Hummm LeeValley screws up and does not make good.

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Sorry Ed, I might have missed comments from those *others*, but it appears like you're one of the few, if not the only one who perceives it that way.
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But, he did attempt a resolution beforehand. And, upon attempting that resolution he was rebuffed.
It was only on further complaint (and I suspect a good attention from this newsgroup), that brought about what most would consider the correct resolution.
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Nice sticky reach-around, Swingy.
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On 8/7/2013 11:48 AM, Moderator wrote:

C_Less, your sock puppet is showing ...
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On 8/7/2013 1:04 PM, Swingman wrote:

LOL, I knew he was still lurking.
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On 8/7/13 11:48 AM, Moderator wrote:

Go away you anonymous posting, cowardly douchbag.
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Yes, nothing wrong with that.

No you are wrong. Lee Valley did not blame the customer, an individual that works for them did. He was wrong and Rob Lee is taking care of that. Wait for the rest of the story before making conclusions.
But he got the troops here riled up before getting a second contract and resolution. Does LV deserve to be drug through the mud yet? Maybe at some point, but people are already taking how LV had gone to crap before the final word was in. That is unfair and Leon is the person staring that. Shame on him; I expected better of Leon. Sorry, but I stand by my comment. If Rob Lee told him the same thing, I'd agree, but it seems he did not. He is trying to rectify the situation.
Like everyone else, I've had encounters with poor customer service by some companies over the years, but I don't whine about it until the situation is finalized. I don't jump to conclusions until I find the real problem. Some businesses deserve bad publicity, but others really do rectify problems and make things right.
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On 8/7/2013 6:04 PM, Ed Pawlowski wrote:

Your mighty effort to take the moral high ground failed. Rob Lee himself shot you out of the saddle, Live with it.
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On 8/7/2013 7:36 PM, Swingman wrote:

problem can be fixed. Don't tell half the story, tell it all.
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On 8/7/2013 7:39 PM, Ed Pawlowski wrote:

I did tell it all as it played out.
But I have to ask, you think less of me because I took this all the way and let every one know what was going on.
Would you to prefer to think of me as the person that gave up and let the situation go unresolved and then post that they screwed me around?
I am thinking that it would have been real easy to not post copies of every move made by every one and perhaps left, for some, a bad feeling about LV.
I think we are all adults here, life is not rosy but I believe that the out come of this thread came out positive for LV and did not benefit my mission to smear LV had that been my purpose in the first place.
My sole reason to start this thread was to point out a fact and a problem. It turns out that LV was at fault and did have a problem and as it turns out my posting all the facts here enabled me to take the necessary steps to contact the right person to correct the problem. I was getting nowhere until a few here gave me the necessary information to get to the person that would care. LV truly had a problem that was affecting its customers and now that problem has been brought to light and is being corrected.
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wrote:

No, I'm thinking you are a mature and reasoned person that would tell the entire story, not start with the portion that incites people. Some will read to the end, others have already condemned LV as going to crap.

I did not say it was your reason to smear LV, but telling the first part of the story can easily be interpreted that way. It was, from the various replies.

I'm sure that LV appreciates your finding the issue. You did the right thing in the end, but it had a bumpy start.
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On 8/7/2013 6:04 PM, Ed Pawlowski wrote:

Ok, first off every employee at LV represents LV, they are all the face of LV. Let the few that want to run thing their way and the company looses direction and customers suffer. So yes, two different LV employees blamed the customer therefore LV blamed the customer.
He was wrong and Rob Lee is

Again, I did nothing to stir the pot except to state facts. Perhaps my post should have been precluded that some readers might want to leave the room as the facts might be found disturbing. ;~)
Does LV deserve to be drug through the mud yet? Maybe

Again, I was stating facts, nothing fiction here and others jumping on board apparently has similar instances. Perhaps you read way more into my comments that were intended.
That is unfair and Leon is the person

Actually my response to Rob responding to my e-mail to him wa that I wanted no favors but thought he should be brought aware of the situation.

I don't think stating facts as they played out was whining. Nor do I believe that sitting back and waiting for some one else to take the initiative to correct a problem is going to fix anything.
I have had several contacts with LV and it was not until I contacted Rob that I felt confident that the situation would be rectified. I posted every comment and posted every copy of the correspondence here as it unfolded. If anything I think it might be to LV's benefit that I did so. I reassured those reading my posts that Rob is still interested in running his company in the manner that we are accustomed to. Had I not taken all of this further I would have still had a bad taste in my mouth and probably would have thought twice about using them when delivery timing was a factor. Now if you feel that what I posted was dragging LV through the mud perhaps that was because the first few contacts I made with a couple of the LV reps decision to dismiss the problem as customer error left you feeling that you would not want to be treated that way. From the beginning they knew that I had a receipt and a confirmation number and they could not find it. That was their mistake for dismissing the problem.
I'm sorry if you took offense to the way I handled the situation but having run stores most all of my career the people that take the initiative to recognize and correct a problem are the people that I always wanted working for me, not the ones that passed it off and let the next guy clean up the mess. There are those that get the job done and there are those that sit back and watch.
I don't jump to conclusions until I find the

Turns out my suppositions were correct and until I contacted Rob the situation was going to go unresolved.
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On 8/7/2013 7:04 PM, Ed Pawlowski wrote:

a representative of Lee Valley, and I think Leon did try with a supervisor... If I remember... so it was Lee Valley.. (either lack of training or bad new policy).
He was wrong and Rob Lee is

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Why are you being such a bear about this? When making complaints, at what point do you stop? Two tries, three tries, more?
It's not like Leon didn't try, he did and was cut off by a customer service rep with the wrong information on hand. And, how many times after talking with a customer service rep, are you able to go much higher over their head and talk to the CEO of the company?
Leon didn't have Rob Lee's email in the beginning. He got that email by the very fact of airing his grievance in this newsgroup. And, the only reason Rob Lee's email was available is the fact that he frequently contributes in some newgroups. All those conditions aren't very common at all.
Everything that happened was needed to get to the final (proper) resolution.
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On Thu, 08 Aug 2013 03:58:34 -0400, snipped-for-privacy@none.com wrote:

Leon already knew who to contact. Finding Rob's email is not all that difficult, it was just a simple question easily answered. I just think that airing the first half of the problem cast them in a light that people were already making decisions that LV went to crap, as plainly stated.
He did the right thing in the end, just could have handled the first portion better, IMO.
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Think about what you're saying. Lee Valley has one of the best reputations in the business. This little flap isn't nearly enough tarnish that image. And, anybody who is at all into woodworking know this.
However you feel about the way Leon approached this problem, I prefer view it as just another example of Lee Valley Tools doing that they do best. Problem in the beginning and now it's solved. If anything, it will be just another example of Lee Valley Tools doing what they do best ~ providing customer service. And that, will bring in even more customers.
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On 8/7/2013 7:00 AM, Swingman wrote:

Amen. And the more people who tolerate poor customer service the worse customer service gets. I'm with Leon.
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I heard that Leon has problems getting material from his suppliers. I wonder why. I don't know the whole story, just what I saw here so I'll interpret his problem the way I see it and not get the rest of the facts.
Now, did that piss you off Karl?

No one said it should be tolerated, but there are often better ways to handle such situations.
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On 8/7/2013 9:00 AM, Swingman wrote:

The confirmation, the receipt...
So lets assume that the credit card did not go through, why did he get the confirmation????
So now lets assume that they lost the order, but he mailed them proof of confirmation and receipt...
In either case, Lee Valley should have stepped up.. They are known for their customer service on top of their usually good tools and hardware.
I would expect them to treat him differently from the reciept and confirmation than what he received. Then add to that if they looked up his activity , they might have given him some more respect.
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Both true but from what I've read in this read (not all) I'm thinking that the problem was that the page timed out before the order was actually placed.
Normally, when ordering stuff online, you are eventually presented with a page detailing the order; an invoice, essentially. There is often/usually a confirmation number too and a suggestion that the purchaser print the page but the order isn't actually placed until the buyer hits the "Place Order" or "Submit" or whatever button. Once that is done, gears grind, stuff whirls, credit card is checked & charged and eventually - if all has gone well - a new page pops up and thanks you for your order. I rather imagine that final "Thank you" page didn't pop up for Leon.
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