Help with my finishing technique

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On Sun, 18 Mar 2007 00:13:38 -0500, -@-.com wrote:

You'll need to ask for the good stuff, check out Sherwin Williams web site before going.
<http://www.sherwin-williams.com/pro/sherwin_williams_paint/product_specifications/finishing_guide.jsp
Scroll down to 099300.
Some folks here have great local SW stores, mine are below average. Hopefully, you're in one of the other guy's areas! <G>
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-@-.com wrote:

If you want to play with lacquer and don't have spray equipment, try Deft Clear Finish. The can doesn't *say* it's lacquer but it is. Solvent is lacquer thinner. And it's meant for brush application...applies easily and sands very easily. Comes in gloss or semi-gloss IIRC.
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dadiOH
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I like an oil based finish on darker woods like Cherry, Walnut and Ipe. I think it really brings out the grain of the wood and it just can't be beat. Water based poly does not do nearly as nice of a job in bringing out the grain as oil based finishes do.
Way back when I finished a really nice set of hard maple shelves with an oil based finish. There is only one way to describe them... "YELLOW". I will never use an oil based finish on maple or a light wood again.
I prefer water based poly or laquer on light woods depending on the function of the piece. Laquer is by far the easiest finish to work with and I do use the Deft rattle cans if I can finish the piece with one can otherwise I buy a quart or gallon and use spray equipment. For any sort of table top with a light wood I prefer water based poly for it's protective qualities. It has been my experence the water based poly will hold up a lot better than laquer. I recently built a rail for a staircase out of maple with an IPE top cap. I used laquer on the maple and oil based varnish (1/3 tung oil, 1/3 spar varnish and 1/3 turpentine) on the Ipe. I love the way it turned out. The oil finish on a wood as hard as Ipe should last a long time. If the maple gets a scratch, it will be a very simple repair with a rattle can of Deft.
P.S. When it comes to walnut many mills steam walnut to better distribute the natural pigments througout the wood making the sapwood closer to the same color as the heart wood. This has a tendancy to greatly recude the impact of walnut. If I have a piece of walnut with sap wood on it I try to position the sapwood on the final piece so it becomes a feature of the piece not something I need to try to cover up and blend in with the rest of the wood. Book matching two pieces of walnut with sapwood can make for a very stunning visual detail in my opinion.
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Not to pick on you, the following is for general information. <G>
"Waterbase poly" as offered to the consumer market by Minwax, Benwood, etc... is not the same thing as the waterbased "lacquers" sold by Target, Fuhr, Oxford, ML Campbell, etc... and aimed at the pro market. There are distinct differences in application and in the appearance of the final, finished product. Some of the waterbased lacquers will even "burn-in" just like solvent lacquer.
Lack of burn-in is one of the big problems with any polyurethane finish, oil or water based. If a polyurethane (as well as certain varnishes and catalyzing products) finish is wet sanded enough to rub through a layer, white "witness lines" can appear.
To "pop the figure" under good waterbase finishes, the finisher can simply use dewaxed shellac as a sanding sealer, dye (Analine, NGR, etc...) or BLO. BLO needs a good week to cure before an overcoat of dewaxed shellac under water base. Dyes can fade, or be moved or removed, by carelessly applied water or alcohol based top coats.
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Hmm...
The problem I have with BLO (Boiled Linseed Oil) is like all of the other oil based finishes I have tried it imparts a very yellow hue to the wood. While I find this perfectly acceptable on darker woods like walnut and Ipe (even desireable) it is way to yellow for me on lighter woods like maple. Some people may find the yellowish hue perfectly acceptable on lighter wood. If I were going to put a base coat of BLO on a project I would probabally just use an oil based varnish with it (1/3 tung or BLO, 1/3 spar varnish, 1/3 turpentine, wait... wait... wait for it to dry).
I have never tried a base or seal coat of clear shelac under poly for "popping the grain". I have only used shelac under stain to try to even the stain out. This might be worth trying on some test wood. I find water based poly a little lifeless on maple and laquer not much better. A little "pop" would be nice if it didn't impart any color.
Thanks for the tip!
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Just make sure it's dewaxed. Seal Coat or Zinnser Clear _spray_ is OK. Zinnser Clear _brushable_ contains wax.

Glad to offer it!
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Oughtsix wrote:

It will add a little color, but the dewaxed super blonde will add very little.
BTW, I've tried a swipe coat of clear Watco under the shellac, as some have said the combination "pops" the grain more. My eyes can't tell that the oil has added anything on the cherry/walnut/alder/maple I've tried it on.
-- It's turtles, all the way down
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On Mon, 19 Mar 2007 17:15:53 -0800, Larry Blanchard

The swipe goes under the WB on maple, birch, etc....
Under the shellac, you use more, as now you're looking to add color, say to QSWO...
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wrote:

brushing them on?
I'm not up to spraying just yet still doing this stuff with a brush or those foam brushes, but by spraying you usually end up with a very thin layer(i'm going from experience of spray painting and spraying protective clears on artwork). Even if you spray 2 or 3 coats won't this still be a thinner layer than brushing on 1 layer?
And with the sprayed on layers don't you guys worry that when you sand in between coats that you are taking of a layer completely?
I'm asking all these about spraying simply because the drying time for me between coats of poly is 24 hours. So between stain, finishing, and waxing I'm looking at a week of the piece sitting there doing nothing. Any way to finish a piece in a day? Yes, that's shear ignorance asking.
Thanks for all the help. It's nice to listen to experience for my future learning.
I think the best thing for me to do is what was suggested before, just go buy a piece of wood and a ton of different finishing materials and experiment and label what's what.
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-@-.com wrote:

No, I put almost everything on with a rag or a pad.
-- It's turtles, all the way down
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Visit www.homesteadfinishing.com and buy some dewaxed shellac flakes and use the "Search" utility to lok around. Excellent forum!
On Sat, 24 Mar 2007 19:22:34 -0800, Larry Blanchard

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A one day finish?
Shellac can have a bunch of coats in a day. The question is whether it is a strong enough finish for your use.
Lacquer can sure be done in a day, a couple of times over.
I don't think you want to start here, but do some research on pre/post catalyzed lacquer and on catalyzed varnish and/or conversion varnish. ______________________________ Keep the whole world singing . . . . DanG (remove the sevens) snipped-for-privacy@7cox.net

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