Harbor Fright Down Grades Quality Again

[dadiOH]

How much per hour are the subsidies worth?

[dadiOH]

Are you saying that an increase of $1.00 on $11.99 is 16.1%? If so, YOU need to doublecheck.

[Bill]

You forgot that you only got 28 bags this time instead of 30. I computed the change in the price per bag (not the change in the price per box), which is what we mostly care about. Feel free to double check.

>

[DerbyDad03]

Here we go again with the same ridiculous assertion that consumers are bein g deceived by smaller packages. I'll make this easy for you.

Here's is the definition of "deceive". Do us all a favor and explain to us how a clearly marking a container with the weight of the contents and the p rice fits this definition.

de·ceive d??s?v/ verb

- (of a person) cause (someone) to believe something that is not true, typi cally in order to gain some personal advantage.

- (of a thing) give a mistaken impression.

Don't talk about the legality or the sleaziness of the practice, focus only on the "deception" aspect.

[John Grossbohlin]

The other things that confounds the comparisons is that there are often production methodology changes, or subtle changes to the products that may or may not be noticeable but that do impact the production costs that are reflected in prices being held the same for longer periods of time. Regarding trash bags, for example, that might include a different composition to the material or different features on the bags such as shorter tying ears. We also cannot ignore price changes by competitors, the cost of suitable substitutes, and simple supply and demand (the latter which may be influenced by the product's image as compared to other similar products) as factors too! Yup... its easy to compare!

John

[Bill]

I'm sure any gains achieved by the changes to procedures will be passed along to the consumer too. Thanks! Maybe we should compare the relative EPS?

[John McCoy]

Ed Pawlowski wrote in news: [e-mail]:

Quality is a subjective term - what one person perceives is not what another would. For instance, Bill would probably perceive my prior post as low-quality, because I typed "Bill" where I should have typed "Bob". You might consider it to be of adequate quality, because it conveyed the information it was intended to, irrespective of the name used.

Apropos of the drill press, it's fair for Bob to say it's of lower quality, because it's less fit for his purposes. It's not capable of performing with an accessory that's commonly used with a drill press (to wit, anything with a morse taper). Someone else who doesn't use such accessories would likely say the drill press has adequate quality.

John

[Ed Pawlowski]

Either way, the price is raised. Am I going to use less mayo on a sandwich? No, at the end of the year I'm going to buy the same quantity be it in 4 big bottles or 5 smaller ones. I'm also being forced to pay for that extra package so it is even worse.

How often do you downsize rather than increase the price. Next year it will be 28 ounce jars, then 26, 24, 22 ----soon they will be selling mayo in half ounce packets.

[Ed Pawlowski]

Of course it wasn't the same price. I don't have a problem with that. Everything has gone up, including my wages.

Yes, the weight is clearly on the package, but the purpose of the change is to deceive. You did not answer my question. Do you check every container every time you buy groceries? Every bottle of ketchup, can of soup, jar of mayo? Sure, you will catch it at some point, but it is easy to get snookered one time.

I bought a 6 pack (bottles) of a particular beer I wanted to try. Picked up the carrier, paid, took it home. At the dinner table I took a look and the bottle is only 11.2 ounces. Honestly, would you have thought to check? Beer has been in 12 ounce bottles since I was a kid and now it is 11.2. Sleazy, IMO. No, I did not buy any more of it.

[Ed Pawlowski]

What do you call it? The intent is to reduce the package size and hope the customer does not notice we are making more money. Use all the fancy word you want, but that is the intention.

[John McCoy]

DerbyDad03 wrote in news: [e-mail]:

Seems to clearly fall under that definition. Changing the size from one that's commonly used, and hoping the purchaser doesn't notice. Yes, that's a mistake on the purchaser's part, but that mistake is clearly the intent of the vendor.

John

[Ed Pawlowski]

Food stamps, (SNAP) is $180/month, healthcare is about $500+ based on local plans here for a single. That works out to about $4.37 per hour for 40 hours, 4 weeks. Comes out of our taxes.

[-MIKE-]

Again, how can you deceive someone by clearly labeling exactly how much is in the jar? I'm not aware of any law requiring mayonnaise makers to sell it in quart jars.

There's only so much we can do to protect the stupid from themselves.

[DerbyDad03]

being deceived by smaller packages. I'll make this easy for you.

us how a clearly marking a container with the weight of the contents and t he price fits this definition.

typically in order to gain some personal advantage.

only on the "deception" aspect.

How I wish you were kidding me, but I'm pretty sure you are not, and that i s sad.

They "hope" the customer does not notice?

How long as this practice been going on? How many articles, TV stories, int ernet blogs, usenet groups, etc. have covered this issue? Do you honestly t hink that the companies marketing the smaller packages are sitting around " hoping" the consumer doesn't notice?

I can just picture those board room strategy meetings. "Shh...don't tell a nybody, but we're going to reduce the mayonnaise package size again, label it correctly but not lower the price. Those idiot shoppers will never notic e. Heck they haven't noticed it yet. We haven't heard a word about it, so w e're good to go. 30 oz this week, 28 oz next week. Eventually, all we'll ev er need to ship is those little squeeze packages. Gawd, those consumers are such idiots."

The "intention" may be to make more money but it is not to *deceive* the bu ying public. I don't know how many different ways it can be said, but if a consumer is "deceived" by a clearly labeled package, then they are the ones at fault, not the company selling the product.

[-MIKE-]

You're not being *forced* to do $h!t. Go to Costco or Sam's Club and buy it in a 50 gallon drum if you eat that much. I think I saw a 72oz container at Kroger last time I was there.

While you're at it, take a look at what people in developing nations have to do to simply survive every day before bitching so much about what size jar your mayo comes in. :-p

[-MIKE-]

You know something, even IF it could be proven there was clear *intent* to deceive, like they found emails back and forth in the company saying that, a judge would laughingly throw the case out because there was absolutely NO deception.

Not everyone is so brainwashed and mind-numb that they never again look at the package contents of a product after having done so once back in

1957.

Check that label again. I'd bet you a dollar it was bottled in the UK or Canada. Aren't you a fan of the metric system? Because that's what's to blame for that. 11.2oz is 330ml, which rounds of to 1/3 of a liter.

Once again, no one's trying to deceive you. I'm not aware of any US breweries making the switch yet. But it wouldn't surprise me in the least, since all of the "Big 3" US beer manufacturers are now foreign owned companies.

[Larry Blanchard]

Same here. My first full time job in 1955 paid $47 a week. That's equal to $412 a week now. That's $10.30 an hour. Washington has the highest minimum wage in the country and it's only $9.47.

Our state had a minimum wage increase a few years ago and the usual suspects - restaurant owners - were frothing at the mouth about the dire consequences. I talked to a couple of managers I knew and got their staffing and meals served statistics. Turned out the "catastrophic" increase amounted to about ten cents per meal served!

In todays paper, I see the Republicans are once again wanting to remove the estate tax for the top 0.2% of estates those with over 10 million dollars for a couple. 5 million for one person. But they hate a minimum wage increase.

I wonder how many of the righteous right on this news group get Social Security and Medicare while they castigate big government?

[Lew Hodgett]

--------------------------------------------------------- Check out a book by James F Lincoln called "Incentive Management".

Written in the 1930's, describes management practices used by Lincoln Electric to be completive and still be profitable.

One of Lincoln's basic theorems involved cost savings.

Any cost savings derived from a process improvement was to be shared

3 ways. 1/3 to the customer, 1/3 to the employees and 1/3 to the company.

Lincoln's annual Christmas bonus program was infamous for it's secrecy but bonus amounts greater than one's annual salary were reported.

The point is that the customer shared the wealth of cost reductions.

Lew

[Ed Pawlowski]

But they did get away with it for a long time. It did take a while for people to notice.

[Ed Pawlowski]

I'm still working (20% retired) and collect SS and have Medicare and a supplement. I paid into it and I'm taking it. My healthcare coverage has never been better. The SS right now is just fun money.