Grumpy: TS Still Burning

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Nope.
wrote:

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I thought about that answer... and I don't know how that could be... The blade would cut a new slot no matter what alignment.... The piece being cut would be out of square... but the sled should have no effect.
Now are you possibly moving too slowly trying to eliminate chipout/tearout... This could explain the burning. You must move at a reasonable rate... the blade not being in alignment will cause a certain amount of burn, but .002 is not going to burn noticeably...
Oldhams have not received high marks in tests.... Try a better blade if all else fails. WWII is a great general purpose blade. I believe Forrest sells a laminate blade. I think freud blades do much better than Oldham.....
toller wrote:

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Woodchuck: not offended, but yes the blade is installed with the teeth facing towards the front of the saw. What's DAMHIKT?
Brid...: the fence is perfectly straight and rigid.
Leon says, <Then I suspect that you sled is not tracking parallel to the­ blade.> The sled is tracking parallel to the miter slot within 0.001. Are you thinking that the fence is not truly 90 degrees to the saw blade?
Leon says, <Or better suited. I use a 40 tooth WWII for "Everything" I­ threw my 100+ tooth blades away after using the Forrest.> I called Oldham customer service. They said that this blade is not specifically designed for cutting melamine. They have a specialty blade with 80 teeth and a negative 10 degree hook angle ATB tooth. She said to try cutting a plywood panel, and if it doesn't burn then it is just the blade is not compatible with this material. I asked if the .002 runout could cause the burning and she didn't know what the specs on the blade were.
Is it possible that 0.002 runout could cause burning?
Thanks very much for all your replies, much appreciated.
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Is it possible that 0.002 runout could cause burning?
Not likely. One more question. Is this a carbide tooth blade that we are talking about? I know some plywood blades are plain steel and the clearance between the kerf and the side of the blade will cause burning. Sometimes the side of these blades near the middle is actually wider than the kerf.
Thanks very much for all your replies, much appreciated.
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Sorry I see that it is indeed carbide.
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DAMHIKT = Don't Ask Me How I Know This
-- Regards, Doug Miller (alphageek-at-milmac-dot-com)
Get a copy of my NEW AND IMPROVED TrollFilter for NewsProxy/Nfilter by sending email to autoresponder at filterinfo-at-milmac-dot-com You must use your REAL email address to get a response.
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Mr Fixit eh wrote:

teeth
DAMHIKT = "Don't Ask Me How I Know That"
I almost started a bon fire once.
I haven't used Oldham's saw blades, but I had a couple of close runins with their router bits and I'm no rookie when it comes to routing.
Chuck
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Won't matter.

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There are things you can do. First, the end of the fence (past the blade) should be 5 to 10 thousands further away from the blade than the front side. Second, the gullets on the blade are probably not deep enough to carry away the chips, Third, use a splitter. My splitter is a piece of brass plate the thickness of the kerf. The splitter is adjusted (by bending) to push the wood against the fence. I would also try a faster feed rate. max

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I've had similiar problems at work with a similiar blade. I ended up putting the old blade back on and the problem disappeared. Hopefully it'll cure you problem too --dave

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That is really just a band aid to hide a problem. It helps the keeper side stay cleaner but the waste side begins to hit the back side of the blade and it too may show tooth marks or burn. If you plan to use the waste side little has actually been gained. Better to set everything up correctly in the first place. You run your miter gauge parallel to the blade, your fence should also be parallel to the blade also.
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What do you mean "cuts w/o the crosscut sled"? Were you ripping or crosscutting with a miter gauge?
Does your TS have alot of vibration and are you using a blade stiffener?
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Are you sure it's not just a dirty blade? Last few times I had that problem a thorough blade cleaning got rid of the burning.
I was using an 80 tooth blade on some plywood. Blade was dirty - bad burning. Cleaned the blade - still some burning.
Looked at notes that came with blade. Noticed it was marked as "good" for plywood.
Looked through my TS blade collections. Found a 50 tooth blade marked "excellent" for plywood. Tried it - touch of burning. Cleaned dirt on blade - no more burning. (I left the dirt for the test cut simply to see if the dirt was an independent issue.)
Moral right blade, clean blade.
Fence is off a touch - does not appear to affect most cuts.
Mr Fixit eh wrote:

--
Will
Occasional Techno-geek
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wrote:
snip

How sharp is the blade? Can you make a grove in your fingernail using the edge of the blade? If not, you'll need to sharpen the blade.
Couldn't be that simple, though.
Thunder
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Great thread! Thanks for all the great replies. I was just re-reading all the comments and thought I'd make the following comments:
Sadly, it is a new-to-me saw, so there's no warranty.
There is no vibration when the saw is running with any blade. I am using the arbor nut and washer only, I'm not using a blade stiffener.
The blade is sharp and spankin' clean.
Trouble with re-adjusting the blade alignment to average out the error, then cuts using any jig that relies on just one miter slot will suffer from burning or chiping, right?
Would there be any way for me to re-machine the wayward miter slot, or would I have to take the top to a machine-shop? If I have to take it to a shop, what would I be asking for (so I don't sound too stupid)? What sort of cost would I be looking at?
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Ok, this is a little embarassing.....
I was curious how the two miter slots could be that much out of alignment on a Delta cabinet saw, so I spent some more 'quality' time with my saw. The miter slots ARE parallel to each other within .002". I used a 4" wide piece of melamine-faced particleboard that fit snugly in the miter slot, checked to make sure the piece was at 90 degrees to the tabletop, then clamped the dial indicator-on-a-stick to the miter gauge. Then I switched sides just as a double-check.
So now I'm really scratching my head. I go back and check the alignment of the blade to the right-side miter slot, and guess what--it is now out of alignment by nearly 0.011". I had run about 30 cuts since I adjusted the blade alignment, and I guess the trunnion has shifted. Either that, or I'm truly going crazy! Now it does make sense that the latest cuts were producing much more burning and starting to see some visible smoke.
So now I'm thinking that it's not the crosscut sled's fault at all, but still the nasty blade alignment.
I wonder if I'll ever get to the point where I'm spending more time cutting than adjusting the saw.
Growl.
Mr Fixit eh
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I hope this doesn't double-post. The site seems to be having trouble posting today.
Mr Fixit eh
Mr Fixit eh Feb 8, 9:20 am show options
Newsgroups: rec.woodworking
Date: 8 Feb 2005 09:20:09 -0800 Local: Tues, Feb 8 2005 9:20 am Subject: Re: Grumpy: TS Still Burning Reply | Reply to Author | Forward | Print | Individual Message | Show original | Remove | Report Abuse
Ok, this is a little embarassing.....
I was curious how the two miter slots could be that much out of alignment on a Delta cabinet saw, so I spent some more 'quality' time with my saw. The miter slots ARE parallel to each other within .002". I used a 4" wide piece of melamine-faced particleboard that fit snugly
in the miter slot, checked to make sure the piece was at 90 degrees to the tabletop, then clamped the dial indicator-on-a-stick to the miter gauge. Then I switched sides just as a double-check.
So now I'm really scratching my head. I go back and check the alignment of the blade to the right-side miter slot, and guess what--it
is now out of alignment by nearly 0.011". I had run about 30 cuts since I adjusted the blade alignment, and I guess the trunnion has shifted. Either that, or I'm truly going crazy! Now it does make sense that the latest cuts were producing much more burning and starting to see some visible smoke.
So now I'm thinking that it's not the crosscut sled's fault at all, but
still the nasty blade alignment.
I wonder if I'll ever get to the point where I'm spending more time cutting than adjusting the saw.
Growl.
Mr Fixit eh
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Grumpy,
If the addy is good, I can send you a couple of posts that I made back in 2000 when I had a Delta CS and what I did to fix several problems. Part of the alignment procedures are not in the Delta manuals (at the time) and the rest was from me tweaking things to make the alignment easier. Even though I list specific model numbers - these are generic type procedures that will work as long as your CS has two tie-bars between the front and rear trunnions.
I know few will believe it but after making the minor changes/fixes and following the Delta procedures, I could do a complete alignment in about 15 minutes without resorting to and 2x4's, big hammers or any of those 3rd party Alignment Pals and have it to within 1 thou.
They should also be available by doing a Google in rec.woodworking also. Do a search on:
1. Delta Blade Alignment Procedures - Contractors saw models 34-444 and 34-445Z 2. Follow-up to Delta Blade Alignment Procedures
Bob S.

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BobS wrote:
" .... I could do a complete alignment in about 15 minutes without resorting to and 2x4's, big hammers or any of those 3rd party Alignment Pals and have it to within 1 thou."
Just wondering what measurement method you used.
Ray
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I used a TS Aligner Jr.
Bob S.

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