Hide glue

Ok, I've seen a lot of you all talk about hide glue. I needed some brown Titebond for some walnut glue ups I was doing. I was on the side of town Woodcraft isn't, but I had a friend that was going right past it on his way to give me a hand. I asked him to stop and pick me up a bottle. He comes up with hide glue, not the brown glue. What's the hide glue good for? It looks a lot like gorilla glue.
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From Google: Hide glue, properly used, forms a strong and long-lasting bond. It was the most common woodworking glue for thousands of years

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Ok, that works for me. So I'm guessing it should be ok to use on the walnut. I just never used it before and don't want to ruin these boards.
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Tim Taylor wrote:

It is a great glue, but not for outdoor use. They still use it in many industries. For making musical instruments, for example, where joints may have to be disassembled for repair some day.
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wrote:

Strongly suggest you investigate the properties and characteristics of the glue before you leap. As stated, it's a good glue, been around for ages, and is still in use. But it's not interchangeable with other, more modern glues. Not saying it's better or worse in general, just different and, potentially not recommended for some applications.
Don't know your particular application, but DAGS "Hide Glue", read some of the references, and be sure that's what you want to use.
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And the prime reason that things like dovetails and draw bored tennons were used. They had to rely on mechanical means to hold a joint together as the glue was weak.

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CW wrote:

Now THAT's a new one to me! Hide glue joints are, as are most glues, stronger than the wood itself. More than that is irrelevant.
Or were you trying a troll?
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Hide glue is not nearly as durable and long lasting as modern yellow glues. It is hard and brittle. The initial joint is just fine but over time, under stress and flexing, it tends to crack and eventually turns to near powder. Yellow glues are far more resistant to that.

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Well now, quote "not as durable and long lasting . . . " and "it tends to crack and eventually turns to near power"
that must be sometime after the 300 to 400 year point. All the old antique furniture that I see around that was put together with hide glue in the early 1600's and later are all holding up just fine. I haven't seen one of those antiques falling apart yet because the glue turned to power again.
But maybe I am just not looking at the right things. Even furniture which I bought over 50 years ago that was put together with hide glue is still just as strong as the day I bought them. After all, If it won't last another 100 years, what do I care?
Zap
CW wrote:

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I think he's just ignorant. Dovetails and draw bored tenons and the like are generally used where the joint would otherwise involve a bond to end grain which even the best modern adhesives don't do very well.
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Ok, thanks for all the answers guys. I stopped up in Indy at the WC store while ago and got a bottle of what I wanted to begin with, as I just like to use the brown glue on darker wood. I've got a bottle of hide glue in the cabinet if anybody needs it!!!
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I don't know. I think Larry is a fairly bright guy. Now that J. Clarke guy...

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CW wrote:

Dovetails are used because they're self-supporting without glue, but this is because hide glue is short-lived, not because it's weak. A good hide-glued joint (like a rubbed joint) is as strong as many timbers. Most draw-bored tenons aren't even glued, certainly in anything bigger than a chair stretcher.
Hide glue's _huge_ advantage is that the joint can last a thousand years with appropriate repairs every couple of centuries. One dose of glue might not, but the bond is reversible and it's pretty easy to take a piece apart to reglue it without damage. Try that with a modern glue! Just look at the amount of unfastening and refastening work that goes on with top-end violins and is regarded as almost commonplace maintenance.
Oh, and modern glues don't last forever either. Look at the problems with those synthetics that leach out acid, those (PU!) that have terrible UV stability, and those like PVA that creep under load.
I use almost entirely hide glue, particularly for my good furniture. I use PVA for biscuits and modern board materials, Titebond II for small joints in modern style work, and loads of epoxy. For "traditional" joints though or especially for veneering, there's nothing to beat hot hide glue. With a thermostatic electric pot, it's even easy to use too. Hide glue's awkward past reputation was almost entirely because of the bother of using it, and the failed performance if you do over heat it.
I assume what the OP has is a tube of cold Titebond hide glue. A fine product and as convenient as anything else. Give it a go and enjoy yourself.
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PS - color might be similar, but hide glue is nothing like Gorilla:
- Doesn't foam - Doesn't stain (as bad) - Hide glue is not a good choice for exterior work - It can be disassembled - with patience
RonB
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Tim. I've been using regular Titebond, Titebond II & Titebond III (not the dark stuff) for gluing walnut for fine cabinet work for years.

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Tim Taylor wrote:

Here's som info (hide glue is actually best if you buy it in dry form): http://www.bjorn.net/purpose.htm http://www.frets.com/FRETSPages/Luthier/Data/Materials/hideglue.html http://www.frets.com/FRETSPages/Luthier/Technique/Glue/UseHideGlue/usehideglue2.html
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An ER doc found the Rival Hot Pot Express several years ago and suggested it as it has variable temperature dial. Don't want to overheat the dry form when preparing.

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it was hot hide glue that had to be mixed and heated before use, not the liquid hide glue your friend got.
Its main advantage is that it softens and redissolves when wet, allowing the joint to come apart.
Its main disadvantage is that it softens and redissolves when wet, allowing the joint to come apart.
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snipped-for-privacy@fellspt.charm.net () wrote in
*snip*

That's just like Tester's Model Cement. I purchased a used model assembled with that stuff and it turned in to a kit by the time I got it home.
Puckdropper
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To email me directly, send a message to puckdropper (at) fastmail.fm
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