(cue justification)

There it is. Yeah, doesn't change anything else about it except that you are working on more information than the other participants are given.

So, to paraphrase, "There is no unfair advantage, I'm just jumping in line right at the end without giving you a chance to bid". Gotcha. Well, as long as you can justify it to yourself, that's all that matters, isn't it now.
I'll repeat - I would pay a premium to list items with the 15-minute option, and prefer to buy on auction sites that have that feature.
Dave Hinz
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No it doesn't. It submits a proxy bid in the last few minutes/seconds of the auction. How does this bypass the proxy bidding system?

No you are not. You know nothing about the other persons max bid or whether someone else is going to submit a bid. You know exactly as much as everyone else.

You always have a chance to bid. What makes you think you don't have a chance to bid? You can bid your max bid at the very beginning of the auction and if it is the high bid it wins. Simple as that. High bid always wins. In fact, the first high bid wins in the case of a tie, so theoretically, an earlier proxy bid has an advantage.

I think you fail to understand how proxy bidding works and how sniping works.
-Jack
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It robs the other bidders of the ability to react to your sniped bid. That is, after all, why you do it, isn't it?

They don't know you're sitting there waiting to snipe.

Because you upped it at the last second.

Red herring. We're talking about the close of an auction.

I understand it quite completely. I disagree with the ethics of those who choose to exploit it.
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You don't know they are sitting there waiting to bid or snipe. Right?

As long as it is less than or equal to your max then you win. If it is more, then you lose. How much simpler can this be? High bidder always wins. Bid what you want. If you win you win. If not, then don't blame the other fool.
Winning isn't everything. At least twice I was high bidder, but the real winners were the people who didn't win.

Start or finish. It only matters what the highest bid is at any time. Don't you understand this?

You don't seem to understand the basic principles of it. That is why I think you have a bad impression. Use your head.
-J
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See above. I understand it, and disrespect people who choose to exploit that tactic. I further feel that people, like you, who go to great lengths to justify how it's _not_ unfairly decreasing the seller's price, while explaining that you do it to decrease the seller's price, are working hard to justify that to themselves.
As interesting as this topic is(n't), I can't really see this going anywhere. You'll keep sniping, and I'l keep disrespecting you for it.
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Sellers who don't like it can find a different venue. It is completely within the rules. You are right though, it is going nowhere with you. I guess I'll just have to keep disrespecting you for having a mind that fails to comprehend this. Bye.
-J
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Yes, indeed, other online auctions can and have implemented a 15-minute rule option, for just this reason.

I do not fail to comprehend it, I do not _agree_ with you that it is acceptable behavior in an auction. I disagree with it _because_ I understand what it is, even if you tell yourself that it's just fine because it's technically within the rules.
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You got it! It may not be logical, but that is exactly the way "sniper" software works. There is not one iota of difference between "sniping" and regular proxy bidding except in the timing of the bid placement. For an example, check out the "Bidnapper" software at www.bidnapper.com
The contention of "50 cents more than the other guy" is not workable in the eBay environment. If my bid is $25.00, and your "snipe" is for 50 cents more than my bid, eBay will reject your bid because it is not at least one bid increment more than the current bid.
I'm not sure what the break points are, but at low bids, the increment is $0.50. As the current bid amount increases, the minimum acceptable increment also increases. Therefore, any bid of "$X.XX more than the other guy" would fail to be honored by eBay as soon as the current bid reaches the point at which the minimum increment exceeds $X.XX.
Tom Veatch Wichita, KS USA
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here it comes...

EXACTLY my point, thank you Captain Obvious.

(sigh). Yes, for lower priced things with a 50-cent bid increment, that applies. For higher priced things with a higher bid increment that also applies. I didn't think I needed to specify the entire bid increment to pricing scheme.

The "jump in at the last moment before the other guy has a chance to counterbid" is the whole point of using sniping software, and anyone claiming otherwise is deluding themselves.
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If the current bid price seems too good to be true, then it probably is.
Unless the item is very rare, you can search completed items to see how much similiar items sold for in the past. Of course, Ebay made this harder by limiting completed items to 2 weeks instead of the 30 days in the past.
Brian Elfert
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Hypothetical: 2 or more people are using Bidnapper to bid on an item. Who wins? The software purports to win the bidding for the user. But with multiple users, who is guaranteed success?
David
Tom Veatch wrote:

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First off, you have to discount a lot of the "This software will win the bid for you" as marketing hype.
It boils down to the same old story - Highest bid wins. If two people are sniping the same auction using Bidnapper or any other software package, then both bids will be submitted to ebay in the final seconds of the auction as the respective maximums of the two bids.
For example, assume that you and I are sniping the same auction. I submit a snipe of $45. You submit a snipe at $45.01. The current bid is $20 with a proxy maximum of $30. A few seconds before the end of the auction, the sniping software will submit a proxy bid for you with a maximum of $45.01 and a proxy bid for me with a $45 maximum.
It really doesn't matter which goes in first in this case since our maximums are different. eBay will compare the maximum of whichever one is processed first to the current bid. Since it is more than the current bid plus the bid increment, it will be accepted. The current high bidder's bid will be advanced to it's maximum of $30. However, the new bid maximum exceeds that so either you or I will be the new high bidder (depending on whether your or my snipe was entered first) with a bid of $31. That assumes the bid increment is $1.00.
In either case, when the second snipe is entered the same thing happens all over again. The new bid maximum is either my $45, if your snipe went before mine, or your $45.01 if my snipe was ahead of yours. In either case, the new bid maximum is more than $32 (the current bid + the bid increment) so eBay accepts the bid. Note that if the new bid maximum is not at least one bid increment more than the _current bid_, eBay will reject the bid. Then the proxy process runs the bid up to a value equal to whichever is the lower of a) the larger of the two proxy maximums, your $45.01, or b) the lowest of the two proxy maximums plus the bid increment, my $45.00 + $1.00 = $46.00. Since $45.01 is less than $46.00, you are the high bidder at $45.01.
Incidentally, that also explains why someone can be the high bidder when their bid is less than one bid increment more than your maximum bid.
Rather long-winded, and I apologize for that.
Also, the standard disclaimers apply. I am not associated with either eBay, Bidnapper, or any other sniping software product. The discourse above is a compilation of my research into public information available on the separate eBay and Bidnapper websites. The research was the result of being highly disappointed when a beautiful Bedrock #606 was sniped away from me.
Tom Veatch Wichita, KS USA
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I have a very simple system that works. For me anyway.
If I see an item I'm interested in, I'll place a bid for the maximum I'm willing to pay. If I get the item, fine, it is a good deal. If I lose it, I don't care. I've bought a few items that should sell for $20 and paid $2. If an item is starting to bid high, I'm not interested because I can probably find the same item at a retail store and have a full warranty.
Sometimes you get lucky. My wife order an item from a store with the intention of spending $130. It was no longer available. Searching eBay, it was found for $100 and a "buy now" option. She grabbed it and everyone was happy. (buyer, seller, financier)
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wrote:

In a "real" auction, the auctioneer usually does not drop the hammer until he/she receives the last bid. As long as there are bidders, the bidding continues. Not so with Ebay; when the clock runs out, its ended. I think it would be greatly beneficial to the sellers if Ebay would allow the bidding continue after the end of the auction as long as bids continue to be received, i.e. end the auction when no more bids are received in a 15 second period. That allows the "Johnny come lately" to out bid the sniper if he so chooses.
Gary
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wrote:

Isn't then the Johnny come lately just sniping the sniper's bid? (not that I have a problem with it, it just doesn't seem to fix the problem of people bidding at the last minute)
Actually there are plenty of sealed bidding situations in the world. That is the model adopted by ebay. We have already heard of many examples where things already go for more than retail. Ebay to continue has to be beneficial to both buyers and sellers. If buyers are turned off by high prices they won't bother anymore and ebay will die. Remember that the buyer is the one person in the whole ebay world who is willing to pay the price for the item. What good would squeezing a few more dollars out of him do? The popularity of ebay by both buyers and sellers seems to suggest (not prove) that they are doing a decent job of balancing the needs of both.
-j
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