Hold my beer - I'm gonna try try something...

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To prevent damage from exposure to the environment (rain, snow, salt, UV, bugs, etc) I've been thinking about wrapping the outside of some wooden boxes in stainless steel for some time now.
The rough plan is to apply spray adhesive - something similar to
http://www.use-enco.com/CGI/INSRIT?PMAKA=SY505-2691
to the wood and then very carefully apply 0.002" stainless steel foil similar to this stuff
http://www.use-enco.com/CGI/INSRIT?PMAKA=SY326-1520
over the adhesive and use a roller to ensure good contact / smooth surface.
I've never done anything like this before, neither the adhesive nor the foil is particularly cheap, and the wooden boxes are expensive enough to make me nervous about screwing up even one full-sized test.
Has anyone tried anything like this (first-hand experience) or know of someone else who did? Did it work and if not, why not?
Does anyone know of more suitable/better/longer-lasting materials?
Any technique suggestions that might make the job easier or provide longer-lasting protection?
Thanks!
--
Morris Dovey
DeSoto Solar
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Morris Dovey wrote:

You might try vacuum pressing the foil to the wood - could make a smoother looking finish. Of course, the boxes could be too big for a vacuum bag...
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On 1/9/2010 9:25 AM, Doug Winterburn wrote:

Hmmm - I hadn't considered vacuum. I might be able to make a "bag" with a sheet aluminum top and bottom with plastic around the four sides...
...I definitely need to give the approach some serious thought. Thanks!
--
Morris Dovey
DeSoto Solar
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The FIL use to make tack boxes for horse owners. He bought the birch ply with aluminium sheets pre glued to it, and just cut it to size. Maybe you could find it with stainless and remake the boxes. Save the others boxes for some other use. As for the spray glue . I've used something close to that in various brands at work to glue foam insulation to steel panels. I've not been real happy with the long term hold of it . You may want to go with the brush/roll on contact . The spray to me is more like silly string and doesn't cover as good in my opinion. I've got a few pictures of his boxes around. If you would like a look at them to see if it would work for you let me know and I can send them to you. Jim

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On 1/9/2010 9:44 AM, Jim Northey wrote:

Please. I'd like to take a look - and I confess ignorance as to suitability of particular adhesives.
This whole exercise is intended to maximize the useful lifetime of the boxes so, yes, I do care about the long term hold. I'm not committed to aerosol application - I'd just wanted to avoid a too-thick mass that might uglify the finished product...
--
Morris Dovey
DeSoto Solar
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wrote:

I wonder if you sprayed the box with that truck bed liner stuff [ rhino liner?] might work. seems like it would seal every thing tight and last a long long time.
skeez
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On 1/9/2010 9:46 AM, skeez wrote:
[ Mis-sent directly to skeez (sorry) ]

I'll follow-up on that. I'd like for these things to be good for a century or so in a high-UV environment, so I'd more or less ruled out plastics. A trip to the junkyard to look at old pickup might provide me with some notion as to how bed liner material holds up...
Thanks!
--
Morris Dovey
DeSoto Solar
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While you are there, maybe check out Undercoat. Some of these folks should be able to give you the UV tolerance of their products. What do the utility companies or railroads do?
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Morris Dovey wrote: ...

...
Specifically for the question asked, "no, not really"...
I'm wondering why not simply fabricate the boxes from SS or one of the resistant alloys or even AL and forget the wood entirely?
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On 1/9/2010 9:46 AM, dpb wrote:
[ Mis-sent directly to dpb (sorry) ]

I've considered that - but wood has properties that make it particularly well-suited for these boxes. It appears that it's a lot more economical to enhance outer surface of wooden boxes with a small amount of metal than it is to deal with the thermal headaches inherent in an all- or mostly-metal box.
The boxes already have some 1/8" aluminum trim that I worry about not holding up well in coastal/salty/high-pollution areas... :(
--
Morris Dovey
DeSoto Solar
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Morris Dovey wrote:

I'd think a thin layer of foam/etc. on inside would be far quicker/cheaper and at least as much thermal resistance as 3/4" ply for the thermal part...the structural end could still be an issue, granted.
How big are the boxes out of curiosity?

That could be issue w/ common AL alloys, certainly. Altho we had trouble w/ some SS's being susceptible to grain-boundary-site initiated corrosion in some areas in paper mills, too (specifically bleaching operations w/ Cl processes) so depending on the environment even there may need to consider the specific alloy.
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I'm not sure stainless holds up all that well in salty applications. I've seen supposedly stainless measuring cups pit when I use them for saltwater aquarium water preparation. Brass might hold up better in a salty environment, but I don't have a clue about that.
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"LDosser" wrote:

Brass in salt water is strictly a loser, the zinc leaches out leaving a structure that will crumble in your hand.
Stainless Steel is no winner either.
"stain" and "less" are the operative words.
18-8, of which is what most cooking utensils are made, will pit right in front of you, if left to continuous exposure of salt warter.
316L, about a 35% price premium, will last a little longer, but silicon bronze is your best shot.
Lew
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On 1/9/2010 10:18 PM, Lew Hodgett wrote:

Hmm. Thanks. What I've been looking at in my catalog are Type 321 and Type 309 stainless tool wrap - probably good for their intended purpose (making a quick "airtight" envelope for heat treating small parts), but not necessarily great for mine.
I doubt solar heating panels will be continuously exposed to salt water - but I'd like 'em to hold up as well as possible in coastal areas. I could live with a 35% premium if 316L holds up significantly longer than 309 and 321, and I've added the search for silicon bronze foil to my to-do list.
I'll do my own research, of course, but do you have a notion of the difference in cost between silicon bronze and, say, 316L stainless? And are you aware of any mechanical properties that might make it more/less difficult to work with?
I have a local customer who's volunteered to be a guinea pig for Type 321 panels, and I don't expect any salt problems here - so building his order will be the learning exercise in applying a metal jacket to these things. Since I have you "on the line" would you care to comment on Lee Michaels' suggestion of possibly using an epoxy as the adhesive?
--
Morris Dovey
DeSoto Solar
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Naval Bronze. I have some port holes that were under salt water for 50 years or so. Nice dark patina.
Silicon Bronze is a nice gold color and is good. Have a note pad holder on my desk made from it.
Martin
Lew Hodgett wrote:

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How big are these boxes, Morris? (Psssst.. I have done a little laminating in my day.) What kind of wood? Shape?
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On 1/9/2010 9:56 AM, Robatoy wrote:

Two sizes: 48" x 72" x 8" and 96" x 72" x 8". I only need the s/s around the four 8" sides of the box.
I'm still experimenting with wood types, and my material choices open up dramatically if I can ensure that the material is completely shielded from the elements.
Anticipating your next post, these /will/ be perched in the sun - but shouldn't be subjected to temperatures higher than about 150F/65C or lower than about -40F/C.
--
Morris Dovey
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On 1/9/2010 10:35 AM, Morris Dovey wrote:

Not enough info available for anything more than a guess, but it seems like boxes of that size could easily be made of something like exterior "aquapanel" instead of wood.
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Last update: 10/22/08
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One method we use to remove laminates (and we do use metals sometimes) is a heat gun. Contact cement and heat don't get along. Something to keep in mind. I thought of that, because when Morris is around, the sun can't be far away. What? Waitasec....
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On 1/09/10 10:14 AM, Morris Dovey wrote:

Have you considered asphalt shingles, should last for 15 years or so, match the building if appropriate, and they would be easy to replace.
--
Froz...


The system will be down for 10 days for preventive maintenance.
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